Defense Grid 2 Kickstarter

[Razgon]

Meh, didn't like it a lot.

Ah - so just talking without really knowing anything about it. Got it!

[Razgon]

Interesting tidbit of info from over at GT about the game and how the developers have tried the past few years to move it forward.

dden Path Entertainment, AMD & Razer about 14 hours ago wrote:
Hi Adam, understand your skepticism based on things I read as well, but we're being completely up-front with you. First of all, Resurgence cost about $200,000 to develop and You Monster cost about $300,000 to develop, so DG:Containment at $250,000 is a pretty accurate estimation of what it will cost. AMD and Razer, remember aren't contributing any money, they're promoting the kickstarter, providing pledge rewards, and working with us on the new engine to make sure we support some of their existing and upcoming technologies – they’re providing technical support on technology integration, but they aren’t paying for any development of the game. We're being extremely efficient this time around not only building Containment in the first $250,000 but also making progress on the DG2 engine during that time.

As for your second question about "could we honestly not get funding" it pains me to hear that, not because I don't agree with you, that it should be "obvious" that someone would pick it up, but honestly over 20 publishers have expressed interest over the last 3 years and we did literally a hundred or more presentations and meetings, and term sheets, and everything, and in the end, not one publisher went forward. They were always excited at first, they were always eager and liked the idea of working with us, and they always decided not to move forward when they did their market analysis saying "it wouldn't be profitable enough, for them to choose to work on it" - they needed higher profits than they could forecast based on what we would earn for the game for them to decide to do it.

I'm sorry you think we have another choice - we don't. We really want to make DG2, but I'm pretty sure we have exhausted every other possibility over the last 3 years in trying to get this game made.

While I understand and share the sceptism of the model of Kickstarter, I still say its a very valid way forward for developers to bypass publishers who "needs bigger profit forecasts" - In my mind, those big kinds of publishers needs to die out, so we can get back to enjoying the hobby without a spreadsheet determining what games we get to play.

[pyrhic]

I really like DG, but the stretch goal really just turned me off. Even the short term goal, the way the lines read to me is 'this is the minimum i'll do this for' as opposed to 'this is what it'll cost' and there's a subtle difference there. IIRC, they were a little bitter about the sales of the game too....

I dunno, something feels off here - I'll stand on the sidelines on this one.

[lordkosc]

I am in the 55$ tier, but if they don't hit a million I'll be backing out.

I'd be much happier if they would have gone in this order of goals...

DG2 > Containment > New game Engine / Multiplayer > Level Editor, ect.

The current engine still looks mighty fine imho.

[sharaleo]

AMD and Razer, remember aren't contributing any money, they're promoting the kickstarter, providing pledge rewards, and working with us on the new engine to make sure we support some of their existing and upcoming technologies – they’re providing technical support on technology integration, but they aren’t paying for any development of the game.

So your big names are doing precisely fuck all. Fluff, fluff, fluff, fluff, fluff...

[Razgon]

So your big names are doing precisely fuck all. Fluff, fluff, fluff, fluff, fluff...

What on earth is this? Do you hate them? Do they deserve this? Or are you just angry at them for some reason?

[DennyA]

So your big names are doing precisely fuck all. Fluff, fluff, fluff, fluff, fluff...

Oh, God, stop with the gamerrage. They're sponsors, and they've donated some of the perks for contributors.

[mtkafka]

Two years ago DG was pretty damn awesome... but ever since then, and playing every damn tower defense I could play (even on ios and android), DG is pretty much a relic imo. You don't even need to 'pay' for a really good TD game anymore, there's tons on Kongregate and the like.

[pilonv1]

Two years ago DG was pretty damn awesome... but ever since then, and playing every damn tower defense I could play (even on ios and android), DG is pretty much a relic imo. You don't even need to 'pay' for a really good TD game anymore, there's tons on Kongregate and the like.

I found it the other way round, after every new TD game I'd find myself going back to Defense Grid. There's just a charm about it that I've not found elsewhere.

[Tin Wisdom]

I've got to agree: DG pushes almost all of the Tower Defense buttons.

