Soul Calibur 4

[Brian Rucker]

From what I've gathered on the, always reliable, internet is that the unlockables in the tower are the same that can be unlocked with achievements. However, you do get refunded if you unlock something you've already bought.

The more I think about Soul Crush the more I think it's only something you'd use against a player who was very defensive or high level NPC enemies who you just can't seem to get a solid hit in on. And, then, maybe only in modes where special abilities are enabled. I've built a character with both Gage Damage A and Double Edged Sword...though I can't say I honestly see much of a difference.

Does the amount of Soul Gage damage or the chance of armor getting smashed depend on the kind of weapon being used (for example I didn't know about unarmed attacks v. guard impacts - is there something like this that effects Soul Gage damage in some manner?).

What would be an ideal character building a Soul Crush strategy around? Somebody who hits less often but harder or someone who has very fast but lighter attacks? Does it make any difference?

[Matt Bowyer]

The more I think about Soul Crush the more I think it's only something you'd use against a player who was very defensive or high level NPC enemies who you just can't seem to get a solid hit in on. And, then, maybe only in modes where special abilities are enabled. I've built a character with both Gage Damage A and Double Edged Sword...though I can't say I honestly see much of a difference.

Does the amount of Soul Gage damage or the chance of armor getting smashed depend on the kind of weapon being used (for example I didn't know about unarmed attacks v. guard impacts - is there something like this that effects Soul Gage damage in some manner?).

What would be an ideal character building a Soul Crush strategy around? Somebody who hits less often but harder or someone who has very fast but lighter attacks? Does it make any difference?

My (limited) experience says that hard-hitting single-strike guys are the best. Astaroth's back-down horizontal strike is -shattering- low armor for me, and I can then usually work in a few powerful strikes to get the gauge down and then hit the Critical Finisher.

Mitsurugi is also working well for me -- his running A+B, where he pivots and brings the sword down in a huge overhead strike, one of his signature moves, is also really breaking armor and wearing down people fast for me.

[BDGE]

Stupid easy Critical Finish character:

-Yun Seung kitted out with Soul Damage A and Soul Vamp. Might as well toss on equipment that gives high HP and Def as well as lower attack so you don't kill the enemy accidentally.

-Anyway, use A+B+K(Soul vamp) whenever your gauge is glowing to auto-lower the opponents soul gauge one level. Then just spam forward+B, B which is a two hit attack with guard break properties. Keep mashing that out and the enemy will usually guard and the gauge will turn red pretty fast. When the gauge starts flashing red, wait until you get the soul crush(very obvious by the slight knockback and red lightning explosion around the opponent), then just immediately mash the 4 buttons or LB to pull off a critical finish.

Be careful when it flashes red though, if the first strike soul crushes the enemy, but you pull off the second attack instead of a critical finish, then it cancels out the opportunity and the enemy goes back to green status. It's usually better to slow down a bit when the gauge flashes red and just do single ->B strikes until you get the feel of it.

Try this on floor 11 of the tower and be amazed that you actually got the hidden treasure you thought impossible.

[hong]

I'm having a hard time imagining getting the Arcade score achievement, personally. But yeah, in general, the achievements are pretty reasonable in this.

Huh, I thought a few of the achievements were too trivial if anything. Getting an achievement for clearing Story or Arcade mode, when there's no limit on continues, doesn't really feel like "achieving" something.

[Nathan Phoenix]

Eh, why not? You get an achievement for clearing bioshock and you can't actually die in that game.

[hong]

Completing Bioshock does involve rather more hours of play than doing SC4's Story mode, though.

[RobotPants]

"A few" of the achievements in every game are trivial. But getting "a few" won't unlock everything.

[wigglestick]

Some of the Tower of Souls levels were sending me into a bloody rage this past weekend.

Really? You want me to clear three floors, each with 3 or 4 enemies per floor, with one character?

