Puzzle Quest 2: Awesome Subtitle Goes Here

[kerzain]

Whereas the original Puzzle Quest classes stuck closely to fantasy tropes, the sequel will offer the slightly more exotic professions of war mage, inquisitor, barbarian, and assassin. The game will also feature a fresh load out of weapons, spells, and armor, as well as new monsters and villains to vanquish. In addition to story mode, the game also features instant action, tournament, and multiplayer modes.

Gamespot Link (http://www.gamespot.com/news/6241575.html?tag=latestheadlines;title;5)

Joystiq Link (http://www.joystiq.com/2009/11/26/puzzle-quest-sequel-revealed/)

Now here's a game I have been looking forward to for a while. Galactrix didn't do it for me, neither did Puzzle Kingdoms, let's hope a genuine sequel offers up enough new game play to enthrall me all over again.

Due in 2010 on 360 & DS as far as I can tell. Hopefully PC is soon to follow.

[Murbella]

Hopefully they ignore the stinker that was Galactrix and make it like the first puzzle quest.

[RepoMan]

I bought Puzzle Kingdoms DS for my wife but neither of us have even played it yet -- the lukewarm buzz here didn't help. Here's hoping they recapture the mojo for PQ2 (the first PQ is still the only computer/video/handheld game she's ever played to completion).

[slantz]

I bought Puzzle Kingdoms DS for my wife but neither of us have even played it yet -- the lukewarm buzz here didn't help. Here's hoping they recapture the mojo for PQ2 (the first PQ is still the only computer/video/handheld game she's ever played to completion).

I actually liked Puzzle Kingdoms for what it's worth. I think it could have been great if they'd been able to spend more time on it. As it is, I think it was good. And I found things about its design a bit inspiring.

I understand why others were disenchanted with it, but I do think it's worth an open-minded try.

[Brakara]

Hopefully they ignore the stinker that was Galactrix and make it like the first puzzle quest.

I'm starting to think they just got lucky with the original PQ and have no idea what made it great. I hope I'm wrong though.

[PeterGinsberg]

I'd rather Steve Fawkner make Warlords 5, in the style of Warlords 3, but I realize that will never, ever happen. Still one of my favorite multiplayer strategy games ever.

[peacedog]

Galactrix was flawed but good, and had some good mechanics. PQ 2 should adopt the "no lockout" mechanic if it can. It should definitely take away extra turns on match 4s. And it should consider that shields worked great in Galactrix (it made it easier to stay in a fight), and see if there is a way to work a similar mechanic into PQ 2.

[Rock8man]

I wish they'd go back to the Warlords Battlecry series. Maybe making a few more Puzzle Quest games will give them enough money. I don't even mind if they re-use all the art assets from Battlecry 1-3 and Puzzle Quest again. (They re-use art a lot in their games).

[Brian Seiler]

After spending time with Gyromancer, I've become convinced that my central problem with Puzzle Quest is one of the things that makes it Puzzle Quest - I don't like two player Bejeweled. I like being in control of my game, and no version of Puzzle Quest that I have ever played failed to make me feel fundamentally out of control. I'd be interested in Puzzle Quest 2 if they were going to move toward eliminating the second player as an active mover on the board, but I have my doubts. I wish them the best, but I think it's probably just not for me.

[Hugin]

No hex grid nonsense, thank god.

[TheTrunkDr]

After spending time with Gyromancer, I've become convinced that my central problem with Puzzle Quest is one of the things that makes it Puzzle Quest - I don't like two player Bejeweled. I like being in control of my game, and no version of Puzzle Quest that I have ever played failed to make me feel fundamentally out of control. I'd be interested in Puzzle Quest 2 if they were going to move toward eliminating the second player as an active mover on the board, but I have my doubts. I wish them the best, but I think it's probably just not for me.
That's interesting and I have to say that I also was not enthralled by puzzle quest for a variety of reasons, though one is definitely what you stated. The AI controlling the same board makes it very difficult for you to plan more then just one or two moves ahead. You can't create good cascades and any that do result feel like pure luck. I also found many of the classes/skills to be very imbalanced.

I wonder if each player having their own board wouldn't be better?

