Piracy and kids these days

[WarrenM]

Wow.

So my young cousin contacts me via Facebook and asks me what I do for a living. I tell him and he's amazed to hear that I make video games and that's awesome and something he's always wanted to do. He'd LOVE the chance to do something like that!

And then he goes on to tell me, without a hint of sarcasm, how he burns all the games for his modded 360 and he did the same for his original XBox. He downloads them off the internet when they come out - he just LOVES games!

I haven't replied yet because I'm not entirely sure how to proceed. I'm amazed.

[Kalle]

Ask him what he thought of GoW2.

[MattKeil]

http://rlv.zcache.com/fasten_your_seatbelt_scuba_diving_humor_bumper_sti cker-p128227355858454367trl0_400.jpg

[Pogo]

How old is your cousin? Now that it looks like he may be looking up to you, I think you should try to get him to understand how you and your coworkers work hard on games and need people to BUY them in order for you to have a job.

[Skipper]

Possibly invite him down, take him to work and THEN tell him what Pogo just mentioned as he can sit and see everyone there.

[WarrenM]

Pogo

He's 26 so he definitely should know better by this point.

Thing is, I don't want to bitch at him and then have him go away and not bother talking to his grouchy, preachy uncle anymore.


Skipper

He doesn't live anywhere near me so that's a non starter, unfortunately.

[MattKeil]

Given the choice between pirating games and not playing games (because he's doesn't have enough money to play everything he wants to play), a modern teenager will always choose piracy. The conversation will simply show the kid he needs to hide such activities from Warren.

The interesting part here is actually that the kid is so utterly clueless as to the nature of what he's doing that he gladly brags about it to a game developer.

Edit: 26? Get a rope.

[kerzain]

You should be proud that he's taken the initiative to get as involved with games as he has. He apparently has a genuine interest in them, I think with a little help you could help foster that interest until he is capable of turning his passion into a career.

You should consider helping him find more torrent sites an whatnot, it would be a very cost effective way of supplying him with the tools needed to promote his budding potential.

He's young and impressionable though, so make an effort to only supply him with links to pirated copies of real video games, and not that Facebook crap. In fact, since I am biased towards PC games, I think you should try to get him more interested in the PC platform. Consoles suck, and they don't deserve all the attention pirates give them.

[TheTrunkDr]

Wow.

So my young cousin contacts me via Facebook and asks me what I do for a living. I tell him and he's amazed to hear that I make video games and that's awesome and something he's always wanted to do. He'd LOVE the chance to do something like that!

And then he goes on to tell me, without a hint of sarcasm, how he burns all the games for his modded 360 and he did the same for his original XBox. He downloads them off the internet when they come out - he just LOVES games!

I haven't replied yet because I'm not entirely sure how to proceed. I'm amazed.
How young is young? Is he unaware of how markets and industries actually work, ie does he realize not paying for things he likes could be bad in the long run? He honestly might not be seeing past his own wallet or might not actually be able to afford anything even if he could.

When I was young I pirated games and I loved games. Now I work making them and pay for them. Sometimes fostering the appreciation when they're young to turn them into customers when they're able is well worth it.

[Pogo]

Well, if he's 26 then he might not really have that ambition to go and make games like he says he does, but you could try to explain to him in a way that helps him come to the conclusion that people deserve to be paid for their work.

[TheTrunkDr]

Pogo

He's 26 so he definitely should know better by this point.

Thing is, I don't want to bitch at him and then have him go away and not bother talking to his grouchy, preachy uncle anymore.


Skipper

He doesn't live anywhere near me so that's a non starter, unfortunately.
Note to self: don't leave a thread for 20 minutes then come back and reply. Yeah he's way too old for what I said. Set him straight.

[Cubit]

Why is this in EE?

[Creole Ned]

Why is this in EE?
Maybe he pulled a Cubit (http://www.quartertothree.com/game-talk/showthread.php?t=57801).

[Cubit]

:) I like you, Creole Ned.

[Christien Murawski]

I dealt with this with my brother a few years ago w/r/t music downloading. He had tons and tons of music and had been taking it since high school. In college it was incredibly easy to jump on the network at the school and share everything.

It's a whole different mindset. I found he viewed music in much the same I way I viewed free Internet services like email. There was simply no reason to pay for it. To do so was almost absurd. It wasn't even like he was exhibiting a sense of entitlement. It was just the way it is. He saw music as free.

