This is going to be really long, and probably not even remotely interesting to non-comic collectors, but I wanted to answer this question in a separate thread:
Starting is relatively easy, surviving is a bitch. It's not a coincidence that the strongest stores are the ones that started in the '80s or even the late '70s. These folks opened their stores as a retail business first and foremost, and by the time the speculator nonsense came around they already had an established customer base and years of experience in running a business. Extra money they made during this period was mostly gravy, and when it all vanished they still had their basic business savvy and a small group of loyal customers to fall back on.Sorry for the hijack, but I've always been curious -- how hard is it to start and run an RPG/comic/card shop? I'd swear there's not enough margin/volume in it to survive, but apparently some do okay.
Not everyone made it - I know of a few well known stores in the Seattle area that crashed during the speculator boom. They made some bad decisions, expanded when they shouldn't have, and lost everything as a result. There were dozens of new stores that disappeared when it was all over, and I suppose I must be one of these, even though I quit by choice and not out of financial necessity.
It started for me when I first moved to the Seattle area in '89. I was low on cash (real low) but still made a point to check out a comic convention in the Seattle Center. I was blown away. I had been reading and collecting comics since I was 4, and even though I purchased a new copy of Overstreet's guide every year, never really thought I would ever see the big money. I saw dealers making money left and right, and since I brought my comic collection with me when I moved to Seattle, I decided to give it a try.
I learned the promoter's name after the show, gave him a call, and bought a table for his next event some six months or so away. I arrived with four long boxes of comics, a copy of the newest edition of Overstreet's price guide, and tried to be charming. When it was over, I had made a little over two hundred dollars. "Hm," I thought, considering my minimum wage job at the time. "Maybe there are some possibilities here."
During the show, I chatted up one of the dealers next to me and asked some more details about the game. He mentioned there were two wholesale distributors in our area, Capital City and Diamond Distribution, though he recommended Capital over Diamond. (Shortly afterwards I found Diamond to be more reliable than Capital City, and years later Capital eventually went under altogether. But I digress).
So I started an account with Capital. They had several account tiers, basically amounting to the old rule of the more you buy, the bigger discount you would receive. I started an account at the lowest level, which meant I would commit to purchasing $250 worth of merchandise per month at a 40% discount of the retail price. Shortly afterwards, I learned the challenge of doing business at a quantum level. I'll explain.
The new comics you see a store selling today were all ordered three months ago. Storeowners need to anticipate how many copies they'll need to sell 90 days in advance, but they not only need to plan for their current subscriber base, but also for potential new customers. The goal is, of course, to get as close to selling out as possible. But then you have to factor in the products you've ordered that ship 3-6 or even 12 months late, products that get canceled, or even products that defy all the laws of retail physics and arrive early. Adding to the confusion is the fact that you need to do this on a monthly basis, and plan for shipments arriving on a weekly basis. Clearly, some forecasting and inventory skills are required here.
Then once you finally do get the merchandise, you've got to deal with customers who were impatient and ended up buying the product they promised to get from you somewhere else. Or worse, you'll end up receiving three months of product at once, and customers aren't able to afford it all at once. The distributors don't care, you need to pay for the product they delivered. How you get rid of it is YOUR problem.
Granted, the above couple of paragraphs are not news to those of you involved in game distribution; you all have the same challenges. But these were all revolutionary concepts to a young 20-something just looking for some extra cash.
More to come later.
I've noticed that a lot of the comic/game shops in my area that remain profitable tend to sell off old inventory at fire-sale prices when it's turned rotten. The trick is to know just how much you can sell that stuff for and still make it fly off the shelves, while minimizing the loss you take.
For what it's worth, I met some of the sleaziest people of my entire life when I was doing the baseball card thing as a teenager. This was '95ish era stuff before the crash; guess it attracted a lot of bastards.
Nice post, thanks for answering my question. =)
did you try to diversify into RPGs, computer stuff, CCGs, etc?
I thought a lot of distributors had to take returns -- computer game developers bitch all the time about "returns" from distributors, but maybe distributors have the right of return but retailers don't. Which would clearly show that distributors have too much goddamn power.