You've got the ability to do "open field" TD (e.g., Fieldrunners") or "fixed path" TD (e.g., Kingdom Rush), or a mix of both. You've got a nice mix of well-balanced towers. You've got a crap-load of alternate modes and achievements. Plus great graphics and a vaguely interesting story-line.

Honestly, the only weakness I can point to is that it's not running on an iPad.

[TurinTur]

Ah - so just talking without really knowing anything about it. Got it!

Stop trolling Razgon.

[Razgon]

Stop trolling Razgon.

I wish :-(

[mtkafka]

I've got to agree: DG pushes almost all of the Tower Defense buttons.

You've got the ability to do "open field" TD (e.g., Fieldrunners") or "fixed path" TD (e.g., Kingdom Rush), or a mix of both. You've got a nice mix of well-balanced towers. You've got a crap-load of alternate modes and achievements. Plus great graphics and a vaguely interesting story-line.

Honestly, the only weakness I can point to is that it's not running on an iPad.

Yeah, DG is great that it does a little of everything, but it still doesnt do the RPG aspect that I like in some of the flash TD's I've tried. Theres the Gem TD games on Kongregate I played a TON of last year, and then that indie RPG Defenders Quest.

But I think the best part of DG is it does have the levels for replayability. Plus the graphics are still tops.

Add a mix of rpg like Defenders Quest for DGII and I'll 'donate' to the Kickstarter!

[JPR]

In the most recent video update, they clarified something that you guys will be interested in: if they raise more than what's required to meet their funding goal but less than what's required to Kickstart DG2, all those who would have been entitled to DG2 through the Kickstarter will still receive DG2 for free upon release (assuming, of course, they line up some other kind of funding). They said that if they meet their $1M goal, they would expect release of DG2 around Summer 2013, but if they don't meet that goal, the game will still be funded somehow, it will just come out later.

Anyway. They were basically saying, don't hold off supporting us because you think we might not make our $1M stretch goal -- you'll still get the rewards as if we did, they will just be later.

[RepoMan]

I upped to the $80 level because DAMMIT I WANT THIS TO WORK. Incremental funding and creative uses of Kickstarter FTMFW. Especially when it's for a product that I know these motherfuckers can deliver.

[Derek French]

Bump time. This needs more visibility.

They are just over half way there, with 14 days to go.

I really want this game to happen. My son and I really love it.

[RepoMan]

Agreed completely. I hope people will reconsider their concerns around the funding plan they're using. Reading the reddit makes it really clear that these guys are genuine, and that they were striking the best compromise they could between going for $1M and possibly (probably) failing, or going for a more reasonable goal that would get them closer.

[Pogue Mahone]

I'm on the fence about this one and for no really good reason. I would love a sequel but am not very interested in still more DLC, in fact I haven't played the Portal-themed DLC completely yet. I would jump right in if they would consider skipping directly to DG2.

[DennyA]

I'm on the fence about this one and for no really good reason. I would love a sequel but am not very interested in still more DLC, in fact I haven't played the Portal-themed DLC completely yet. I would jump right in if they would consider skipping directly to DG2.

Keep in mind that if you support it, you will eventually get DG2. It's just that making their goal will get it to you faster.

From their project update page:

Also, to be very clear: as mentioned in the FAQ and in the video - if you're a backer, you're going to get DG2 someday. If we raise all the needed money now, we know that will be sometime next year. If we raise a portion of the money now, you'll still get DG2 when we make it, we just don't know exactly when that will be.

[Otagan]

That's entirely too much of a gamble for me to put money down on it, even though I love Defense Grid. I only want the sequel and am not exactly comfortable taking their word that it'll come out someday in the far future.

Of course, it likely will come out some day and I'll end up eating my own hat, but it's not good enough to get any money out of me today. I'll just pay full price in the event that it does see the light of day at some indeterminate point in the future.

[Derek French]

I'm on the fence about this one and for no really good reason. I would love a sequel but am not very interested in still more DLC, in fact I haven't played the Portal-themed DLC completely yet. I would jump right in if they would consider skipping directly to DG2.