I had long talks with him about intellectual property and stealing and on and on. I saw his eyes open up on the subject. He genuinely got it.

Did it change his behavior? Not one bit.


-xtien

And then there's this...

"We're both a part of the same hypocrisy, senator..."

[Coca Cola Zero]

I don't think kids are much different "these days" than in the past, there are just more of them exposed to technology.

Every geek/gamer kid I knew in high school pirated games for their C64 or Apple II. Every single one! Granted that was like 4 kids, including myself... These days there are just way more kids geeky enough (given the lower requirements and more readily available home computers) to fit into that group... but kids taking/downloading things without paying for them when there is virtually zero chance of being caught isn't really a new thing.

Having said all of that, your cousin is a bit of a retard for bragging about pirating to you. At the very least he should be wise enough to not think you'd be impressed by it.

[Kalle]

It's a whole different mindset. I found he viewed music in much the same I way I viewed free Internet services like email. There was simply no reason to pay for it. To do so was almost absurd. It wasn't even like he was exhibiting a sense of entitlement. It was just the way it is. He saw music as free.

Not just music. Movies, tv, games. All forms of digital entertainment are at your fingertips.

[krayzkrok]

Personally, I'd encourage his interests in game development but while doing so give him a few home truths about what it's like, how hard it is to get into, and the impact of things like piracy. Don't mention that he's pirating, just mention piracy. If he can't read between the lines by 26, that's a worry. If he asks about it, tell him the deal but don't blame him. He'll either figure it out and it'll gnaw at him later, or he won't and nothing you say will make any difference apart from alienating him.

[TheTrunkDr]

Not just music. Movies, tv, games. All forms of digital entertainment are at your fingertips.
When it comes to music and TV it's slightly more understandable. You can already get those for free as long as you're willing to deal with commercials. There's at least an understandable disconnect there. Downloading a song and listening to it isn't so different from listening to it on the radio nor is downloading a TV show instead of watching it on TV or Hulu. Of course it's still illegal but there's an understandable train of thought there.

Movies and Games is less understandable as those are always for pay.

[idrisz]

contact FBi and rat your cousin out.. it's the right thing to do..

[Kael]

You need to hire a one armed man to teach him a lesson. A group of male strippers dressed as cops are optional.

[Lux]

Ask him what he thought of GoW2.

This, and then tell him he owes you 60 bucks.

[feanan]

you should message him back this week and tell him you just lost your job, because so many people pirated your last game that your studio was forced out of business.

[Diana Baba]

He's 26, not 6. Tell him off for chrissakes.

[Lunch of Kong]

Tell him to get a job.

[MattKeil]

you should message him back this week and tell him you just lost your job, because so many people pirated your last game that your studio was forced out of business.

Yes, and also note with sadness that if only one less person had pirated the game, the studio could have squeaked by.

[Anders Hallin]

If you really don't want to be preachy (though he deserves it):
"Great that you like games, it's a really rewarding line of work if you're at the right company.

(quote the modding part of his mail)
Since my income is 100% based on people actually paying for video games, I'd rather not hear about that part.

(insert other topics of conversation here!)"

[chequers]

If he told you that blithely he must either be unaware of how stupid the fact he said that to you is, or he's trolling you really well. If it's the first, just spend a few paragraphs explaining how much effort goes into a game and mention at the end "And of course, then the pirates take it for free" or something.

[lesslucid]

I think Anders has the right approach. Don't make a big fuss, but don't pretend it's not significant. Mention it, then move on.

[red guy]

Offer him a job as a games tester. Then watch him burn out, while you demand that he shows gratitude towards his uncle, who got him his dream job.

[WarrenM]

I sent him a long reply answering his questions and I included this note in the middle of it:

"And hey, as a note, telling a game developer how you pirate all of your games isn't really a great idea. It's more like a slap in the face. I get paid based on how many people buy the games I make. Downloading games for your modded consoles may be easy but it's really damaging to those of us trying to make a living out here. Just food for thought. If you like a game, buy it. Show the industry that you want more games like that."

Hopefully not too harsh.

[Jarmo]

That's a great response, Warren! If you care to share also his possible reply, that would be interesting to hear.

[Lorini]

My game developer acquaintance (who is now laid off, what a surprise) pirates all his games. It's very hard for me to understand that, but he's very obvious about it. He's an acquaintance, not a relative otherwise I'd talk with him about it.

