World War Z: The Motion Picture

[zengonzo]

Dan Brown is terrible stuff, but he knows how to structure and pace a novel.

I dunno', that fucking museum puzzle thing seemed to last forever - and then a race across Europe to the end!

[Desslock]

If you liked WWZ, it's probably impossible for you to not like a zombie book, so it doesn't matter if it reads like it was written by an uneducated 14 year old boy .

That is not even attacking Max, that is attacking whoever enjoyed the book

Not really - unless you take offense to the suggestion that you're not particularly discriminating because you like the subject matter. Pogue Mahone similarly took offense at that comment, and then went on to cite a litany of zombie fiction that I suspect almost nobody here has ever heard of, so obviously he's a big fan of the subject matter which ironically supported the point I was making -- but I also recognize that his perspective on the relative merits of different genre books is probably well-informed and probably useful context to people thinking of trying some zombie fiction.

Hell, I like a lot of goofy nonsense that I know isn't actually very good, like most Silver Age comics, computer game storylines and Godzilla movies. But I also wouldn't defend that stuff as not being nonsensical, for the most part, or be surprised if someone criticized, for instance, the prevalent anti-Red content of the Silver Age comics, or the hamfisted anti-nuclear/environmental themes of Godzilla movies, or "feel denigrated" because someone mocked that stuff. You're inferring something I didn't intend to imply - I just despised WWZ.

[MattKeil]

I don't want to get into a spat about good writing and bad writing, but I'd rather read Dan Brown that Max Brooks.

Amen. Dan Brown is no Tolstoy, but he's far better than Max Brooks (at least WWZ Brooks...I haven't read any of Brooks' other books, if he has written others). The format of WWZ does a decent job of covering his weaknesses in some places, which I suspect is why it's written that way, but even in the better sections I wouldn't call it much more than passable.

I really don't find Desslock's assertion that people who like WWZ are predisposed to liking the subject matter to the point of being blind to the subpar writing to be all that far-fetched. Even I enjoyed the first third or so of the book, simply because I think the initial infection/breakout is the most interesting part of any zombie apocalypse. But again, that's an interest in the subject that let me push past the quality of the writing, something that wasn't able to sustain through the entire book.

[Hans Lauring]

I was going to write exactly what Tom did.
While no literary giant - more like a midget somewhat shorter than the other midgets - Dan Brown is still better than Brooks. And I agree completely with Desslock. I friggin' love zombies (the proper slow kind, not the new fancy fast ones Tom and others like) which is why I made it all the way through WWZ. Had it been about the catholic church and conspiracies, I'd have chucked it away at the first mention of blind ninja Japanese.

It's a bad book about a great subject and - as I said many times before - it does bring some cool ideas and settings to the table... just not very well executed.

[alexlitel]

I hate genre lit and have no real fondness for the undead, but I liked World War Z and found it pretty compelling.

Maybe because that's I got a free advance copy or something, or maybe he wasn't writing this for a nerd audience. Then again, I paid for Zombie Survival Guide and hated it.

[Dave Markell]

I hate genre lit and have no real fondness for the undead, but I liked World War Z and found it pretty compelling.

Maybe because that's I got a free advance copy or something, or maybe he wasn't writing this for a nerd audience. Then again, I paid for Zombie Survival Guide and hated it.

Once again, Alex proves his tastes are the polar opposite of my own.

[Pogue Mahone]

Pogue Mahone similarly took offense at that comment, and then went on to cite a litany of zombie fiction that I suspect almost nobody here has ever heard of, so obviously he's a big fan of the subject matter which ironically supported the point I was making -- but I also recognize that his perspective on the relative merits of different genre books is probably well-informed and probably useful context to people thinking of trying some zombie fiction.

I wouldn't say offended so much as surprised by the vehemence of your response, and the ease with which you paint those of us who find the book entertaining as supporters of, basically, mindless dreck.