The one that really got me, that I'm currently stuck on, is the one where you've got two floors to clear together, each with (I think) only one enemy, who has insanely good damage and insanely high defense. Maybe I need to try the Yun-Seong gimmick for that one.

[theborbes]

It might take you longer to play through bioshock's story than it does to play through a single character's story (i'm not so sure about all of the characters stories together), but I think it'll take longer for me to beat the tower of lost souls than it would take me to run through rapture again.

[Reldan]

Does anyone here actually play this game against physically present, real people? Playing this game in single player would be like playing TF2 with nothing but bots. It might be practice at learning the ins, outs, and levels, but it's not the point of the game.

[wigglestick]

I don't have anyone to sit down in the same room and play it with (yet).

Hopefully I can get one of my friends into it.

[slantz]

Does anyone here actually play this game against physically present, real people? Playing this game in single player would be like playing TF2 with nothing but bots. It might be practice at learning the ins, outs, and levels, but it's not the point of the game.

Most weekdays at lunch I play against some co-workers.

The problem is that I probably have 300-400 hours logged in the franchise, and they're all pretty much noobs. We've been playing for about 6 months though, and they're finally catching up.

SC4 kind of hit the reset button in a lot of ways, and so far we've been playing without handicaps and games have been surprisingly close.

[Jasper Phillips]

Does anyone here actually play this game against physically present, real people? Playing this game in single player would be like playing TF2 with nothing but bots. It might be practice at learning the ins, outs, and levels, but it's not the point of the game.

I've only had one actual opponent, as the other players I used to know moved. My buddy likes to this he's good, but he's just decent (I know I'm much worse than I used to be); I make due by frequently playing characters I'm weak with, and not putting much time into it.

One of the downsides to working for myself again. :-/

[Adam B]

So ground-humping seems a little more powerful now that I've been spending some more time with the game. Is it me, or is it harder to GTFO of bounce combos than it used to be?

It could certainly be me, but that and the fact that it's harder to start guarding mid-combo seem to be the biggest changes.

[Reldan]

So ground-humping seems a little more powerful now that I've been spending some more time with the game. Is it me, or is it harder to GTFO of bounce combos than it used to be?

It could certainly be me, but that and the fact that it's harder to start guarding mid-combo seem to be the biggest changes.

I'm not sure what you mean by bounce combo. In general the term "combo" implies a series of moves where if the first hits, the rest are guaranteed (or practically guaranteed) to also hit.

"String" is used to describe series of moves that can be escaped, blocked, or GI'd in the middle.

I'm not trying to be some elitist ass, but there's a pretty established set of terms to describe these things (similar to "tanking" or "aggro" in an MUMORPAGER). As it is, you can't guard mid-combo or escape bounce combos by definition - if you could it wouldn't be a combo.

[BDGE]

Just to reiterate what someone said way above. An easy way to cheese through the tower(for achievements/honor at least) is to create a custom Asteroth. Give him equipment with crazy HP, defense, and attack, and HP Drain A at least, throw in HP Burst if you want as well for manual quick emergency healing. (make two for tagging)

Then just do your down+back+A(hold) sweeping move and follow up with B attack just after for a crazy harsh downward slam. The AI seems to often fall for it, and if it does tend to block you can go for a Critical Finish since the move has guard break properties and cuts deep into their Soul gauge. Plus, when it lands you get a decent chunk of HP back.

I cleared up to level 25 of descent with a single asteroth doing this(my partner got ringed out in round 1), but with two of these guys I'm sure I can get all 40 floors cleared no problem.

It's also super easy to clear arcade mode with 450,000 pts for the achievement doing this(did it my first try). Can be tricky still on the upper floors of the tower since the AI likes to Just and Guard Impact the move quite a bit, but with persistence it can make beating this mode a cinch. (again, for achievements and unlocks)

[Adam B]

Ah, apologies. Yes, I meant strings. And instead of "bounce combo" I probably should have said "ground game". Make more sense now?

