I'm not sure elementalist will be all that popular. It looks incredibly complex. 20 abilities per weapon set is crazy.
I'm not sure elementalist will be all that popular. It looks incredibly complex. 20 abilities per weapon set is crazy.
This blog posted yesterday covers some of those details.
You make the choice during beta and can change it once (I'd be very surprised if this carried over to release since characters will be wiped) during the beta. After release you can change servers for a small fee and with a 7-day waiting period.
Oh, absolutely. I doubt any of these classes will suffer for numbers. It's just that judging by the various videos, the barrier to entry on the Elementalist might be a bit high. There's a *lot* of skills to keep track of...
Then again, GW1 vets will probably have no problem with it.
It's funny to read the thread for excited people who have been paying attention and to find that, even here, people haven't quite grasped the idea that class choice has little to do with survivability or damage dealing.
Certainly there are differences in complexity and dominant play style, but there is nothing about the elementalist class that necessarily makes it any more "pew pew" than the others.
Here is the twitter message:
http://twitter.com/#!/GuildWars2/sta...87938500034561nope server choice will not carry over, everything will be a clean slate come headstart :) ^AT
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Last edited by Contrai; 04-26-2012 at 03:38 PM.
I would start by playing a dagger Elementalist, a staff Guardian, or a 2H sword Mesmer, then -- those are some of the more unique options, based on what I've seen.
Ranger, Thief, Warrior, Guardian, Mesmer, Engineer are all very different when using their ranged abilities. Necromancer is a possibility but again the focus is somewhat on pets and the death shroud stuff, along with debuffing.
I better do a little reading up on what the classes can do in general at least in the next couple days.
So for the beta weekend, The Wanderers guild will be on Sorrow's Furnace. I mention it because some folks from here have played Warhammer and some other games with us in the past.
I was careful with the phrasing of my post, but perhaps I should have been more so.
I said that class has "little" to do with survivability, by which I meant that it is a stated goal for their class design that no one is forced to rely on others to stay alive. Yes, some classes have specs that make them far more hardy than other classes, but nobody should have to shy away from a particular class because they are worried about dying all the time.
The other person's "pew pew" quote was actually "pew pew fireballs mage class", so saying that the elementalist is best suited to that is certainly true. What I was alluding to was simply that all classes have ranged attack options. Yes, the ranged attack options of some classes are more expansive than other classes. Also, the elementalist is in no way limited to that -- in another post I suggested someone try equipping a dagger as their primary weapon, and that causes all attacks to be extremely short range AoE.
My somewhat quippish post was merely intended to point out that there are a lot of deeply-ingrained preconceptions about MMOs at play here. I'm not much of an MMO player, so I am curious to see what people think about the way some of this stuff has been turned on its head after they have had a chance to actually play.
Certainly different classes will have different survivability. Even simply looking at the number of health points at lvl 80, some classes will have around 18K, some - 15K and some 12K IIRC.
The same applies to damage dealing or, in case of "pew pew", more specifically, direct damage nuking. Certainly, all classes will have some ranged attacks (as they do in most of the games btw) but it's silly to expect a mesmer to deliver the same dps through his nukes as an elementalist, since mesmer has other means to deliver damage - confusions, illusions, etc. when an elementalist does not. Yes, mesmer has some nukes but they are not as good as the ones elementalist has.
 As for the "preconceptions turned on their head", the only one I see so far is the claimed lack of dedicated tanks and dedicated healers. It will be fun to see how it's going to turn out, that's for sure.
Last edited by Stridergg; 04-25-2012 at 01:41 PM.
I know it's not the same game, but in Guild Wars, you could make many unexpected builds that worked really well. Like a tanking Elementalist or a DPS Monk. If we can infer even a little bit from that about GW2, we probably shouldn't jump to conclusions what roles are viable for what class.
Most of the miscommunication here comes down to my being, as I said in my last post, not an MMO guy. I am apparently not using all my terms in the understood fashion. For the record, AoE probably wasn't the right way to refer to what Elementalists do with daggers, either -- it's a shallow cone of effect, not a ground-targeted area of effect.
Regarding the survivability issue, Arenanet actually breaks down the professions into three categories -- soldiers, adventurers, and scholars -- so yes, they are not all equally survivable, and what I said earlier was unreasonably reductive. I still infer from my reading, though, that the least survivable classes in this game are designed to be more survivable than the least survivable classes in a "typical" MMO. I could certainly be wrong.
The thing about preconceptions was basically an empty phrase. I meant that the game evolves the MMO model in some ways that should pretty majorly subvert the expectations of MMO players that haven't been paying attention. First, I think you are probably underselling the significance of the increased flexibility of the classes with regard to roles they can fill in combat. There is also all the positional/blocking stuff, the cross class combos, the everything-is-a-public-quest model, the trait system, the extensive side-kicking/level adjustment, and I'm sure some other stuff. Those things are not utterly unique, but putting all of them together seems like it's going to make for a game that will be an adjustment for a lot of people.
As for roles, the concept of role doesn't really exist. There is no healer class. The guardian does exist, which is kinda confusing, since we also have the warrior. But at any rate, everybody just kinda attacks and heals each other in an orgy of combat and somehow that all works. We'll see.
I know where you're coming from, but I actually think GW2 has more possibilities, you just have to dig a little deeper (which, if successful, will be great in an "easy to learn, difficult to master" type of setup). This is all just IMO, but it's based off of hours of obsessively looking over the class abilities/traits on the wiki.
Easy to learn difficult to master would be a great improvement over GW1, which was difficult on both.
GW1 was difficult to learn?
Yes, there were dozens of skills and two classes per character.
If you want to play with your buddies, be sure to pick the same server. When the game goes live, your server choice won't be as important because of the "guest" feature that essentially lets everyone play with everyone else (except in WvW, where your server will determine your "team"). However, for the beta, there won't be a guest feature - so if you aren't on the same server with someone, you won't be able to play with them.
KevinC linked the ArenaNet blog post referencing this in #1054 above - you *will* be able to transfer your characters (all of them) once in the beta period for 1800 gems (and beta people will be given 2000 gems for the weekend). But wouldn't you rather use those gems for other stuff instead of a character transfer?
Anyway, just some words of warning.
Also, in my opinion, Elementalists will be pretty popular. They blow stuff up spectacularly. As to the person who said they maybe seemed a bit complicated, all characters have some complexity with regards to weaponskills - many classes let you swap between two sets of weapons, and then there's Engineers, who swap in a whole new set of abilities when they use their weapon kits. So I don't think the Elementalists are more complex than any other class in that regard, just different.
Of course, we all have different thresholds for what that means, but these days, Blizzards seems to me the standard for "easy to learn".
ObGW2Ref: Dang, I wish they'd announce a Guild Wars 2 release date already so I know when to get excited and how excited to get.
Especially in the expansions, you can end up with like 40 skills to choose from after just a couple of hours. And depending on your class, a lot of those skills can be super conditional and/or confusing. Take a look at the Mesmer Illusion and Domination lines or the Necromancer curses line, or the Monk Protection line, or the Ritualist, jeez. The skill system in the first Guild Wars is amazing but a big departure from the norm.
You often only have a second or two to react when you are hexed for example.
And to react in a right way is important (especially in PVP) because it can mean life or death (for example not to attack when you are hexed with Spiteful Spirit which hurts you - and everyone around you - everytime you use a skill or attack).
I remember even the devs saying that one reason GW1 could not go on as it was because it got more and more difficult to introduce new players to the game or even for veteran players to keep track of everything with each new expansion bringing in dozens of new skills.