I agree with you that we don't approach this from the same angle, and that I do have a deeper than average interest in zombie literature (and movies, and video games, and board games ... but I digress). It very likely does color my opinion of World War Z. It absolutely was my interest in the subject matter that drew me to this book, it wasn't recommended to me by a friend or a book review. So if you came to this expecting the ultimate in zombie fiction, sure, I can see being let down.

Since I know quite a few of you are writers, it's understandable that bad writing would be one of those things that are hard for you to get past. Apparently I can. Lucky me. But I'm done with this dead horse, lest it rise from its peaceful repose and bite me in the ass. Enough with critiquery, back to thinking and posting about the undead.

[Eric P]

But having read The Rising, , .

talk about mindless drivel. i enjoyed it as i read it but attempts to think about it too deeply afterward made me reverse my position.

i should have given up at the goldfish

[DoomMunky]

Is it okay to think the writing was just fine?

I really like good writers like Iain Banks and Neal Stephenson and Nick Harkaway, too, so I know what I'm talking about!

Oh wait, Tom hates those last too, too? Damn. Tom's taste and my taste are not the same! Damn!

Also? Desslock's taste is different than mine as well! He must be a jerk! I think I'll insult him... nah.

This thread is ridiculous. Some people like stuff that other people think is utter shit. As has been said, see the Transformers 2 thread for more. How much longer do we really need to insult each other for having different taste?

[Chris Nahr]

Had it been about the catholic church and conspiracies, I'd have chucked it away at the first mention of blind ninja Japanese.

Wait, WWZ has blind ninja Japanese?

[Jarmo]

Wait, WWZ has blind ninja Japanese?

Not in an awesome Nick Harkaway way, unfortunately. Should have been cut.

[metta]

I
This thread is ridiculous. Some people like stuff that other people think is utter shit. As has been said, see the Transformers 2 thread for more. How much longer do we really need to insult each other for having different taste?

Some people can't feel right unless they make someone else wrong.

[Quitch]

Well I just finished it, it certainly isn't without its weak spots and the first third is by far the strongest portion, but the writing did the job of telling the story and I didn't feel like it was particularly bad at any point.

[Kyle Wilson]

the first third is by far the strongest portion... and I didn't feel like it was particularly bad at any point.

Perhaps the latter two-thirds?

[Quitch]

No, they were good too, just not as good :P

As was said above, the best part in most zombie (and doomsday scenarios) is the part where it's unfolding.

[Lynxara]

As was said above, the best part in most zombie (and doomsday scenarios) is the part where it's unfolding.

This may be why I like Shaun of the Dead so much. It focuses on the "unfolding" well into the third act so the tension stays very high.

[gameoverman]

No, they were good too, just not as good :P

As was said above, the best part in most zombie (and doomsday scenarios) is the part where it's unfolding.

But that's true for a lot of different kinds of stories too. I was watching Dances With Wolves the other day and it occurred to me that the best part of that movie, and almost all fish out of water movies, is the first part. The part where the stranger in a strange land makes contact and tries to fit in/make friends.

After that, those stories usually go downhill. It's probably because after that point it becomes clear where the story is going.

With zombie movies, it's either going "...and zombies take over" or "...and humans defeat the zombies".

It reminds me of playing CIV4: I always reach a point where I can tell I'm going to win or I'm doomed. That's when I stop playing and start a new game, because it seems kind of pointless to continue when that happens.

[Quitch]

Couldn't agree more the joy is in the mystery not the answer.

[Neopythia]

This may be the wrong place for it, but as this has become a catch all thread I'll ask anyway: What is a good zombie book? I read WWZ and I'm currently reading Cell. Surely there are better out there.

[MattKeil]

This may be the wrong place for it, but as this has become a catch all thread I'll ask anyway: What is a good zombie book? I read WWZ and I'm currently reading Cell. Surely there are better out there.

I know it's a "graphic novel" and not an actual book, but The Walking Dead is unquestionably the best zombie fiction going these days.

Give the first volume a try and you'll be hooked, if you're into character-driven post-apocalyptic undead scourge stories.