Sorry, I've never ventured into higher levels of fighter play, so yeah.

[RobotPants]

I'm not trying to be some elitist ass, but there's a pretty established set of terms to describe these things

Yes. Terms that most non-elitist asses probably don't know. ;)

[ZekeDMS]

Jeez, first he derides us for playing alone, then for not knowing the crazy top level fighter terminology. Elitist prick!

[Brian Rucker]

See, fighting games are the flight sims of the console world! Hardcores mocking casual players. Fanfic about the characters (or missions). Only missing the dynamic campaigns/single player content ("real simmers play online who needs that stuff?") but I digress.

Okay, bought not only the strategy guide but the Hori SC Arcade stick. I'm tired of my ass getting whupped. When I get home tonight I'll try it out and see how it works.

And if that ain't enough I swear to God, I'll jury rig my Cougar HOTAS for Soul Calibur and then, then, I'll wreak holy havok...vengence will be mine.

[idrisz]

I don't like using hori at all playing with certain characters.

certain characters with moves that require double tap or press a certain direction I have a much easier time using with PS3 controller.

Hilde is easier on Hori though.

[Reldan]

Ah, apologies. Yes, I meant strings. And instead of "bounce combo" I probably should have said "ground game". Make more sense now?

Sorry, I've never ventured into higher levels of fighter play, so yeah.

No problems, I understand what you mean. There are significantly more hits that result in ground stuns in SC4 than in previous iterations. Many characters have at least some guaranteed combos that involve grounding someone and then landing on-the-ground hits. Typically these function pretty much identically as any other combo - once you've been hit by the starting move you're just going along for the ride until all the hits have finished connecting. The biggest difference is perception - usually people playing SC are used to touching the ground being the end of a combo and the point of regaining control.

They did put a recovery option in - if you tap G at the moment you hit the ground you'll flash white and almost instantly roll back to your feet. I believe this is only possible off of some knockdowns, however.

This game in some ways is less comborific than SC3 was, where they had a lot of ridiculous inescapable stuns that could lead to other inescapable stuns, allowing for 6-7 hit combos that could last several seconds. In SC4 the only thing I've seen which comes close is some of Ivy's stuff.

PS: In case anyone cares, the ground game is commonly called okizeme, or "oki" for short. It's Japanese of course.

[BDGE]

See, fighting games are the flight sims of the console world! Hardcores mocking casual players. Fanfic about the characters (or missions). Only missing the dynamic campaigns/single player content ("real simmers play online who needs that stuff?") but I digress.

Okay, bought not only the strategy guide but the Hori SC Arcade stick. I'm tired of my ass getting whupped. When I get home tonight I'll try it out and see how it works.

And if that ain't enough I swear to God, I'll jury rig my Cougar HOTAS for Soul Calibur and then, then, I'll wreak holy havok...vengence will be mine.

I've been using the Hori SC4 stick exclusively with the 360 version and it works swimmingly. You do have to initially remap the buttons, but I can't go back to the 360 pad. Oh and SC1 XBLA is a blast to play with it too! Soon I'll snag VF5 just to have something else to play with it also.

[Reldan]

Jeez, first he derides us for playing alone, then for not knowing the crazy top level fighter terminology. Elitist prick!

I'm not trying to deride anyone, just possibly trying to help people newer to the game or to fighting games understand what different common terms thrown around mean. It's jargon, but it's the jargon of these games.

I don't think it's "crazy top level terminology" at all, at least no more than knowing what "nuking", "aggro", "sheeped", or "DPS" would mean in a discussion of WoW.

[Adam B]

I think the difference is that *anyone* who plays WoW at the group level learns those terms perforce, because they're necessary communication in-game.

SC, and fighters in general, are something I've sunk just as much time into as WoW, but it's been time on the couch with my buddies -- we've never gone online to jump into discussions with other fans on the finer points of SC4 strategy or whatever, so we never learned the common terminology. I should fucking well hope that I'm not *still* considered "new" to fighting games, as much as I'm sure that there are several people in this thread that could take me to school ;)

[Reldan]

I think the difference is that *anyone* who plays WoW at the group level learns those terms perforce, because they're necessary communication in-game.

