I have no insight into this particular game, but I've seen a general tendency that players on QT3 are far too quick to throw in the towel. They'll often turtle and play a fairly passive game for a long time, even to the point of mentally writing their chances of winning off. Then when forced into action, by someone appearing to be on the verge of winning, it's easiest to just pack up your toys (perhaps after a token effort). Rather than the alternative, which would be starting to put a lot of time into your turns, coordinating with your allies and just doing all you can to take down the leader. A couple of the games I've won have gone down like that, with everyone collectively giving up because the leader put up an impressive show of force.
The best thing of course would be to avoid getting yourself into that position by playing aggressively and making your bid for victory earlier. Just keep reminding yourself that if you do not have a big lead already, and are not making plans for war in the near future, you are in fact playing to lose.
Last edited by Scribble; 04-24-2012 at 01:59 AM.
While I don't share Austen's conviction that he should have carried the battle for his cap, I don't feel like having won the game either. Owning two out of seven capitals is hardly conclusive.
This is the first time I'm in a position like this in a Dom3 game, and I'd love to see how the rest of my planning turns out.
Shall we define a victory condition? Four caps?
Half of caps +1 is usually a good VP condition. Or just Half caps. I personally prefer hold 3 turns too since there is always a chance of a air drop capture. It's slim but makes folks maintain a garrison instead of just a rush.
His province count is a bit deceiving because he is being raided.Originally Posted by Scribble
With Arco he put down Pangea. He put me down. There are three other nations left. The obvious contender (arco) lost it's original player and has been taken over by a player who admits this is his first end game and just lost his capitol. My scouts have seen him win against point defense, but he has not won a significant battle. (That's not meant as commentary against Austen. Just what I see.)
Neither of the other two players show any sign of trying to hit either the two leaders. I just don't see the point of forcing tenuki to put in 2 hour turns if the rest of the world isn't going to push him.
Now, maybe somebody is sitting on a pile of healed tarts and is just waiting for some reason to use them, but if that person exists they are being extremely cagey.
Obviously the rest of the players feel differently and I'll be glad to shut my yap and continue to submit turns and be a good host.
So you're saying only Austen and tenuki are actually fighting? Seems a bit weird to say the least if the other major players aren't even trying to take him down, while being open to conceding to him.
There are 7 capitols. If the other players are agreeable, holding 4 sounds like a reasonable victory condition to me.
That being the case, somebody not named dfs probably needs to decide what to do with the vassalized Jomon. Am I considered a full player again or part of Gath?
If Jomon is considered part of Gath, then Gath holds Gath, Joman, Arco and needs to break Arco to get Pangea's capitol for the win.
Your call guys.
My scouting network is not complete but neither evil steve as TC or Pyrhic as Patala have intentionally engaged in combat with Arco or Gath for....well, for the entire game.
Their objections about declaring the game above do not seem to be based on their own chances of winning, but on doubt about the prosecution of the Gath/Arco war.
Jomon "surrendered" to Gath several turns ago after several defeats when the rest of the world was more interested in dogpiling on Jomon than on resisting Gath. Without Gath support, I've been able to defend much of my territory and will hopefully be able to take some of it back soon.
I guess I should butt out of this since I'm not even in the game, but the whole diplomacy scene here seems really strange to me. Are Patala and T'ien Ch'i just watching the Arco-Gath war and waiting to see if Gath comes out on top so they can concede to him? Why not throw everything they've got at Gath and see what happens - you know, try to change the outcome of the game?
The whole thing about Jomon being a "vassal" of Gath is also downright weird. Why would you want to play on like that? If you'd fight to the end Gath would at least have to divert resources in order to put you down. Now it seems you're just enabling a Gath victory by letting him take your capital at his leisure and fighting other players for him, effectively.
