Hey Angie, this sucks.
I just read on Shacknews that not all developers will be getting accredited for their work on Warhammer Online if they left the company before the game is launched. Honestly, what the fuck?
That's nice, Mark. But what about all the people who spent years working on the game, as hard as anyone else, who even have their work within the final version of the game? I guess they're not important enough since they left early!"Over the years, we've had hundreds of people work on the game, and we thank everyone who helped us bring our Warhammer passion to life, but only current employees that have continued until the end will be credited in the final game," Mythic VP and general manager Mark Jacobs told Shacknews.
"Accreditation in Warhammer Online recognizes the incredible team that has poured their heart and soul into making WAR an amazing MMORPG experience," he added.
Or maybe even if you got sick and couldn't come to work on the day...
Sweet."I was told they made SURE to not include anyone in the list who was not at the office the day of the credit list creation," the one-time staff member continued. "This is wrong on many levels and should not go unnoticed."
http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/54263
It's not like this is the first time it's happened in this industry. Would it be nice to have my name on the game? Sure, I liked working there and I was proud of my work, but if I leave a project before ship I don't have any expectation of being in the credits.
I don't know if I like that policy. ( I don't. )
I mean I can somewhat understand it, and most employers don't really care about whether you appear in the game's credits or not so long as they've known that you worked there and did what your CV says, but still...
It hurts to dedicate your work to a project for X amount of time only to not receive any credit for it because you had to leave for whatever reason.
Pfft. That's nothing. Capcom left off the entire Clover Studio credits for the Wii port of Okami. Their excuse was nigh nonsensical.
That's crappy, but I had the impression that was fairly standard.
So, what about people that were obviously unqualified, and were fired after a month or 2? I'm not sure the correct way to differentiate in the credits between them and people that left for various non-performance reasons. I asked around at work, and apparently people who aren't with the company any more get put in the Special Thanks section, as opposed to broken out into roles. That seems somewhat reasonable, because it also encompasses people that were important to one product, but weren't actually ON the specific product. I'm not really sure what the standard is now.
Is this Sol Invictus Righteous Indignation Post Day?
-Tom
P.S. :)
As a bitter and jaded software developer, rather then suspecting evil evilness, I'm assuming they simply don't have those names available anymore because of the crap administrative software they use.
http://www.intelligent-artifice.com/...manhunt-2.html
Will those who spent two to four years at Blizz North on Diablo 3 get credited?
Maybe in the "special thanks". Who knows. I don't know what Blizzard's policies are on accreditation. It varies from company to company.Originally Posted by dashingly
Blizzard North's work on D3 has mostly gotten scrapped. It wouldn't be fair to the current guys if they got billed as lead designer alongside whoever did the scrapped version.
There's actually a similar story about this in Hollywood, wherein 2 lousy scriptwriters received full writing credits for a movie that they had nothing to do with simply because of some prior contractual agreement they had with the company. I can't remember what movie it was, but it goes something like this: Duo write bad script, company sees it, rejects it, takes someone else's script. Duo sue company, receive credit for the other story alongside proper author.
I heard from an ex-employee at a now defunct game company that everyone who quit had a downgrade in the credits. Like if you were a Lead Level Designer, you would only get credited as a Level Designer. Ridicilous.
What's the deal with this thread, outrage at the sky not being blue on cloudy days? This is completely standard practice. I've seen a couple of occasions where people went out of their way to include credits for people who'd left their companies earlier and in each case it was seen as a really big gesture, symbolic of how much the person had been liked. Not doing so is completely normal.
I don't care if it is normal (and it is); I just don't think it is right. But then again it is a darn sight better than other software where you aren't credited at all.
I think anyone that had a hand in the shipped product should be in the credits. This doesn't just mean shipped code or assets, but also things like concept art, etc.
I mean they have no problem finding room for much more "questionable" additions the higher up the administrative chain you go, why not include some of the lower levels that contributed but are no longer there?
It might be standard practice, but so what? Back in Atari's heyday, it was standard practice not to give any of the developers any credit at all, so they resorted to the inclusion of easter eggs to credit themselves.
Also, recall that concept artists get credited for their work, especially if they're outsourced or contracted. Their agency typically just sends in a list of all of the contributors and they get put into the credits. Heck, most of their stuff doesn't even make it into the game, yet they're credited nonetheless for their conceptual work. I don't see why people who've contributed a lot to a project, but left, shouldn't receive credit for their efforts. Does it hurt anyone to do that?
When did Sol Invictus become as annoying as HRose?
Hey, today is my day of righteous indignation. It only lasts a day, Ryan.
Since the 1up Bill Roper interview was posted.
Damn comedians.
I guess the moral of the story is that when corporations have the opportunity to treat people badly without harmful consequences to themselves, they do. It shouldn't be that way, but it is. But no matter how furious you are about this injustice, would you choose *not* to purchase a game that you otherwise were super-pumped about, because you heard someone got left off the credits? Or, if you were offered a dream job working on a title you were seriously interested in, would you turn the job down because you heard a rumor that that company had one time left someone off the credits of a previous game? If both answers are no... that's your answer.
In terms of resumes, I assume somebody can say they worked on a particular shipped product even if they aren't listed in the credits?
Yes, you can.
Greetings:
It may be standard practice, but it's not right. Actually, it goes against the IGDA standards, and they've been advocating to get people to change this policy, because you can have major contributors locked out because they left at beta, and it also makes it harder to verify people's work histories, and so on. Credits are cheap; they don't take a lot of paper to print or time to get into a game, so denying credit to someone because they left the company is more spiteful than anything else. One of my CM's left, but he's still getting credit on a title we're shipping next month because he did serious work on the title.
Best,
Michael.
I will agree that I like the IGDA's stance on this, but like I said, it's pretty much standard operating procedure outside of IGDA companies. People should be aware of that when joining the industry.
Why would they make a point of not putting those people in the game, though? Hell, I've been in the credits for a few games just for either beta testing or being a member of the forums.
So where do you draw the line? Let's say I worked there for a year, then quit and went to work at a competitor. Do I deserve to be in the credits?
What if my departure was ugly? What if I was fired? What if I sabotaged the project a bit on my way out?
Who decides? And how do you know, based on the information you have from this secret informant, that these things didn't happen in this case?
What do you mean they didn't get credit. They got paid, right? They can put it on their resume, right?
I've never had my name on any project I've worked on other than a "thank you" at the end and praise during a meeting. You only put your name in code in order to keep track of changes and such. Credits? What? That's what you are paid for.
Lame outrage.
I'm not sure why think that someone ought to "decide". You work on the title, you are in the credits. End of story.
The movie industry got unions precisely to stop this petty bullshit, among other reasons.
The movie industry still has this petty bullshit actually - it's just decided by the guilds instead of the company. Screenplay credits are notorious on this - there may have been 15 writers that worked on script, but the final movie will have 2 people in the credits.
Just because you work in a field where anonymity is par for the course doesn't mean that it's right when people in another field don't get recognized for their work. The fact that games show credits lists is well-established -- what is less so are the standards by which credits are given. (I happen to think the IGDA standards are pretty reasonable.)
If someone's contributions are minimal or replaced during production, well, that's what the "additional" categories cover...
That being said, this is more of a "developer outrage" issue than a "consumer outrage" issue.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote