The Political Machine arrives

[Brad Wardell]

Shameless plug...

I know nobody...nobody on Qt3 is into politics and all but The Political Machine 2008 has been released. It's available digitally first and should arrive at retail at the end of the week.

It's a PC strategy game where you run for President. It comes with 4 different scenarios (USA 2008, USA 1860, Europa, and Drengin) along with lots of cool new stuff.

http://www.draginol.com/images/FunwithThePoliticalMachine_D557/image_thumb_3.png (http://www.draginol.com/images/FunwithThePoliticalMachine_D557/image_3.png)

You can take your player design and save them as an avatar.

Anyway, the website is at www.politicalmachine.com (http://www.politicalmachine.com).

[Moore]

yeay!

[azzl]

There's a positive review up (http://blog.wired.com/games/2008/06/review-politica.html) already at Wired, but they do mention a seeming inability to heavily customize your bobblehead avatar. Maybe you could add a Spore PNG import feature in a patch, to support the inevitable reign of President Dongzilla.

[XPav]

Brad,

Send this free to all major political bloggers!

[Kunikos]

Is your candidate flipping me off??

[Pogo]

Is your candidate flipping me off??

That's the guy I want to vote for.

[Troy S Goodfellow]

I was so happy to see this on my doorstep this afternoon.

Why does Kennedy have such big hair, btw?

Troy

[UncleSmoothie]

This is going to be an expensive gaming month for me. This, plus Bad Company, Operation Darkness, and I've already picked up the last Gal Civ exp pack.

EDIT: Hey, is this thing not available on Stardock Central? What gives?

[Brad Wardell]

There's a positive review up (http://blog.wired.com/games/2008/06/review-politica.html) already at Wired, but they do mention a seeming inability to heavily customize your bobblehead avatar. Maybe you could add a Spore PNG import feature in a patch, to support the inevitable reign of President Dongzilla.

As much as I hate to disagree with a reviewer...but he's totally wrong.

You can do anything with the bobble heads really. The guys here have made Snoopy, rats, elephants, aliens, etc.

[unbongwah]

This is going to be an expensive gaming month for me. This, plus Bad Company, Operation Darkness, and I've already picked up the last Gal Civ exp pack.
If it helps at all, the early consensus is that Operation Darkness sucks (http://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages2/929259.asp).

[idrisz]

If it helps at all, the early consensus is that Operation Darkness sucks (http://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages2/929259.asp).

Operation darkness, ugh..


I was just looking at PM2008 on stardock website wondering if anyone on here check it out yet.

[UncleSmoothie]

If it helps at all, the early consensus is that Operation Darkness sucks (http://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages2/929259.asp).

Yikes. I was totally into the demo. I cling to hope that those low scores are just because the pimply-faced 18 year old reviewers can't appreciate turn-based strategy.

[Alan Dunkin]

I so want to buy this right now.

Hey does the digital download work? If I want to buy it now and download it at work, can I do the same from elsewhere and just register similar to GC2 or whatever?

--- Alan

[UncleSmoothie]

That's what I'm wondering. The usual bit for Stardock-published games is just to load up Stardock Central to buy it, but this title isn't showing up there.

What's the deal, Brad?

EDIT: The deal, apparently, is that this game is available on Impulse, a successor to Stardock Central that apparently had gone completely under my radar.

[TomChick]

I'll have a full review up on Fidgit tomorrow, but in brief, I'm really digging Political Machine. HOWEVER...man, it seems like there's always a "however" with me...I'm surprised at how much of the original Political Machine has been simply ported over into a 3D engine without being tidied up first. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend this to any strategy gamer, but as a strategy gamer who was a big fan of the original Political Machine, I can't deny that I'm a bit disappointed.

Also, Bill "Rhodes Scholar" Clinton's INT is 6 and George "noo-kyoo-lerr" Bush's INT is 5? Brad Wardell is teh bias!!!1!

-Tom

[MSUSteve]

Yikes. I was totally into the demo. I cling to hope that those low scores are just because the pimply-faced 18 year old reviewers can't appreciate turn-based strategy.
Where'd you snag the demo Smoothie? I can't seem to find it.

[UncleSmoothie]

Where'd you snag the demo Smoothie? I can't seem to find it.