[Telefrog]

BTW, The Walking Dead has just been optioned by AMC and is being written by Frank Darabont.

http://reporter.blogs.com/comiccon/2...anne-hurd.html

[balut]

BTW, The Walking Dead has just been optioned by AMC and is being written by Frank Darabont.

http://reporter.blogs.com/comiccon/2...anne-hurd.html

http://www.quartertothree.com/game-t...ad.php?t=54183

[gameoverman]

This may be the wrong place for it, but as this has become a catch all thread I'll ask anyway: What is a good zombie book? I read WWZ and I'm currently reading Cell. Surely there are better out there.

A book of short stories, all zombie all the time, is Book of the Dead.

Downside: short story collection, not a novel
Upside: better than any zombie novel I've read(WWZ not being a novel, imo), we are talking quality stories here

[Pogue Mahone]

This is also a good collection of zombie short stories. Many different authors, including Joe Lansdale, George R.R. Martin, Stephen King, etc. Different types of zombies, but really high quality throughout the book.

[Hans Lauring]

A book of short stories, all zombie all the time, is Book of the Dead.

Downside: short story collection, not a novel
Upside: better than any zombie novel I've read(WWZ not being a novel, imo), we are talking quality stories here

There's an equally good sequel Still Dead as well (as I think I mentioned earlier and that damn Neopythia should just slog through all the arguments to find that post, dammit)

[Moore]

Wet Work is decent, I think it is a novel based on a short in book of the dead or still dead. It is a bit silly from time to time though.

[Telefrog]

Arise! Not looking good for this film.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/new...ghtmare-336422

It now seems that everything was upside-down on World War Z. “A nightmare from top to bottom,” describes one source with ties to the production, which appears to have been hampered from the outset by a lack of clear creative direction. Pitt hired the director of his choosing, Marc Forster (The Kite Runner, Finding Neverland), but Forster -- who has limited experience on effects-heavy tentpoles -- was not allowed to bring along his usual team. Instead, several more seasoned players were hired. The result, say multiple sources, is a seemingly headless enterprise driven by conflicts. At this point, the movie, with a price tag now said to be north of $170 million, needs as many as five weeks of complex reshoots, which are not expected to get underway until at least September. Paramount has taken the unusual step of hiring Prometheus scriptwriter Damon Lindelof to rework the film’s third act. The studio announced in March that it was moving the film to June 2013 from December.

Trouble emerged early: Three weeks before shooting was to begin in June 2011, sources say Forster had not made critical decisions about what the zombies would look like and how they would move. “They just couldn’t get it right,” one insider says. “There was a lot of spinning of plates, a lot of talking. [But] they did not have a plan.” Meanwhile, seasoned below-the-line talents were hired, then replaced, including line producer Colin Wilson (Avatar) and Oscar-winning effects man John Nelson (Gladiator). Cinematographer Robert Richardson, who has three Oscars, is said to have asked to leave the production on more than one occasion. (None would comment for this report.)

[HighPlainsDrifter]

And they cite this situation as one of many in which studios set release dates and then push to finish in the timeframe allotted, leaving insufficient prep time.

They're picking up on the worst traits of the game industry.

[spiffy]

Yep, a lot of my industry collegues down the street have been given unpaid 'vacation' for the summer as this went on hold. It's amazing to me how slapdash the industry is getting with their prep. Back in the day you got it right ON the day, because there wasn't any going back. Now, with so much being digital, there's the impression you can rewrite, replace and rework up until the last second, which is hell for everyone involved and an amazing waste of money that could have been spent elsewhere.

Not to mention that more and more of the revision work is to make a movie more formulaic and derivative, not less, in reaction to annoying focus groups that want what they've come to expect in a story arc-- that really shouldn't matter much since most of the money is made through marketing first weekend sales, not word of mouth.

[Ginger Yellow]

At this point, the movie, with a price tag now said to be north of $170 million,

Sweet Jesus. This film was always going to be nothing like the book and probably terrible, but still. For a couple of dozen million you could do a proper WWZ movie as a documentary.