[Damien Neil]

I liked the shared board aspect of Puzzle Quest. It does make it impossible to form detailed plans, but you've still got a fair bit of strategy going on: Not leaving good matches for the opponent's next turn, balancing your desire for certain colors with your desire to keep the opponent from getting other colors, and so on. I don't think I'd like separate boards as much at all.

Of course, I don't really like vanilla Bejeweled at all; Puzzle Quest is the only variation on it that I've ever really enjoyed.

[peacedog]

I liked the shared board aspect of Puzzle Quest. It does make it impossible to form detailed plans, but you've still got a fair bit of strategy going on: Not leaving good matches for the opponent's next turn, balancing your desire for certain colors with your desire to keep the opponent from getting other colors, and so on. I don't think I'd like separate boards as much at all.

Of course, I don't really like vanilla Bejeweled at all; Puzzle Quest is the only variation on it that I've ever really enjoyed.

I'm not a vanilla bejeweled fan either. I did like Twist, and the Squaresoft puzzler's Twist gameplay is pretty good (enemie moves are charged as you go. when they fire "evil" gems are placed on the board with timers, and if you fail to destroy the gem or win the fight before they go off, they go off and damage you . Otherwise, it's just you on the board).

I'm not opposed to different playstyles (particularly in terms of variants like crafting), but I did like the versus nature of the PQ and Galactrix fights. I think what hurt the gameplay was:

1. match-4 extra turn: just set up too many "god it feels like the AI is cheating" scenarios. I'd rather either keep extra turns to match 5, or possibly have an extra turn chance on 4 that never gets too high (Puzzle Kingdoms did something like this).

2. No More Moves - it could help you, sure, but many builds relied on large mana stores, and I found this frustrating more often than not. That also leads to. . .

3. The strategy was fascinating but a number of builds relied on not just building up large mana stores but sort of priming via buffs and whatnot. This tended to drag out fights IMO, and the scaling enemies (not inappropriate per se) combined with #2 meant a lot of fights could drag out too long. And having to replay them got obnoxious quickly (which is why I'd often play 15-30 minutes 2 to 3 times a night for weeks and weeks).

[Misguided]

I posted the following on my blog on the 26th (note this was before the press release announcing the 4 classes):

---
Gamepro.com has word of a Puzzle Quest sequel and a lone screenshot (http://cdn1.gamepro.com/screens/164216/157154-1-hd.jpg). I was a huge fan of the first PQ game (if you've never played it, which seems impossible to my feeble mind, it is a ground-breaking combination of a role-playing game and a Bejeweled-style match three game) and own it on PC, 360, iPhone, and DS. It stands as one of my favorite titles of all time. Unfortunately, while many have tried to duplicate the PQ formula, none have achieved that greatness, including Infinite Interactive's own efforts, which have been rather lackluster. So now we have word of a sequel, finally. Let's have a look at that screenshot, shall we, and see what we can learn from it.

The first thing of note is this is clearly a UI from the 360.

The character portrait seems to be that of a barbarian or berserker type. Note what appear to be offense and defense icons in the portrait square (perhaps bonus damage and damage absorption?).

There appear to be 5 kinds of mana, up from 4 previously, and the bars have been changed from horizontal to vertical. I like how the way Enrage is lit up indicating it is available for use. Before, purple was experience gems (pointless) and this screen is notable for the absence of both those as well as the coins (also pointless). The colors appear to be more distinct this time, which is a welcome change and the runes on the gems will be a boon to those with difficulty differentiating color.

There is a new type of "gem" represented by the fist icons. Note that this same icon is present under the character portraits, along with 2 identically shaped blank areas on either side. It might be natural to assume this is character level, but I'm not so sure about that. I'm wondering if these don't represent might or something of that nature, gradually increasing the amount of damage you do during a fight, which is an idea I like.
---

On a side note, I'm playing Might & Magic on DS and really like it so far, though I can't say I fully understand everything that's happening yet.

[BobJustBob]

On a side note, I'm playing Might & Magic on DS and really like it so far, though I can't say I fully understand everything that's happening yet.

You have that already? You jerk!

[slantz]

On a side note, I'm playing Might & Magic on DS and really like it so far, though I can't say I fully understand everything that's happening yet.
Oh man, how did I miss that? That looks good!

[Igor Muravyev]

Now they just need to figure out a way to share save games across all the platforms.. so I can play it on my 360 then go on a bus play it on my iphone! Oh is that too much to ask for?