Operation Darkness demo was on XBox Live; if you thought we were talking about Political Machine '08, then I can only apologize for the heinous thread derail that I started there.

[MSUSteve]

How the hell did I miss that? I guess I'm just not paying attention. Sorry about that.

[Tim James]

Also, Bill "Rhodes Scholar" Clinton's INT is 6 and George "noo-kyoo-lerr" Bush's INT is 5? Brad Wardell is teh bias!!!1!
And So It Begins.

Regarding the game, is it balanced enough that you can run for office in a state that hates politics and the federal government and win without trying, like recently happened in Montana?

Because if there's a great anti-game for those of us that hate politics and centralized government, them I'm sold!

[BanGy.nz]

If only they had a mac version.

[Matthew Gallant]

Also, Bill "Rhodes Scholar" Clinton's INT is 6 and George "noo-kyoo-lerr" Bush's INT is 5? Brad Wardell is teh bias!!!1!

-Tom
I heard that if you make a campaign promise to unban DDT you will automatically win.

[Funkula]

Drengin

Hell yes. I may have to buy this.

"Citizens, you may have heard my opponent say that he wishes to crush all xenos who oppose the mighty Drengin empire and kill them to the last larva. This is unacceptably liberal, and the proud people of Drengin will never stand for it! If we stop at killing every xeno, we betray the principles our empire was founded on. Thus, my plan calls for the death of every xeno followed by their processing into food for our troops!"

[Brad Wardell]

I'll have a full review up on Fidgit tomorrow, but in brief, I'm really digging Political Machine. HOWEVER...man, it seems like there's always a "however" with me...I'm surprised at how much of the original Political Machine has been simply ported over into a 3D engine without being tidied up first. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend this to any strategy gamer, but as a strategy gamer who was a big fan of the original Political Machine, I can't deny that I'm a bit disappointed.

Also, Bill "Rhodes Scholar" Clinton's INT is 6 and George "noo-kyoo-lerr" Bush's INT is 5? Brad Wardell is teh bias!!!1!

-Tom

Oh come now, the new one is hardly a port of the original. It's a pretty massive change, especially in terms of the game mechanics. The original game's mechanics were totally obfuscated from the player. Now, you can literally see what each issue means, how much it matters and get scores.

As for Bill vs. Bush, well, Bush does have a Masters thoughk, admittedly, if I had to rate him now I would probably have dropped him a point. lol. Clinton's probably at least an 8 though.

[TomChick]

Oh come now, the new one is hardly a port of the original.

I completely agree. All I said was that I was a "surprised at how much of it was ported over without being tidied up". Maybe "ported over" was a bad choice of words, because it's easy to jump from that to dismissing something as a port. But my point is that it still plays almost exactly like the original game, which is mostly a good thing but sometimes a disappointing thing.

Bush does have a Masters thoughk, admittedly, if I had to rate him now I would probably have dropped him a point. lol. Clinton's probably at least an 8 though.

You heard it here, folks! The designer of Political Machine boosted Bush's intelligence by a point and nerfed Bill Clinton's intelligence by two points! Political Machine is teh unrealistic!

-Tom

[Brad Wardell]

You heard it here, folks! The designer of Political Machine boosted Bush's intelligence by a point and nerfed Bill Clinton's intelligence by two points! Political Machine is teh unrealistic!

-Tom

Well it wasn't my idea...it...it...it was Bruce Geryk's! He made me!

[UncleSmoothie]

Man, I'm loving the game even more than I remembered enjoying the first one, but it has to be the most unstable game I've played in years. Just over the course of playing for a couple of hours tonight I had no fewer than 6 crashes. You also can't load a game a new game once you've loaded a first time; the menu offers you two buttons marked "WAIT" in place of the load/save buttons. I've also had some ad campaigns for my candidate spontaneously turn into ad campaigns for my opponent.

This game will be damn near perfect a patch or two from now, I'll bet.

[Brad Wardell]

Really? It should be really solid. Could you PM me your system specs? I'll check it out myself. Do you have the latest video drivers installed?

[UncleSmoothie]

Shot you the specs, Brad.

[godhugh]

Is there anyplace I can download the full Impulse client? The web installer doesn't want to work with my proxy and the link to the full client on the Impulse website is broken.