Did you basically start with your own collection as inventory?
Hey noun, any advice on getting rid of about 10 boxes of early 90's stuff? Landfill?
It seems that most stores are totally cross-genre these days. But boy, it seems like a rough business, and they totally missed the manga boom. The fastest growing area in comics, and it's almost totally owned by the bookstores...
One thing I learned when I was trying to get into the retail boardgame business is that the retail stores are your customers. You sell to them. They sell to the kids.
Yeah, and the comic shops also missed out on the Yaoi boom of 2003.
Not here, they didn't.
Neither manga nor yaoi.
I guess because the wave came in English, mostly.
Mental note: work the pump and dump scheme into the next post.I've noticed that a lot of the comic/game shops in my area that remain profitable tend to sell off old inventory at fire-sale prices when it's turned rotten.
A number of sports card dealer sleazebags got into comics and CCGs because they saw the cash cow. But they didn't really know or care what they were doing, and made the scene generally unpleasant for everyone. But they were still better than the folks starting business as, no shit, investment firms.For what it's worth, I met some of the sleaziest people of my entire life when I was doing the baseball card thing as a teenager. This was '95ish era stuff before the crash; guess it attracted a lot of bastards.
No problem. :)Nice post, thanks for answering my question. =)
Not really, sort of, yes, and yes. :) More to come.did you try to diversify into RPGs, computer stuff, CCGs, etc?
Only under certain conditions, such as the product delivered being damaged, or not being what was originally advertised. For example, Cage #1 was supposed to have some kind of crazy acetate cover, but was released with some sort of boring silver cover instead. Every dealer I knew returned 90% of their stock. I sold 20 or so copies at cost just to get them to customers then returned the rest.I thought a lot of distributors had to take returns
Yes, then things kind of got out of hand. :)Did you basically start with your own collection as inventory?
My condolensces. :) Check out eBay and a recent copy of Wizard to see if any of those issues are in demand for some reason. If they're Marvel, you're probably hosed. Anything that was even remotely popular was instantly reprinted. You could always give them out as Halloween treats. :)Hey noun, any advice on getting rid of about 10 boxes of early 90's stuff? Landfill?
I pretty much stick to tpb's now to get my comic fill, but when I do want single issues our local comic store puts all there stuff out for 1/4 price after 2 or 3 months.Originally Posted by Alex Handy
I had fun working for a local comic book store by the name of "Comic Heaven" in Willoughby, Ohio during the early 90s. The owner loved the comic business, but always approached things as a businessman first, fan second, which explains why he's grown every year since opening.
I was the tabletop games guy of the store, which he had little experience in, and thanks to my discount through the store at least have something to excuse the hundreds of RPG books I have setting on bookshelves in my closet. I had some small advantage over other area stores that sold games in that I had managed to network with a number of industry insiders on usenet back in the day, which was fun.
When the CCG craze came into full bloom, the owner hired a kid who was a genius in that particular field, which made us an odd trio of ubergeeks in our particular fields to say the least.
Still, dealing with customers was always a trip. From watching ten year olds try to wheel and deal you over Magic cards like pint-sized used car salesmen to the Warhammer fanatic who would always complain about how his wife's affection cut into his figure painting time.
Yeah, my 3500 piece comic collection is pre-90s. Might as well invested in crack.
Crack is probably more fun.Yeah, my 3500 piece comic collection is pre-90s. Might as well invested in crack.
Part two: noun gains a few levels in Comic Dealer.
Fast forward about a year. By this time, I'm doing one show a month, working on building up inventory, and building a reputation for myself in the community. My goal was to do these things before opening a store so I wouldn't have to worry about store bills (power, rent, etc.) in addition to making cash to pay for weekly inventory. Plus, I was still working full time, so I needed all the money I could get.
During this period I had a Gord-like revelation. My original intent was to use my knowledge of comic history and impending interesting comics to expand the minds of my customers and get them to try new things, thus improving the industry as a goal. A lofty and ultimately futile goal. Hot books were the in thing, and the prime deciding factor for making a book "hot" was its artist. Never mind that cool indy-project or story on the way, what did I have by McFarlane, or Liefeld, or any of those other artists who've mostly since been forgotten. I hated selling them, and I hated having to carry them in my inventory, but I couldn't say no to the dollars.