[Marcus]

Now they just need to figure out a way to share save games across all the platforms.. so I can play it on my 360 then go on a bus play it on my iphone! Oh is that too much to ask for?

If the Kindle can do it then they could do it. It would be awesome if a cross platform game could do it.

[wigglestick]

I wonder if each player having their own board wouldn't be better?

A Puzzle Quest game with side-by-side boards like in Puzzle Fighter would be amazing.

[TheTrunkDr]

A Puzzle Quest game with side-by-side boards like in Puzzle Fighter would be amazing.
I think so too, it opens up the possibility for longer term strategies in what moves you make and makes it feel less like luck when you or your opponent get a heroic effort. Of course players would need some abilities to interact with the other's board but then that could cost them a turn collecting mana or inflicting damage to try and mess them up.

[Tortilla]

I think the dual-board idea is interesting, but it's not Puzzle Quest. Part of the charm of PQ was the chaos factor of the board. It kept the game at just the right level of challenging no matter how sickeningly overpowered one's character was, and motivated one to keep pushing that overpoweredness ever upward.

[RepoMan]

Yeah, unexpected four-of-a-kind streaks by the opponent is fundamental to Puzzle Quest, and if they remove it, it's not Puzzle Quest anymore. That element of randomness is indeed core to the gameplay, even if occasionally frustrating. I find that the times it swings my way balance out the time it swings the beastie's way.

[wigglestick]

Yeah, unexpected four-of-a-kind streaks by the opponent is fundamental to Puzzle Quest, and if they remove it, it's not Puzzle Quest anymore. That element of randomness is indeed core to the gameplay, even if occasionally frustrating. I find that the times it swings my way balance out the time it swings the beastie's way.

I did not play the first game long enough to have an opinion on this, as my girlfriend stole it from me and has not given it back yet, but in Galactrix the computer is always getting these godawful lucky streaks and getting another turn, and then getting another streak and getting another turn and I never seem to get them and it makes me a little bit crazy like maybe I want to hurt something and then I wake up covered in sweat and bloody tufts of fur and I have to stop playing for a day or two, does this happen to anyone else?

[Murbella]

Yeah it does really suck when you're easily beating the computer and then BAM BAM BAM they get a bunch of uber chains from one special move and you instantly die. Of course when it happens to you it is fun though.

I think i remember the developer commenting on this and how they made the computer cheat specifically to reduce this effect in galactrix compared to puzzle quest, but it was some time ago so maybe i'm taking that out of context.

And yeah, i felt the same way. Even though i knew the computer didn't cheat in my mind, it was hard to suppress the desire to call the computer a cheater after one of their instant kill combos.

[Alan Au]

I did not play the first game long enough to have an opinion on this, as my girlfriend stole it from me and has not given it back yet, but in Galactrix the computer is always getting these godawful lucky streaks and getting another turn, and then getting another streak and getting another turn and I never seem to get them and it makes me a little bit crazy like maybe I want to hurt something and then I wake up covered in sweat and bloody tufts of fur and I have to stop playing for a day or two, does this happen to anyone else?
Last I heard, Galactrix actually contains code to limit the AI ability to receive cascades. The main problem is that the AI takes it turns very quickly, while you take them slowly. Let's say you get a lucky cascade at twice the rate as the AI, but you take four times as long to think about your moves. Per move you get more lucky breaks, but you get fewer cascades per unit time, so you think you're getting shorted.

I haven't been on the receiving end of a one-chain kill in a long time, probably since I upgraded to something more durable than that dinky starting ship. I'm fact, my current build lets me indefinitely stun-lock the other player with my first move.

- Alan

[Misguided]

Oh man, how did I miss that? That looks good!

It doesn't just look good, it's fantastic. It might not compare favorably to PQ in the replay department since there are no classes, and it doesn't have the sort of customizability PQ has, but the battle system is a lot of fun (very challenging btw) and there's a more cohesive story so far.

[Brakara]

How is the battle system in that Might & Magic game? I just thought it was another boring DS manga inspired RPG.

[BobJustBob]

How is the battle system in that Might & Magic game? I just thought it was another boring DS manga inspired RPG.

You position your dudes and attack through the enemy dudes to kill their leader, just like the enemies attack through your dudes to get to you. You can also build walls for defense, and you have a spell you can occasionally use. At the end of battles you and your dudes level up, and between battles you have to choose which dudes you want to bring into battle with you out of all the types you have, some of which permadie when killed in battle.