[MSUSteve]

Well it wasn't my idea...it...it...it was Bruce Geryk's! He made me!
How dare you besmirch the brainy brain surgeon!

[TomChick]

Brad, as long as you're here doing tech support, is there any way to upgrade from the discs that were sent out (v1.00.001) to the version on Impulse (v1.01.023)? Impulse sees my copy of the game, but there's no option to download the update, and the "Update the Game" option on the launch applet just launches Impulse.

-Tom

[Machfive]

Brad, I'm definitely gonna check this one out. As always, here's hoping you got a solid gold hit on your hands.

With the intense interest in the election this year, I think your prospects are fantastic. Now you just need to get yourself on Colbert. ;)

[theblackw0lf]

For those that have played both, how does it compare to President Forever (another awesome campaign sim).

http://www.theoryspark.com/political_games/president_forever/info/

If Political Machine has at least the depth of President Forever, but with better bells and whistles, I'm sold.

[wildpokerman]

Really? It should be really solid. Could you PM me your system specs? I'll check it out myself. Do you have the latest video drivers installed?

A CEO who cares about a customer enough to check out a bug HIMSELF.

Wow. I mean just wow.

[Eric Majkut]

A CEO who cares about a customer enough to check out a bug HIMSELF.

Wow. I mean just wow.


Don't be so surprised. Brad has a proven track record for being fucking awesome. ;)

[Naeblis]

Brad is the CEO... and one of the main programmers, so checking a bug it's not so strange for him. ;)

What is awesome is the lack of layers between the developers and the consumers, and the direct action taken by Stardock given the consumer's feedback.

[fuzzyslug]

It's a PC strategy game where you run for President. It comes with 4 different scenarios (USA 2008, USA 1860, Europa, and Drengin) along with lots of cool new stuff.

Are these scenarios just part of the campaign? I kind of expected immediate access to them.

[UncleSmoothie]

The scenarios are available through the "quickplay" option. The Drengin campaign to become Lord of the Evil Drengin Empire is pretty funny - the default opponent (coincendentally? doubt it) is Dick Cheney.

[tylertoo]

Well it wasn't my idea...it...it...it was Bruce Geryk's! He made me!

This calls for a Tom vs Bruce on the Political Machine 08 in the next GFW...

...uh, nevermind.

[roboczar]

Brad, great job with this iteration of PM. I hope the franchise continues next election.

But one thing... why, why, why did you get rid of randomization? The thing that kept 04 so playable and fresh over the last 4 years was the fact that you could completely randomize election conditions. I didn't see this anywhere in PM08.

Can you please, please as a super huge favor to me maybe consider adding this in a patch?

[Troy S Goodfellow]

For those that have played both, how does it compare to President Forever (another awesome campaign sim).

http://www.theoryspark.com/political_games/president_forever/info/

If Political Machine has at least the depth of President Forever, but with better bells and whistles, I'm sold.

President Forever is a more serious sim, and has more depth. Political Machine has a better interface, shinier bits and quicker gameplay.

President Elect is still the game I want remade.

Troy

[UncleSmoothie]

The thing that kept 04 so playable and fresh over the last 4 years was the fact that you could completely randomize election conditions. I didn't see this anywhere in PM08.

Can you please, please as a super huge favor to me maybe consider adding this in a patch?

Seconded.

[Sepiche]

Crosspost from my impressions over at OO:

I picked this up off of Impulse last night and so far it's great. I didn't play the previous version so I can't make comparisons, but it's board game feel combined with the sheer fun of running a political campaign (especially with the way I've been following politics lately) is going to keep me up nights for a while.

My only real complaints so far are first that I could use more overlays for the map, especially ones that display my opponents information in different states (for instance one that would show my opponents awareness in all states would be nice, or even better show both of our awareness somehow). Second, I had a couple CTDs over the course of playing for about 6 hours. Lastly, the only major feature of modern campaigns I see missing is online donations and in general the power of the internet. I suppose it's a rather recent development in politics, but it'd be nice if it were reflected in more than just reduced ad upkeep via webmasters.

Oh, and add more shows to be on!

The bobblehead creator is an awful lot of fun too. I was able to make a passable version of myself and I can't express to you the joy of seeing him/me go on their version of the Colbert Report and lay down some truthiness.