My own 19 year old son however, is so anti-piracy that he's always lecturing his friends about how people need to pay for stuff and that it's stealing to pirate. Not sure how successful he is, but he hears a lot less about pirating :)

[crimsondynamics]

That's a great response, Warren! If you care to share also his possible reply, that would be interesting to hear.

I am most curious myself. Please share if you don't mind.


My game developer acquaintance (who is now laid off, what a surprise) pirates all his games. It's very hard for me to understand that, but he's very obvious about it. He's an acquaintance, not a relative otherwise I'd talk with him about it.

My own 19 year old son however, is so anti-piracy that he's always lecturing his friends about how people need to pay for stuff and that it's stealing to pirate. Not sure how successful he is, but he hears a lot less about pirating :)

That doesn't surprise me so much.

I used to work for a game developer/publisher and the CEO would personally hand me pirated games labeled with his handwriting on them.

"Here. Study these and see what ideas and techniques they are using in these games that we should consider for our next title."

He would use piracy as a barometer for a game's success. "Great job team - the game hasn't been out three days and it's already being pirated."

Then he complains when a game bombs at retail. Oh, the irony.

[WarrenM]

I'll share if he replies. He has a tendency to send me messages that I respond to and then he vanishes for 3 months, but we'll see.

[Pogo]

If that doesn't work, I'm only a couple hours from you and have quite a wide selection of baseball bats and knives.

[fire]

FWIW if a guy I looked up to said that to me in an e-mail, I'd either be totally cool about it ("yeah, sorry, I didn't realize") or just not reply at all out of shame. Ever again.

So, if you don't hear from him, you may want to ping him in a few weeks.

[Christien Murawski]

Your reply was perfect, Warren.


-xtien

[idrisz]

I think your cousin will look at email, reply with a sorry and continue his way.

Best thing to do is rat him out the Fed!!!

[Eric T Cheng]

Warren, if your relative is working, you should make a visit to him and steal stuff from his place of work. Entitlement can go both ways.

[kerzain]

I think your cousin will look at email, reply with a sorry and continue his way.

Best thing to do is rat him out the Fed!!!
Judging by the way 360 modders react on the net you'd think they'd be more scared of having their XBL account reported to Microsoft for piracy compared to some report to the feds. Any money and time lost because of a federal case pales in comparison to the hurt one might feel if their account was locked and their scores and achievements were wiped.

[Andrew Mayer]

Warren, if your relative is working, you should make a visit to him and steal stuff from his place of work. Entitlement can go both ways.

Please stop with this nonsense, or you're going to force me to derail this thread.

[WarrenM]

I'm shocked the thread lasted this long, to be honest.

[kerzain]

Warren, if your relative is working, you should make a visit to him and steal stuff from his place of work. Entitlement can go both ways.Just make sure you only steal digital media 'stuff' so you aren't depriving his workplace of some tangible item: this will help keep things even.


Please stop with this nonsense, or you're going to force me to derail this thread.

[Eric T Cheng]

Seriously though, I've always hated the excuse of "Games are so expensive!" as to why people pirate games. People can't afford $60 for a game but can afford a top end video card or a night of binge drinking? You don't NEED to have that game now, just wait a month or so when the prices start dropping down. Wait half a year for an AAA game to be $20/$30 as a "platinum edition" re-release (unless it's a Call of Duty or Modern Warfare game).

[Andrew Mayer]

I'm shocked the thread lasted this long, to be honest.

You guys want to have a fogey party, who am I to stop you?

Canes will be shaken!

[Eric T Cheng]

Please stop with this nonsense, or you're going to force me to derail this thread.

I was being facetious. :P

[unbongwah]

He's 26 so he definitely should know better by this point.
Tell him it's time to move out of his parents' basement and get a real job.

[WarrenM]

Well, he's been on Facebook. I see his status is updated but he hasn't responded. So odds are good, I'm not getting one.

[Acid]

I don't make games, but I do write books. When I find them online, word for word, for the taking, I rage uncontrollably. Warren, you've shown more restraint than I would have. I'd have ripped the little bastard's teeth out.

[WarrenM]

His Mom message'd me about it.

"please excuse Pat'swritings about the games. He always puts his foot in his mouth[a bit of a learning disability]. It is good you tell him about the other point as that is how he will learn. missing sandra...hope she does well. more snow here yuck. take care."

So, I dunno. Maybe I just told off a guy with a learning disability. Go me!