Still, I was moving a fair amount of books, once I started focusing on the current hot books - X-Men, Wolverine, Spiderman, and, in my area, Sandman. (Seattle, Goth, duh.) Initial Image books were popular, to a point. The books I sold helped pay for the stuff I had left over, and I was doing fairly well.
In the meantime, I was gradually building up my key silver age stock. First issues and first appearances of characters were almost always a winner. Books like Spider-Man #1 were the obvious trophies, but I couldn't see tying that much of my money up in a single book. For a brief while, Marvel was launching several new books based on really lame '70s characters (Moebius, Warlock, etc.) and I made a fair profit selling copies of Amazing SpiderMan #101 (1st Moebius) and Fantastic Four #65-66 (1st Warlock) that were previously almost totally unwanted before.
Back to that ordering process I mentioned earlier. Capital and Diamond both produced monthly catalogs for dealers to give to their customers so they could complete their order forms. The dealer versions of those catalogs were even more detailed. But the real wild part were the countless posters, promo comics, fliers, and other trinkets I would receive. I would sometimes receive more promo materials than actual comics I ordered for a month. It was unreal. But those promo comics and fliers were a good indicator of what might be popular later. I bought a lot of early Valiant stuff, like Harbinger. Boy, did that ever pay off.
But the most helpful thing for back issue dealers were the annual sales conventions. These were the trade shows where representatives from all the comic companies laid out their offerings for the coming year and tried to convince storeowners they would make big bucks selling them. Remember, I mentioned earlier that quality was already dropping. It was apparent that most ventures were doomed to failure (Heavy Hitters? WTF?) but an observant dealer could easily anticipate future demand and plan accordingly.
My best coup - the DC rep explained the whole breaking of the Batman storyline to us before it even started. Having remembered what a total media frenzy the whole Death of Superman caused, I knew something similar was in the making for Batman. I bought all the copies of the comics containing the first appearances of Bane and Azrael I could find, and, months later, probably grossed between $500-$600 reselling them.
But these bits of cleverness were few and far between, and I saw sales of my new books were slagging. I couldn't compete with dealers who were purchasing new books at a 55% or greater discount, who were basically using comic conventions as a way of dumping thousands of their backstock for pennies. It was beginning to hurt.
Right around this time, comic non-sport cards were becoming popular. Early series produced by Comic Images looked like crap and sold poorly, but a company by the name of Impel had just released a few series of the Marvel Universe that sold very well, with hologram chase cards that were in high demand. I noticed a release of X-Men series 1 cards were coming soon, so I bit the bullet and bought a case of it. I *think* a case contained 20 boxes, which cost me around $13 a box. This was a huge gamble for me.
Thankfully, I received the case a few days before a major Seattle show, marked them up to $25 a box, and hoped for the best. I was mobbed and down to two boxes within an hour. I put those away (remember, I was saving for a store at this point). Desperate collectors hounded me and most other dealers for these cards throughout the show. Shortly thereafter I modified my business plan.
This was the show where I also realized the speculator market was exploding. I mentioned Harbinger #1 earlier. After selling two copies at cover price to customers practically apoplectic with excitement I marked one up to $5. It was gone in minutes. As a gamble, I marked one up to $10. It was also gone in minutes. I had left my other issues at home (backstock) but during a slow point I wandered the show to see what other dealers were selling their copies for. I saw one customer gladly plop down $25 for a copy. At future shows, I sold copies for $75 each, which is completely irrational for a new book with a multi-thousand print run. I knew it couldn't last (and it didn't, though the market took a long time to collapse).
More to come (or not, if this is boring just tell me to shut it. Although I'm kinda having fun with it).
Was this around 92? I can remember being at the comic con, talking to industry professionals, and every one of them telling me that it was all going to come crashing down. And it did. But no one could turn down the money...[/list]
No, this is fascinating stuff - I've always kinda wondered how on Earth some comic stores stay in business
And are you guys saying I should sell my embossed copy of Wild Thing #1? I'm pretty sure it's going to go up in price any day now
Great stuff noun, keep it up.