In my first serious campaign I took Barak Obama as my canidate and went up against U.S. Grant. After an even start I went on to almost Reagan levels of victory with my opponent only managing to carry Alaska and Utah. Admitedly U.S. Grant is supposed to be pretty easy to beat I think since he barely used any operatives against me, but he did give me quite a fight for Florida and Texas and his running mate Lord Kang almost managed to give him Delaware. He ended up being weak on Social Security (which ended up doing him in in Florida after I started wall to wall TV ads and used my internet geeks to keep ad costs down) and weak on combating climate change (which helped me bolster my base a lot).

So thumbs up from me so far on this one. I'll have to see how much depth it has after repeated playings, but it seems good so far and I imagine unlocking everything and the future moding of the game will keep me coming back.

Edit: Oh, and one question occurs to me: when I started my campaign as Obama all the polls were pretty even between me and Grant, but when I used my custom character even though I had fairly similar stances as Obama I started down by about 20 points in almost every state. Is there some hidden stat that I'm missing or was this purely something to do with my stance on issues?

[Brad Wardell]

Are these scenarios just part of the campaign? I kind of expected immediate access to them.

You have immediate access to them. Hit quick play and choose which scenario you want to play.

[roboczar]

My only real complaints so far are first that I could use more overlays for the map, especially ones that display my opponents information in different states (for instance one that would show my opponents awareness in all states would be nice, or even better show both of our awareness somehow). Second, I had a couple CTDs over the course of playing for about 6 hours. Lastly, the only major feature of modern campaigns I see missing is online donations and in general the power of the internet. I suppose it's a rather recent development in politics, but it'd be nice if it were reflected in more than just reduced ad upkeep via webmasters.

I've never found that knowing your opponent's awareness is all that helpful in the campaign. The only time I worry about it is in tight battleground states, and I send in a host of operatives to reduce his. My own awareness has always been more important.

Agree about the webmasters, but you need some way to cut those ad costs. They can cripple your campaign. Maybe give the WMs a small (+1%) national awareness gain and 10,000/wk, and give the ad cost reduction to another operative type.

[Brad Wardell]

Shot you the specs, Brad.

Thanks. We're looking into it. The game uses Pixel Shader 2 which I know some of the XP video drivers on laptops are a bit flakey. If anyone else experiences a crash, feel free to let me know.

On my XP box at work, I had to upgrade my ATI drivers to the most recent version (and I had Feb drivers before!) to get things to play nicely.

[Brad Wardell]

Brad, as long as you're here doing tech support, is there any way to upgrade from the discs that were sent out (v1.00.001) to the version on Impulse (v1.01.023)? Impulse sees my copy of the game, but there's no option to download the update, and the "Update the Game" option on the launch applet just launches Impulse.

-Tom

Checking now. I have some pull so I think I can get them to expedite that. :)

You and Bruce were literally sent the very first two copies so it may be looking for the retail build which is the same code but may have a different number (i.e. v1.00.002 or something).

[Brad Wardell]

A CEO who cares about a customer enough to check out a bug HIMSELF.

Wow. I mean just wow.

Well it could be MY bug. :) Assuming it's not video driver related, during the beta, the most common crashes were due to my computer AI since it's all very multithreaded.

[Brad Wardell]

The scenarios are available through the "quickplay" option. The Drengin campaign to become Lord of the Evil Drengin Empire is pretty funny - the default opponent (coincendentally? doubt it) is Dick Cheney.

Definitely check out the European one. It's Europe through the eyes of a typical American high school student.

One word: Germania.

[Sepiche]

I've never found that knowing your opponent's awareness is all that helpful in the campaign. The only time I worry about it is in tight battleground states, and I send in a host of operatives to reduce his. My own awareness has always been more important.

Agree about the webmasters, but you need some way to cut those ad costs. They can cripple your campaign. Maybe give the WMs a small (+1%) national awareness gain and 10,000/wk, and give the ad cost reduction to another operative type.
Yeah, I wasn't so much complaining about webmasters, as I think they fit in well, but more complaining that they were the only form of the internet that seems to show up in the game. Adjusting them might work or even something like adding new operatives like bloggers. Something along those lines would be a nice addition and a nod to the rising power of the internet.