The Portal-themed one is really fun. GlaDOS basically takes over the DG play and then starts messing with the DG rules and environment in later levels. And the voice... oh, it haunts you.

That's entirely too much of a gamble for me to put money down on it, even though I love Defense Grid. I only want the sequel and am not exactly comfortable taking their word that it'll come out someday in the far future.

Of course, it likely will come out some day and I'll end up eating my own hat, but it's not good enough to get any money out of me today. I'll just pay full price in the event that it does see the light of day at some indeterminate point in the future.

Yeah, I think it is more of an unfortunate layout and presentation with their Kickstarter.

12 days to go.

[Timsfker]

It got over the 250k line with 3 days to go..

I feel sorry for these guys, I feel that if they didn't screw up launch day by making it appear as if you will not get defense grid 2 with your backing if they don't reach $1 million, then they would have done alot better than they did. They have put alot of effort in to explain, update, and promote the kickstarter since then but it was too late to get many people back (in my view).

[Tman]

Well, at least us backers know that when they finish DG2, we'll get it for free!

I do agree with your prognosis - the should have had something like:

$500K - DG2
$750K - Level Editor
$1M - Coop

But I'm happy, it would have been disastrous if they didn't reach the $250K level - and it was looking like that was in jeopardy just a few weeks ago.

[Brad Grenz]

Definitely a weird one. People didn't want to support them because they assumed they should be fat with CS:GO money from Valve. Making DG2 a stretch goal was weird. And they had some strong corporate support from Razer and AMD. They basically got free hardware they were using as rewards well below retail, but they still couldn't get traction. Too bad, cause Defense Grid is amazing.

[Murbella]

I must admit, that while i liked the first game, i don't think it is worth $15 for a mini expansion and i don't feel too confident about supporting what is essentially a kickstarter for a kickstarter.

Still, i might end up supporting it.

[lordkosc]

Containment is out on 1/23

http://www.pcgamer.com/2013/01/16/de...d-containment/

Also the latest email I got, said they are 1/2 funded towards Defense Grid 2, so if it does ever get made, people who pledged for the Containment expansion will get DG2 free.

What is happening with DG2? Will you make it? Will I get a copy? When will it be done?

DG2 is a game that we have about half the money to make right now and are we are still short the amount needed to ensure completion. We are working hard to raise the remaining amount of money and we believe shipping Containment has helped demonstrate that we can deliver on our promises, so that's helping in the discussions. We've had some very good discussions and hopefully we'll have some good news to announce to you one of these days. Once we have locked down all the needed financing for the development, we'll move forward with a team of folks on a schedule that will likely last us a year of development. So once the money is set, it will take just about a year to complete the project and then get ready to ship it. As we have promised to you earlier, when we are able to make DG2, yes, you'll get a copy of that too. We greatly appreciate your backing and we're happy to include you on our road to making DG2 and in shipping that game as well. For now, though, we are excited to be able to send you Defense Grid: Containment as that is what the Kickstarter was able to directly fund.

[Rock8man]

Yeah, I installed Containment when they sent me the email that it was final (I had to dig around my old emails for about 20 minutes in order to finally find the beta key they sent), I installed it right away, but I haven't actually loaded it up. Too risky with the wife home for a 3 day weekend. Hopefully I'll try it on Tuesday.

[lordkosc]

I'll give it a try this weekend, I really enjoyed DG, never bothered with any of the DLC even thought I have it all now due to cheap steam sales.

[Rock8man]

I couldn't resist taking a quick look. Holy moly! The new campaign starts off super tough. It's nice to hear new voice acting for the new campaign too. That first map is going to be really tough to beat. This is Defense Grid for veteran players for sure.

[Murbella]

I couldn't resist taking a quick look. Holy moly! The new campaign starts off super tough. It's nice to hear new voice acting for the new campaign too. That first map is going to be really tough to beat. This is Defense Grid for veteran players for sure.

Agreed.

I'm pretty rusty and i made a few mistakes because i was thinking of other tower defenses where if you block off one lane, it will go through it, but the first couple missions have been HARD.

Liking it so far.