Oh also it's a puzzle game.

[Misguided]

How is the battle system in that Might & Magic game? I just thought it was another boring DS manga inspired RPG.

The game was developed by Capybara. If you're familiar with their Critter Crunch game it will be easier to picture. But basically there are columns of units on screen in a grid pattern. You can pull the bottom unit off of a column and drop it back onto the bottom of a different column. If you make a horizontal line of the same unit type and color, it creates a wall. If you make a vertical line it makes an attack formation. After a certain number of turns (depending on the unit type) the attack formation will launch its attack on the enemy.

Meanwhile, your opponent is doing the same thing on his own screen, making walls and attack groups. Your attacks can damage opposing walls and groups, but the attack strength of your units is decreased by a corresponding amount and your real goal is to get your attacks past those guys to the back wall, thus damaging your opponent (think of him as the general commanding the army).

In addition to plucking the bottom unit from a column, you can also selectively delete a unit from the middle of a column. Things get more complicated with a variety of unit types, including elite and champion units, which have special abilities and their own requirements to activate. Then you add in linked attacks (multiple groups of the same color attacking on the same turn, yielding bonus damage) and fusions (two identical groups stacked on top of each other get condensed into one more powerful group).

You are constantly trying to decide whether you are making attack formations, building walls, choosing which units to make those attacks with to coordinate multiple strikes simultaneously, etc. Everything has a cost to it, and I do mean everything. Even having too many walls up can be a hindrance because it limits your space and because it can prevent large numbers of your units from getting cleared off the board. Getting units removed from the board can be a good thing, because the number of units goes back into your reinforcement "pool" and you can use a movement point to call more in. Sometimes having a massive group to call at once is useful. As another example, I'm not sure how I feel about champion units. Yes, they're strong, but the fact that they are 2 columns wide makes them harder to use and easier to attack as well as build defenses in front of.

The biggest downside to the game is a lack of a free look mode during combat, which is really a pain when you're trying to figure out what everything does. You can't view your opponent's units or even your own.

[terpiscorei]

Mark me down as another fan of Clash of Heroes. I like PQ a lot, but I felt like it didn't require you to make interesting decisions often enough, mostly due to the underlying Bejeweled mechanics. I think Clash of Heroes is very much the opposite-- there's never quite enough time to do what you want, unless you happen to be a bit lucky and a bit clever.

There's some nice variation on the standard battle in single player, too-- one battle has you defending a certain unit from being hit, another has you trying to avoid from hitting a particular unit yourself. The boss battle at the end of the first chapter is a great example of how flexible the game mechanics are. They also include puzzle-type missions, the first of which I was happily unable to figure out for probably 20 minutes or so.

The only major flaw I've seen is the one Misguided mentions-- you have to go into battles completely blind. The continue feature is also a little wonky, but if you save often that shouldn't be an issue. I'm wondering if some of the faction spells aren't a little bit too strong, too, but that's not really an issue.

[Misguided]

The only major flaw I've seen is the one Misguided mentions-- you have to go into battles completely blind.

One thing you can do is go into the free battles (outside of the campaign) and look at the units for the factions, including what their walls do, but it's a lot to figure out at first.

Heh, in that boss battle you mentioned, I didn't suffer a scratch thanks to prodigious use of unicorn troops. They might be a tad bit overpowered. As you said, there are some creative battles where you have to do things like hit targets that move each turn.

Not sure if you're in the second chapter yet, but the difficulty has really ramped up. I keep wanting to do some of the side stuff and getting slaughtered. Some of the puzzle battles are downright devious, and I think of myself as pretty good at that sort of thing.

As Mark Bozon said at IGN, I'd also very much like to have been able to see what level an opponent was before a fight started (this really begins to matter in the second chapter). I'd love to tell you how long I've played, but the timer runs when the DS is asleep.

[Cromulent_Word]

Hey folks, I'm from Capy, the little indie shop that made Clash of Heroes (and a long time QT3 lurker).

Just wanted to say thanks for the feedback - both kudos and criticism. Really interesting to hear what you guys are liking, disliking, and so on.

[terpiscorei]

I'm going to go ahead and start a Clash of Heroes thread so as to not keep taking over this one!