[roboczar]

Definitely check out the European one. It's Europe through the eyes of a typical American high school student.

One word: Germania.

I was kind of wondering if a high school student would really know that Slovenia is in the Carpathians though?

[azzl]

Thanks. We're looking into it. The game uses Pixel Shader 2 which I know some of the XP video drivers on laptops are a bit flakey. If anyone else experiences a crash, feel free to let me know.


I played for about a half hour last night before realizing I could zoom in with the mousewheel, which crashed me hard to a BIOS post as soon as I tried it. Running on Vista on a GeForce 9600 with the latest drivers...

[mittens]

I played for about a half hour last night before realizing I could zoom in with the mousewheel, which crashed me hard to a BIOS post as soon as I tried it. Running on Vista on a GeForce 9600 with the latest drivers...
Is that reproducible? Feel free to message me any more details on this issue.

[Brad Wardell]

Brad, great job with this iteration of PM. I hope the franchise continues next election.

But one thing... why, why, why did you get rid of randomization? The thing that kept 04 so playable and fresh over the last 4 years was the fact that you could completely randomize election conditions. I didn't see this anywhere in PM08.

Can you please, please as a super huge favor to me maybe consider adding this in a patch?

I think we can do better than that. What specifically would you like to see and I'll have us put it in.

[Brad Wardell]

Is that reproducible? Feel free to message me any more details on this issue.

Oh sure, steal my thunder. :)

[wildpokerman]

Brad is the CEO... and one of the main programmers, so checking a bug it's not so strange for him. ;)

What is awesome is the lack of layers between the developers and the consumers, and the direct action taken by Stardock given the consumer's feedback.

No copy protection, no lawyers, no bevy of Indian tech support reps you have to call and go through inane checklists to get your "support"?

Does Brad live under a bridge? Because the way other companies act you would think selling software would be a profitless enterprise if you use the type of business model that he does.

[Cubit]

new IGN review up:

http://pc.ign.com/articles/882/882716p1.html

[roboczar]

I think we can do better than that. What specifically would you like to see and I'll have us put it in.

I would be perfectly happy with something similar to '04 where when you start a custom game, whether it be single or multiplayer, you can check little boxes that say 'random electoral votes', 'random state wealth', 'random voter issues', and additional sliders where you can adjust the economic conditions, the war/peace conditions. Make it identical to the previous game and you've done the job. I don't feel you need to mess around with something new.

I just remember all those times I sent my candidate to wealthy, populous and liberal Kansas to press the issue of backyard oil drilling or resurrecting Elvis. Great gaming moments.

[Shadari]

I wouldn't be surprised to see Stephen Colbert give this game a plug on his show. He's pretty into games from what I gather.

[roboczar]

We were also a little disappointed that there's no real use for political clout late in the game. It's an absolutely essential resource during the early part of the campaign in order to pick up those lucrative national endorsements. But once you and your opponent have divided up the handful of eligible organizations, your clout just keeps building and building for no real purpose. It would be nice if there were someway to leverage that once the endorsements are all claimed.

I find myself agreeing here. It was a scarce resource in the first game when it was just one number, so you had to decide for sure how you were going to spend it, and you almost never were able to get *all* the endorsements. This time around, I pick up all my party endorsements and maybe a couple cross-party ones too, just for good measure.

[TomChick]

At first, I thought maybe there were going to let candidates snatch endorsements from each other, which would have been pretty cool in terms of gameplay, even if there's no real world analog for it. Imagine stressing environmental issues and then having to spend clout paying tug of war with the Environmentalist's Club. That would have played wonderfully into the game's system of shifting the importance of different issues.

But, yeah, I'm not convinced the whole clout system works. I get the feeling the intention was that you'd have to keep up with consulting firms to avoid a "clout gap" between you and your opponent. But those consulting firms are awfully expensive given that they're going to eventually just generate awareness, which you can get much more cheaply. And the endorsements seem pretty hardcoded to the either party. At least they do some cute things with endorsements in the other scenarios.

-Tom

[Brad Wardell]

new IGN review up:

http://pc.ign.com/articles/882/882716p1.html

Yea, I read this. I like Steve and I think it's a fair review to a degree but here's the basic problem: It's a $20 game. The scope is going to be, literally, less than half of a AAA game.

