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Great article, Murph!

"a) Tell the story in incredible detail. Describe every day of the journey, how far they walked, what they ate, the weather, where they slept, especially days where nothing happens."

Man, if that doesn't describe Donaldson...

Actually Jason, that doesn't describe Donaldson. You need to add a line about the main character castigating himself and being absolutely freaking miserable, and you have Donaldson.

But Donaldson is still so much better than the hackneyed fantasy crap that article is rightly making fun of....

-Andrew

I gotta admit, I loved the first 3 Lord Foul's Bane books. Of course I was only about 12, and it didn't dawn on me what that rapist did until about 5 years later. I liked the second one the best as I recall, something Helm's Deepish about it.

Another set of books from that time were the River World books. I absolutely loved those, again as a 12-13 year old. I liked Mark Twain, and the explorer Richard Burton, the real Alice, and the caveman (Jim Miller or something they called him). Did anyone else read/enjoy these? If there was ever gonna be a place...

I got about halfway through that first Lord Foul book, got bogged down in all that detail, took it back to the library, and flipped to the end of the third book. At which point I thought to myself that if Covenant was as incredulous all that why didn't he start laughing at Lord Foul the moment he first landed in his cave and he could have saved everybody about 3,000 pages. ;)

As proof that you don't need all that slavish detail to create a rich fantasy world, I'd point to Roger Zelazny's Amber series. Any one book in that series probably isn't the length of a single Donaldson chapter, but they never seemd skimpy to me.

I was a big fan of Farmer's Riverworld series. What I loved about that was the interaction between the characters, especially Twain and King John.

Well Jason Levine8, if that is your real name, I disagree and feel you should have stuck with it. The 1st Chronicles are great, the second are even better, and by far among the least cliched of fantasy series.

Call me a Donaldson apologist, but they work even better when you're not 12 (Rob) and better still when you get past the first half of Book One. (Though that rape is heinous - it's meant to be. And I know a lot of people who stopped there.)
-Andrew

Rob, I enjoyed the first few Riverworld books, but the series ran out of gas for me.

Hated Donaldson, though. Read the first one and really got sick of the protagonist. I just had no desire to read more.

Love Donaldson. One of the best contemporary fantasy authors out there. Sci fi too, for that matter (the Gap series rocks). But by far the best of his stories is Mordant's Need (The Mirror of Her Dreams and A Man Rides Through). A wonderfully original world, great story, great characters.

That's the main reason why I like Donaldson--he writes interesting, complicated characters. He doesn't always make his heroes easy to like, or his villains easy to hate. Thomas Covenant is kind of an extreme in that regard, of course, and a lot of people find the book difficult to like for that reason. Personally, I though the Land was all the more wonderous seen through the eyes of a man twisted by his own bitterness and self-loathing.

All right Ben!
I've posted here and there many times in praise of the Gap series (Brian Reynolds is a fan as well, btw, or so he told me), and recieved only silence in return.

Donaldson, if I recall correctly, spent part of his childhood in India while his father worked at a Leper colony. I suspect this experience colored his world.

Mordant's Need is a good series, much lighter fare than the other stuff actually, which is why it's so popular. It's probably his most "regular" fantasy books he's written as well. Interesting stuff, but it stuck with me less than his sci-fi and the Covenant stuff.

The Covenant stuff gets better as you go through. The protagonist is awful, but in a sympathetic way, imo, but the supporting cast is so likable and wonderful. The Giants, Elena, Mohram (?), and especially those Haruchai (who are so like Spock-ninjas).

Still, what happens to the aptly named Morn and the wonderfully named Angus Thermopyle in the Gap series is really hard to take at times, but the Amnioni are easily the most frighteningly alien aliens I've ever read about.

Wish he'd write something else...
-Andrew

Yes I have to agree with those who enjoy Donaldson's work. Covenant is an extremely interesting character and definitely not the cliched "hero saves the world" type.

I find current fantasy series books becoming encyclopedic mind-numbingly boring. I am sure some authors never intend to finish their series simply so they can continue to rake in the profits.

As an example did William R. Forstchen *EVER* finish The Lost Regiment series ? The first two books started off brilliantly but after that it became an exercise in tedium.

Even worse is Patrick Tilley's "Amtrak Wars". This also started brilliantly but lost steam after Book 2.

There should be a law that confines authors to no more than three books in a series to maintain focus and interest.

"I find current fantasy series books becoming encyclopedic mind-numbingly boring. I am sure some authors never intend to finish their series simply so they can continue to rake in the profits."

Heh... uhm... [cough]... Robert Jordan? Seriously, I really liked the Wheel of Time books at the start. Nothing groundbreaking, but fun to read. Lately they have started to draaaaaaaaaag, though.

Bub: have you picked up Donaldson's collection of short stories, Reave the Just? I highly recommend it--good stuff in there, including a "missing" chapter from the Chronicles of Thomas Covenant.

It kinda bothers me that so many fantasy writers churn out formulaic crap these days. But it makes me treasure the good books all the more...

Jordan's a hack. His treatment of his female characters is particularly unforgivable; I couldn't manage to slag through more than the first book of the series.

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Quote:

Heh... uhm... [cough]... Robert Jordan? Seriously, I really liked the Wheel of Time books at the start. Nothing groundbreaking, but fun to read. Lately they have started to draaaaaaaaaag, though.

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"Bub: have you picked up Donaldson's collection of short stories, Reave the Just? I highly recommend it--good stuff in there, including a "missing" chapter from the Chronicles of Thomas Covenant."

Hmmm, no. Interesting, while looking for it I found this: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0765302020/qid=1006188915/sr=2-1/ref=sr_2_11_1/104-0172849-4442330

A mystery series. It appears Donaldson has been writing a mystery series under a pseudonym. This is book four. Reed Stephens, indeed!

Anyway, thanks for the tip Ben... that "lost chapter" is called Gilden Fire, right? If so, I got it seperately.

-Andrew

I loved the Chronicles of Thomas Covanent. Read them when I was young (7th and 8th grade) but they left a lasting impression. Our DAOC guild is called Blood Guard although I doubt anyone other than me knows it was taken from those books (And I know it is Bloodguard all one word but it made more sense to the people in the guild the other way).

Also I ran across this the other day it is pretty funny if you know Donaldson and Jordan: Thomas Covanent Humor.

"that "lost chapter" is called Gilden Fire, right? If so, I got it seperately."

It is, but actually the rest of the stories are mostly better (and thus my recommendation still stands). I liked Gilden Fire, but after reading it, I can see why he cut it out of the book.