And I know she writes atrociously. I don't really know what's up with that.

[gameoverman]

I would have thought by now that people who make their living off of material that can be digitized had realized that it was time to plan for it.

Isn't it true that stores(brick and mortar) factor shoplifting losses into their operating expenses? You deal with it and move on. The people who shoplift are going to continue, security guard or not, security camera or not.

Same with piracy of digital thingys. I think the costs of losses, how ever you think they can be reliably measured, are factored into the price of a game. Therefore, piracy doesn't 'hurt' anyone. Good guy anti-piratey types can opt to NOT buy a game if the price is too high, or go ahead and support good games by purchasing them. The game developer gets paid out of the amount sold, the amount covering both legitimate sales and pirated copy lost sales.

The only thing piracy really does is force those who are selling into altering their long entrenched business model, or suffer the consequences. Nothing lasts forever, or the only that doesn't change is the fact that things change, whichever way you choose to look at it they(content providers) cannot hope to do business as usual anymore.

[sinfony]

Bwah?

[Gunmetal]

Well, thread's done!

[Kalle]

I don't make games, but I do write books. When I find them online, word for word, for the taking, I rage uncontrollably. Warren, you've shown more restraint than I would have. I'd have ripped the little bastard's teeth out.

Do you punch librarians in the face?

[Acid]

I donate copies to libraries. People who steal from libraries--I punch THEM in the face.

[merryprankster]

So, I dunno. Maybe I just told off a guy with a learning disability. Go me!

Nah, You handled it perfectly regardless. It's important people understand this stuff. I've never pirated a game, but used buy a lot of them used before I understood that the developer didn't see a dime for that. Some people will never care, and always look to steal, but it's worth explaining things anyway. Sometimes people are just misguided.

[idrisz]

So, I dunno. Maybe I just told off a guy with a learning disability. Go me!

a retard that can mod/download/burn 360 games!!!!!

[WarrenM]

Whatever his condition, he's still family, so please fuck off with the personal attacks.

[Rimbo]

He's 26, not 6. Tell him off for chrissakes.

Yeah. At that age, a guy should have all of the disposable income of adulthood, but none of the mortgage/kids/etc. responsibilities, and should be able to afford every damn game he plays.

I think your response was terrific.

He might be avoiding you not because you offended him, because he may be a bit mortified, and not sure how to respond.

[Acid]

Whatever his condition, he's still family, so please fuck off with the personal attacks.
Sorry. I didn't mean to offend.

As an intellectual property creator, I rage at piracy. I'm sorry I dropped the f-bomb about your family member.

[WarrenM]

Acid

Not you. I don't see where you called him a name. It's all good. :)

I was responding to this:

"a retard that can mod/download/burn 360 games!!!!!"

[Mrenda]

I don't think she meant he has an actual learning disability. I think she was jokingly comparing his complete lack of tact to a mental disability, as it's such a displayed trait for him.

[WarrenM]

Yeah, I certainly don't think he has some sort of actual learning problem. Although most of his status updates are fairly incoherent, I was just chalking that up to his being young.

[MattKeil]

Does 26 really qualify as "young" in that regard?

[idrisz]

Does 26 really qualify as "young" in that regard?

it's only young to people who are in the "Get off my Lawn" age bracket..

[WarrenM]

Does 26 really qualify as "young" in that regard?
I'll be 40 next month. He's young to me. :)

[MattKeil]

Well yeah, but that's what I meant by "in that regard." By 26 weren't you pretty much coherent as far as day-to-day existence went? I just mean that if someone's status updates are incoherent at 26, my first inclination is not to assume they'll grow out of it later.

[Lunch of Kong]

I dunno man. I look at some of the pretentious drivel I wrote when I was 25 and want to slap myself.

[Rimbo]

I dunno man. I look at some of the pretentious drivel I wrote when I was 25 and want to slap myself.

Me too. Hell, I look at shit I wrote yesterday and do that.

[idrisz]

Me too. Hell, I look at shit I wrote yesterday and do that.

that's because you were drunk, I mean you can't be drunk 24/7 right...

[Rimbo]

that's because you were drunk, I mean you can't be drunk 24/7 right...

uhm... yeah, that's it, i was drunk! yeah. totally wasted, yeah... wasn't sober at all...

[Matt Bowyer]

Well yeah, but that's what I meant by "in that regard." By 26 weren't you pretty much coherent as far as day-to-day existence went? I just mean that if someone's status updates are incoherent at 26, my first inclination is not to assume they'll grow out of it later.