On a $20 game I can't put a GalCiv or Sins of a Solar Empire level of features in there. There has to be some sort of connection between the value and the content.

As a game, I contend that The Political Machine is a better game than either GalCiv or Sins. It has very crisp game mechanics, good replayability, and is just plain fun. But it clearly doesn't have anywhere near the scope and depth of a $40 to $50 game.

Obviously, if 7's are a sign of things to come, we probably won't attempt to do "budget" titles again (unless the sales are high enough to offset the reviews).

[Brad Wardell]

I would be perfectly happy with something similar to '04 where when you start a custom game, whether it be single or multiplayer, you can check little boxes that say 'random electoral votes', 'random state wealth', 'random voter issues', and additional sliders where you can adjust the economic conditions, the war/peace conditions. Make it identical to the previous game and you've done the job. I don't feel you need to mess around with something new.

I just remember all those times I sent my candidate to wealthy, populous and liberal Kansas to press the issue of backyard oil drilling or resurrecting Elvis. Great gaming moments.

Ah I see what you mean. I think we can put that in an update.

[MSUSteve]

Obviously, if 7's are a sign of things to come, we probably won't attempt to do "budget" titles again (unless the sales are high enough to offset the reviews).
Do review scores really factor that much into a decision like that? I'm a bit surprised given the bevy of titles that receive great critical acclaim and yet sell terribly (Psychonauts, Okami, and the latest: Boom Blox) and the equally large list of titles that get terrible reviews and still sell well.

[Brad Wardell]

Do review scores really factor that much into a decision like that? I'm a bit surprised given the bevy of titles that receive great critical acclaim and yet sell terribly (Psychonauts, Okami, and the latest: Boom Blox) and the equally large list of titles that get terrible reviews and still sell well.

I'm not sure. Clearly, price affects scope.

I mean, the Spore creature editor is $10. And I'm in the camp that thinks it's really cool. But clearly, the price sets the scope.

Now, a game like The Political Machine is largely critic proof because it's a "casual" mainstream game (I was on MSNBC yesterday for instance).

I know I can speak for the team when I say we'd rather work on a game that is beloved by the people we respect (Qt3 people are an excellent sampling of the people we want to make games for) than a game that gets panned but makes lots of money.

[MSUSteve]

I actually thought Steve Butts' review made the game sound like a lot of fun. That, plus the great impressions here got me to download Impulse and to pick the game up. I think scores are only good for quick takes when one doesn't have time to read three pages of text, but the text is obviously what's important.

I respect that Stardock would rather make a game that is beloved over a game that's panned, but commercially successful. But if you're confident the game is good and there's a market for it, I can't imagine a 7.3 (which isn't a bad score in my mind) or a host of reviews in the seven range, would make much of a difference about whether you continued to produce games in the "budget" price range, right?

[TomChick]

new IGN review up

Ouch! That's like a 7.3 on the 7-9 scale! :)

Seriously, though, I'm glad I don't have to slap a number on Political Machine 2008. I love it, but it's one of those games where the problems I have are because I love it.

-Tom

[roboczar]

I'm not sure. Clearly, price affects scope.

I mean, the Spore creature editor is $10. And I'm in the camp that thinks it's really cool. But clearly, the price sets the scope.

Now, a game like The Political Machine is largely critic proof because it's a "casual" mainstream game (I was on MSNBC yesterday for instance).

I know I can speak for the team when I say we'd rather work on a game that is beloved by the people we respect (Qt3 people are an excellent sampling of the people we want to make games for) than a game that gets panned but makes lots of money.

Note the lowest score he gave was in terms of replayability. Not to toot my own horn, but I think if you add that randomization in there, you'll bet more positive buzz.

[Brad Wardell]

I actually thought Steve Butts' review made the game sound like a lot of fun. That, plus the great impressions here got me to download Impulse and to pick the game up. I think scores are only good for quick takes when one doesn't have time to read three pages of text, but the text is obviously what's important.

I respect that Stardock would rather make a game that is beloved over a game that's panned, but commercially successful. But if you're confident the game is good and there's a market for it, I can't imagine a 7.3 (which isn't a bad score in my mind) or a host of reviews in the seven range, would make much of a difference about whether you continued to produce games in the "budget" price range, right?