SC, and fighters in general, are something I've sunk just as much time into as WoW, but it's been time on the couch with my buddies -- we've never gone online to jump into discussions with other fans on the finer points of SC4 strategy or whatever, so we never learned the common terminology. I should fucking well hope that I'm not *still* considered "new" to fighting games, as much as I'm sure that there are several people in this thread that could take me to school ;)

Okay then, "new" to discussing fighting games on a public forum. Most small groups develop their own terms to describe common concepts, but it can be hard to effectively communicate those ideas with people outside of the group. The global community as a whole has basically agreed on a lexicon for the fighting game genre.

Anyone who plays WoW learns the WoW jargon because it's necessary to allow simple communication about the game. People adopt it because it's advantageous for everybody to use the same terms to describe the same things, whether they like the terms or not. It's really not that different here. If you had a group of friends and you only ever played WoW together, you might easily invent your own jargon there as well. And it'd be just as effective as the commonly accepted jargon, except if you ever opened your social pool up no one else would understand you.

Anyways, "bounce combo" is confusing, as there are combos in the game that involve literally hitting people into the ground so that they bounce back into the air for more hits. I've seen that term used before in several games, but I was pretty sure that wasn't what you were talking about.

[wigglestick]

SC, and fighters in general, are something I've sunk just as much time into as WoW, but it's been time on the couch with my buddies -- we've never gone online to jump into discussions with other fans on the finer points of SC4 strategy or whatever, so we never learned the common terminology. I should fucking well hope that I'm not *still* considered "new" to fighting games, as much as I'm sure that there are several people in this thread that could take me to school ;)

This is relative, however. I would say that even though I "played" fighting games since the days of SF2 in the arcade, I never really played a fighting game at a high level of play until my brother tried to get me into Guilty Gear. Even though I sunk many, many, many hours into the Tekken series (especially Tekken 2) as well as earlier Soul series games, I was still "new" at them in that anyone who really knew their character at a high level and was playing to that character's strengths would have been fighting circles around me.

"Jesus Ray, we got the chessboard out but you playin' Whack-a-Mole."

[Reldan]

If it's helpful to anyone:

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Append...ing_game_terms

Just found this, but seems to be pretty correct and fairly complete.

[ZekeDMS]

Whoa there Reldan, I meant that in a total joking manner. To most of us, you're throwing out things we've never thought of or heard of. I would say it's higher level than most, really, since most of us are spending our time with friends and sometimes on Live or an arcade. It's mostly the serious tourney players who hear more things there and come back with the agreed terms. Whereas say, MMOs, you hear all of that in the first five levels.

[Reldan]

Whoa there Reldan, I meant that in a total joking manner. To most of us, you're throwing out things we've never thought of or heard of. I would say it's higher level than most, really, since most of us are spending our time with friends and sometimes on Live or an arcade. It's mostly the serious tourney players who hear more things there and come back with the agreed terms. Whereas say, MMOs, you hear all of that in the first five levels.

I didn't think you were being super-serious. I'm trying, maybe, to take the edge off of what seems to be considered to be "too hardcore" for many. I just don't think a person has to be a "top-level" player to understand the language of the game, anymore than person would need to be some crazy Korean Starcraft player in order to understand concepts like "teching", "rushing", or "zerging."

It's just that with the death of arcades and rise of online gaming, for which fighting games just don't make the jump very well, it doesn't seem uncommon that many people may have never even played a good fighting game against decent live opponents. Done properly, there's a depth and quality to this kind of gaming experience that isn't matched by anything else.

Single-player modes in a game like this are like the Solo Tours in Rock Band. If playing them is all you ever do, you can beat the game and still have missed the entire point of the experience.