As someone who is currently 27 and coherent, I agree with the other Matt.

[drake113]

that's because you were drunk, I mean you can't be drunk 24/7 right...

I accept your challenge, sir.

[Coca Cola Zero]

Regardless of how old you are, if you look back at stuff you wrote/said ~5 years ago and aren't at least a little bit embarassed by some of it you're probably not challenging yourself enough to get better at life.

[Kael]

Regardless of how old you are, if you look back at stuff you wrote/said ~5 years ago and aren't at least a little bit embarassed by some of it you're probably not challenging yourself enough to get better at life.

When you are older you won't believe this.

[rei]

Then again, there's no need to insert an apostrophe into "messaged."

[Pogo]

Does 26 really qualify as "young" in that regard?

That threw me off too.

"Young" to me sounded more like 14-18

[Shadarr]

Get off my lawn.

[Rimbo]

When you are older you won't believe this.

I think this is funny today. 5 years from now I'll be all, "Wow, that's hilarious, I've never read that before!" before seeing my response down here.

[Lunch of Kong]

I think this is funny today. 5 years from now I'll be all, "Wow, that's hilarious, I've never read that before!" before seeing my response down here.

Yeah. Every now and again someone will dig up an old thread and one of the responses will really grab my attention with its thoroughness and accuracy. "Wow. This guy is a real expert. Who wrote this?"

Inevitably, it turns out to be me.

[VegasRobb]

That's about as good as you can do Warren. I thought it was funny that you think of him as a kid when he's 26 because I do the same with younger family :)

[salwon]

Srsly im 27 nd i can rite.

[malkav11]

Yeah, I'm 26, make only a bit over 30k a year (not much, really) and am quite capable of affording all the games I play and plenty I don't end up playing. Especially now that I work full time and have a hell of a lot less time to play them.

[Jag]

I was more serious and responsible at age 26 than I am at 41 even though I am substantially more successful now and have the added burden of kids, house, wife, etc.

I think I've become the bumbling middle aged man I always despised, plus this. (http://www.quartertothree.com/game-talk/showthread.php?t=57800)

[Mrenda]

At 25, I am absolutely terrified of the world. I'll be finishing my degree this May (It took a while) and I don't know how I could manage a full time job with responsibility (luckily I will get neither a full time job nor responsibility given the economy.) I'm more assured of certain things than I was at 18, but I'm still a complete goof.

[Jazar]

There are people at my work (software development) who are in their late 20s early 30s and they have no qualms pirating like there's no tomorrow. Drives me crazy because it'd be nice to have local gaming friends to chat with but I will not associate with people who pirate everything.

[Demon G Sides]

I'm 20 and afraid of the future.

[Eric T Cheng]

I'm 20 and afraid of the future.

Once you've realized there is no future there is no reason to be afraid!

[Alex Pirani]

Just tell him MS can brick his 360 for modding it, and using pirated discs, and it's only a matter of time. That's how I got my younger cousin to stop doing it.

[WarrenM]

Well, still no reply from him so I'm sure that's the last I'll hear from him for a long time. Oh well...

[Rimbo]

Well, still no reply from him so I'm sure that's the last I'll hear from him for a long time. Oh well...

Have you pinged him again? Extended an olive branch?

If he really does look up to you, he probably is a little scared of responding to you -- and he needs to hear you say, "Hey, you can talk to me about these things, that's what I'm here for." He might be avoiding you not because you pissed him off, but because he feels ashamed.

[Mrenda]

It could also because he knows he has no way to justify it. I have known plenty of people to fully admit it's wrong but continue because they want free stuff.

[Lloyd Heilbrunn]

His Mom message'd me about it.

"please excuse Pat'swritings about the games. He always puts his foot in his mouth[a bit of a learning disability]. It is good you tell him about the other point as that is how he will learn. missing sandra...hope she does well. more snow here yuck. take care."

So, I dunno. Maybe I just told off a guy with a learning disability. Go me!

And I know she writes atrociously. I don't really know what's up with that.

He is 26 and has his Mom responding for him??

He has bigger problems than piracy.

[Eric T Cheng]

He is 26 and has his Mom responding for him??

He has bigger problems than piracy.

Bitty (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8orUaCJ0GY).

[Shadarr]

Not clicking!