-- Xaroc
I'm enjoying it. Go on.
Keep it coming.
And maybe explain why my local comic guys preferred to pay his employees in comics rather than cash.
Keep it up, this is really interesting. I've got a box with the first 5 or 6 issues of all of Marvel's New Universe series. I'm sure it'll be really valuable in 2504 (for it's archaeological value).
Yeah, bring it on. You were doing all of this right about the time that I was big into comics. Marvel was the thing, back then. All those spin-offs and lame characters made entirely of muscle, like Cable. Ah, those were the days. Interestingly, I was into comics not for the stories, but for the collectable nature of them.
It's only recently that I've becomee engrossed in the real deal, thanks to a certain former co-worker who turned me onto Preacher and The Watchmen.
I'm enjoying it Noun, thanks for taking the time to write it up.
Great stuff noun, thanks for the info. I keep thinking that I'm in a great location for a comic/RPG shop, but I was just visiting another shop and they basically said that RPGS are d-e-a-d dead. *sigh*
Hah! Reminds me of a friend of mine who worked at a porn distributor. On his first day, his boss asked him if he wanted to be paid cash or product. :-)
Damn, don't stop now!
...said too much?
Part three: noun dual-classes to Card Dealer.
Something I neglected to mention before - I did a lot of market research before I got started, and kept on doing market research the entire time I was in business. Market research meaning, in this case, visiting as many stores as I could find and seeing what products they were moving, and at what prices.
I soon realized the Overstreet price guide I was initially using was all but useless in predicting current customer demand. In fact, I remember one of their issues contained a letter from the editor essentially stating they would never value issues less than a year old more than cover price, and that the whole market was being ridiculous about it. So when an upstart price guide/preview/hype magazine called Wizard burst onto the scene, and made current issue prices their focus, it soon became the magazine of choice and nearly drove Overstreet out of business. Eventually, Overstreet magazine relented and started to mirror current hot prices in their guides, but it was too late. The damage had been done. Such was the power of the speculator market.
I also learned that often price guides were of no use at all in predicting regional trends. Sure, Wizard was great at showing national averages, but a dealer still had to take into account local preferences (such as Sandman's popularity in Seattle during the goth scene of the early '90s).
Back to the story.
Now, the non-sports card market was almost entirely foreign to me. The only cards I've ever purchased prior to the X-Men cards were Star Wars cards put out by Topps in the '70s. But after witnessing the success of the X-Men cards, I decided I'd better start branching out into non-sports cards, and fast. IIRC, my initial card inventory consisted of Marvel Universe 1 and 2, the X-men series I mentioned yesterday, and Star Trek 25th Anniversary. Somewhere during this period DC Cosmic Cards were released.
After seeing most people were only selling boxes and packs, I thought I'd carve a niche by actually opening the darn things and selling sets and chase cards. So I bought a glass case, bought some plastic boxes and card protectors from a sports card dealer, and set to work incorporating cards into my display.
A brief explanation for non-collectors. A "set" usually consists of the basic common card set, usually 90-100 cards, depending on the publisher and series. A typical box of non-sports cards tended to yield 1-3 sets, again, totally depending on the publisher. Occasionally, some printing snafu would make sets nigh impossible to complete, and in these cases sets would end up being worth more than chase cards. A "chase card" is usually a subseries of a higher quality card with a gimmick effect, like a hologram, that can only be completed by buying multiple card boxes or trading for them. For example, the Star Trek 25th anniversary series had a two-hologram subset, but the holograms were only available one per case. Sports card dealers generally regarded non-sports cards as a nuisance contaminating their own hobby, with the exception of the Comic Ball series, featuring Looney Tunes characters playing sports. Most would change their minds later, as I'll explain.
Meanwhile, Capital and Diamond began offering more non-sports cards products through their catalogs. Comic Images started offering various series featuring known artists fantasy and science fiction artists. FPG also started doing the same for less obscure artists, such as Larry Elmore or Joe Jusko. My inventory was growing and pretty soon I had one of the largest non-sports card inventories at comic shows. The line was blurring.