The reasons to prefer no-diplomacy games keep piling up. :)
Maybe there has been a misunderstanding, but I've never seen Jomon as a vassal of mine. In turn 61 I needed to turn around to deal with Arco, while dfs had his hands full keeping the vultures at bay after the battles with me. The way I see it, it simply didn't make sense for either of us to continue fighting the other at the time. No oaths of fealty were sworn.
So, dfs, if you want to cobble together another anti-Gath alliance, I won't hold it against you.
Also, thank you very much for urging the others to make a decision. Those two-hour turns would indeed be a waste if there were nobody left to fight.
Last edited by tenuki; 04-24-2012 at 07:58 AM.
I think dfs is mainly fighting to survive, not to help me. However, I seem to remember a game called Foss where a certain player of TC benefited from exactly the type of relationship you've just described.
Up until the "so they can concede to him" part I can answer yes. In honesty, I do not understand their motives.
Ask them.
At the time the arrangement was made both TC and Arco had taken the rest of Jomon and my capitol was under siege by an Arco force larger than anything I had. Peace with Gath was arranged so I could punish the rest of the world for dogpiling on me instead of attacking the obvious leader.
Not having played in a no-diplo game, I can't say. I think clear victory conditions would have solved most of the problems.
I will do my best. Down with Gath!
Yeah I definitely benefited from Matt not really playing to win in that game. Couldn't exactly force him to fight me though, I had enough on my plate. I'm not blaming you in any way, the whole "vassalage" thing just seemed strange to me.
Then again, maybe Patty and TC's interests are best served if they first capitalize on Arco's current condition as a rotten corpse inflated to gigantic proportions, its poor semblance of life provided by limbs flapping weakly in the wind.
I'm starting to get superstitious about checking llamaserver scores. Whenever I check the scores before I've seen my turn, I'm always disappointed. If I wait, I generally end up with good news. Llama scores are cursed!
This reminds me, before the RAND game starts I'd like to plead with players to please not just go AI when the going first gets rough. It's really sad when the main way to gain territory is just waiting to swoop in landgrabs triggered by AIing.
Hear hear. I play to the death, and you should too. Just ask pyrhic.
I'm guessing this is a glitch:
WORST HERO EVER
Urbon the Insignificant!
Well, frankly, Patala has been in a fight since the start of the game until about turn 54. Since that time, i've been trying to restore some semblance of a fighting force and regain lost ground in terms of research, gems, artifacts, etc. Only with the proper spells, summons, artifacts and items can I be effective, and only now do I think i'm even close to there.
Yeah, that's not been much of a problem in the QT3 games lately. I always emphasize in games I admin that players should only go AI in one of two circumstances:
- They have no fighting material left that could conceivably inflict damage to the enemy, OR
- By agreement with me, after we have tried and failed to find a substitute for the position.
Upcoming game
I guess QT3Anonymous is as good a name as any.
I'm thinking of using the map that is called Broken Kingdom. Download link: http://z7.invisionfree.com/Dom3mods/...?showtopic=449
Another map that is a possibility is Realm of Many Tomatoes: http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showp...3&postcount=13
Shadowshore was suggested, but at 120 land provinces it is too big. If noone has any definite preferences, I will just choose one of the above maps.
Game should start next week
Can I ask for a 24 hour extension, please?
Done.
Thank you. :)
How about Threenymous?
Or, QuarterToRand?
Or, QuarterToMute?
Or, QuadOfReticence?
I could keep going :)
Or, NoOnes25Cents?
On maps, fine by me. I like wraps though.
I'll vote for Broken Kingdom. I really don't like tomatoes.
Ketchup, though: yummy!
You just gotta love the Hall of Fame.
Names:
Who's who? - Legends&Losers
ANDy
Keep it shut, douchebag
Borked Empire (but only if we use the Broken Kingdom map)
Map:
I would like to re-mention Land of Ethereal Squirrels. If that one's out, see above for my vote.
Land of Ethereal Squirrels does look nice, and it has a land wraparound. What say you, Scribble?
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