[Scrax]

I think the issue is done and over with. It doesn't seem like he has a strong relationship with his younger cousin, as they only briefly respond to each other every couple months. His "love of games" doesn't mean he looks up to Warren in any way. Warren doesn't need to "reach out" and huggle his cousin. It's not really an issue, his cousin just embarrassed himself in front of his uncle, but it's not going to change their relationship.

[WarrenM]

I think Scrax has absolutely nailed it. :) Well said.

[Rimbo]

I think the issue is done and over with. It doesn't seem like he has a strong relationship with his younger cousin, as they only briefly respond to each other every couple months. His "love of games" doesn't mean he looks up to Warren in any way. Warren doesn't need to "reach out" and huggle his cousin. It's not really an issue, his cousin just embarrassed himself in front of his uncle, but it's not going to change their relationship.


I think Scrax has absolutely nailed it. :) Well said.

Ahh, okay. :)

[mkozlows]

Except for the part where "cousin" and "uncle" aren't reciprocal terms.

[robsam]

Except for the part where "cousin" and "uncle" aren't reciprocal terms.


Wow, I somehow understood that "cousin" meant "nephew" in this case and didn't let it bother me me enough to make a snarky comment after Warren has sort of said he's done with this thread.

[mkozlows]

Yeah, I went the other way on that one.

[kerzain]

Except for the part where "cousin" and "uncle" aren't reciprocal terms.
They are in my family. It's a unique situation to be sure.

[Rimbo]

They are in my family. It's a unique situation to be sure.

Mother fucker.






So to speak.

[Eric Majkut]

I was really hoping he'd break down in tears and realize the error of his ways over a cup of tea or something.

Oh well.

[WarrenM]

I was really hoping he'd break down in tears and realize the error of his ways over a cup of tea or something.
No, I'm sure he's written me off as an asshole douche and has made a mental note to pirate Epic games on day 1 in the future to pay me back.

[jfletch]

A lot of my friends simply have no respect for the idea of paying creators for their work. I stopped pirating stuff after college when I got my first job (and even then I never was a big pirater), but most of them just kept rolling. It's hard to recommend games when the first response is "cool I'll look up a torrent." I'm 28.

I really do think this is an issue for these industries, in that you have an entire generation of people who have no interest in paying for their entertainment.

[WarrenM]

Not that stealing music is any better, but I can SOMEWHAT excuse that as bands generally make their money on touring and merchandise anyway (at least according to a few interviews I've listened to). But game companies, well, we make money on game sales and that's really about it.

I think that the attitude towards music got extended to every other form of media -games, movies, etc. and the logic doesn't really work there.

[Mark Crump]

Not that stealing music is any better, but I can SOMEWHAT excuse that as bands generally make their money on touring and merchandise anyway (at least according to a few interviews I've listened to). But game companies, well, we make money on game sales and that's really about it.

I think that the attitude towards music got extended to every other form of media -games, movies, etc. and the logic doesn't really work there.

ehhh.

The music industry's accounting standards make the movie industry seem like they'd survive a SOX audit. Pretty much every deal is structured to fuck over the artist.

So, yeah, they may *make* the most amount on touring on merch (although those dollars are down), not buying the music can cause a band to "not earn out" and get dropped.

[WarrenM]

Yeah, I don't SUPPORT the stealing of music I'm just saying ... it's less damaging than stealing games since the games are the only real income source.

[gameoverman]

No, I'm sure he's written me off as an asshole douche and has made a mental note to pirate Epic games on day 1 in the future to pay me back.

I'd be surprised if he had any bad feelings towards you.

I think it's more like know he knows he really doesn't have any common ground with you- on gaming that is.

Who knows, maybe you guys have some other common interests. If you communicate with his mom, maybe she can offer some insight into what other things he's up to, then you can email him about that.

Unless of course you are completely turned off to the idea of having anything more to do with him at this point.

[Rimbo]

Well I support people stealing MY music.

[Strollen]

No, I'm sure he's written me off as an asshole douche and has made a mental note to pirate Epic games on day 1 in the future to pay me back.


Naw probably just written you off as old fogey. If he really want payback he post the torrent to your games on the forum.

I've got 31 year old nephew, who was in games business for a while, and sees absolutely nothing wrong with pirating anything. I gave up on pirating discussion more than a decade ago. Of course the self-center jerk also sees no reason to pay child support either.

[Jazar]

Hopefully he's just embarrassed and maybe a bit wiser for the wear.