Comics, meanwhile, were still out of control. Rob Liefeld issues of New Mutants continued to command big dollars, despite their horrible art. New Image comics were all popular and selling well, despite being complete and utter crap. (Yes, even Spawn, and I stand by that opinion.) Other independent comic publishers were really growing popular. Dark Horse, having been around for a few years publishing Cheval Noir and other arty books, started churning out multiple books based on the Terminator, Aliens, Predator and Star Wars movie licenses. Fans went nuts. Valiant started by releasing updated versions of obscure Gold Key comics like Solar and Magnus Robot Fighter (kinda like what DC did with Blue Beetle and Captain Atom from Charleton) but soon expanded their universe with their own properties. I already mentioned Harbinger. X-O Manowar, Rai and Shadowman were close behind, and just as popular. I was ignoring 90-95% of Marvel and DC's line and just selling the hot books, and the occasional silver age book.
Valiant books were just insane. Being a brand new comic universe, new characters were introduced every issue. New comics soon doubled in price just because it had the first appearance of a minor character. Even old issues of Magnus Robot Fighter, previously ignored and looked down upon, were flying off shelves. Image comics were popular just because they were Image comics. Early image was staffed by folks who knew how to draw, but not how to run a business. Early issues were often ridiculously late and even more poorly drawn then usual. But people still bought them. I didn't understand it, I just sold them.
I very clearly remember the beginning of the end. It was at a comic show in Portland, hosted by Dark Horse Comics. For months, collectors were trying to find a copy of Magnus Robot Fighter #12, the first appearance of Turok. The reason being, Valiant was about to launch Turok's own comic book, and investors and speculators were looking for copies before it came out. What they didn't know is that most dealers HAD multiple copies of it, but were hording their copies until Turok #1 came out so they could sell it for big bucks. Not me, though - it just didn't feel like a good bet.
So anyway, this show happened to come out right after Turok #1 was released, and the joint was practically littered with copies of Magnus #12, all having magically materialized from various inventories. One dealer had rented a table just so he could sell his two long boxes full of Magnus #12. Turok was all over the damn place. And not a single dealer sold a single copy. The investors had totally vanished from the scene. The worm had turned, and comics fans were pissed off.
Comics collectors were finally mad at Marvel for churning out garbage for the past few years. They were mad at Dark Horse for never making an issue #5; all of their movie comics were four-issue miniseries, the logic being that #1 issues sell better. They were made at Image for producing comics based solely on their namesake - image. They were mad at Valiant for lying to them about their collectibility, which was untrue - Valiant never tried to do anything but make good comics. The rumor of collectibility was a misguided self-fufilling prophecy. But Valiant felt the pain just the same.
I still had plenty of comics, but I had stopped buying new books from distributors at this point. It was easier to buy new comics from dealers dumping below their cost, and used books from collectors looking for extra cash. So I had very little liability, but a lot of folks were not so fortunate. I remember one well-dressed dealer wearing a tie who was practically in tears by the end of the Dark Horse show. He didn't sell a single comic; he had a table full of nothing but recent Valiant books, and collectors already owned multiple duplicates of each issue. There was no-one to sell them to.
I was still selling plenty of cards though, and by this time Skybox, Topps and Upper Deck started getting into the game. These three companies were staples of the sports card industry but knew money when they saw it. Impel, the company that made all the Marvel, DC and Star Trek cards I mentioned earlier, went belly-up and lost the Star Trek and Marvel licenses to Skybox, who were much more successful with it. Topps came out with quite a few movie card sets, as I later learned they had been doing so for decades.
Upper Deck, well.... they tried. I'll get into their disasters next time.
You are so right about Rob Liefeld (sp?) The man couldn't draw a proper foot. I have the issue of X-Force with Mother on it, which was Rob's first comic. It was worth about $40.00 back in 92, or 94....
Today, it's worth cover price because everyone realized Rob was a sparktard with no talent. Esspecially after Young Bloods.
Keep it coming Noun!
Great stuff, noun -- well-written, too. Please keep writing :)
Yeah, there's a website, or at least was, which had compiled a huge number of examples where Rob had lifted layouts from other books by better artists. Pretty funny stuff.
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