It depends. I would have to talk to the team and see how they feel. They REALLY like working on things like the fantasy strategy game and GalCiv and such. And odds are, those will get great reviews too.

TPM is a really good game but I can tell you low ratings sting them because they want the respect of their peers.

I think Steve did a really good job with the review overall, I just think it's a matter of whether one believes price and scope should be related or not.

[Machfive]

(I was on MSNBC yesterday for instance).

I hope you don't mind me linking to it. The video:

http://video.msn.com/video.aspx?mkt=en-us&vid=6f1d251d-4c0f-4f32-abb2-405e3ea0ce5d&fg=rss&from=34

Nice interview, btw.

[mittens]

I know I can speak for the team when I say we'd rather work on a game that is beloved by the people we respect (Qt3 people are an excellent sampling of the people we want to make games for) than a game that gets panned but makes lots of money.
Absolutely true.

[Cubit]

The more I read on these forums, the more I come to know that Brad Wardell and the team at Stardock embody much of the good that can and is coming out of PC gaming today. Thanks for providing an example that I wish all developers, pc or console, would follow.

[azzl]

Is that reproducible? Feel free to message me any more details on this issue.

Could not reproduce this issue after a few more hours of play, so please disregard. Probably a random system glitch.

Really enjoying it so far on my desktop machine, but sadly it doesn't work on my Lifebook U810 which has an Intel 945GM GPU. I presume some some required DX feature isn't available since I get a "Failure to initialize graphics' type error. I don't suppose there's an option for less fancy rendering?

[mittens]

Really enjoying it so far on my desktop machine, but sadly it doesn't work on my Lifebook U810 which has an Intel 945GM GPU. I presume some some required DX feature isn't available since I get a "Failure to initialize graphics' type error. I don't suppose there's an option for less fancy rendering?
I sent you some more specific information but it's worth noting that Intel cards are notorious for being kind of a pain; old drivers for the GPUs have a tendency to report support for features that the card does not actually support.

Your card was one of the ones that we specifically tested during development, though, so it should be fine.

[MSUSteve]

I installed PM08 last night and got caught up creating my character before bed and never actually got into the game. Anyone that says the bobbleheads aren't customizable enough simply isn't trying. I had a ball crafting my bobblehead to look at least vaguely like me. Every little piece can be tweaked in terms of size, position, pitch, yaw, etc. I can't wait to get my shiny bobblehead onto the campaign trail.

I did go through all of the Tutorial text, which was enjoyable enough and not too long either. I would've liked a playable tutorial of course, but hopefully I can use the text to sort of teach myself how to play.

[Cubit]

new Gamespot review is up:

http://www.gamespot.com/pc/strategy/thepoliticalmachine2008/review.html

[Lunch of Kong]

Is your candidate flipping me off??

No, that's a terrorist hand gesture.

[Lunch of Kong]

I wouldn't be surprised to see Stephen Colbert give this game a plug on his show. He's pretty into games from what I gather.

Dude. Make a Bobblehead Stephen Colbert, and then Digg it as a continuation of his '08 campaign.

[mittens]

Dude. Make a Bobblehead Stephen Colbert, and then Digg it as a continuation of his '08 campaign.
There is a Colbert bobblehead in the game already, actually.

[fuzzyslug]

Lord, keep me away from this game. I can't stay away from that damn next turn button, at least until the election results start flying by.

I have to say that Tom and the GameSpot review have a legitimate point. 2008 is very much the same in terms of mechanics. That said, I'm not sure if it that is much of a complaint given the price. It's a bit of a roster and graphics update, much like a new release of Madden or NCAA, for something that really needs a roster refresh every four years.

[Brad Wardell]

Lord, keep me away from this game. I can't stay away from that damn next turn button, at least until the election results start flying by.

I have to say that Tom and the GameSpot review have a legitimate point. 2008 is very much the same in terms of mechanics. That said, I'm not sure if it that is much of a complaint given the price. It's a bit of a roster and graphics update, much like a new release of Madden or NCAA, for something that really needs a roster refresh every four years.

I was about to say. The core game of a Madden game or basketball game is pretty much the same too. Or heck, Warcraft 2 and Warcraft 3 or Starcraft 1/2.

Most of what I've read are good points -- if it were a $50 game. The game's price is closer to the Spore creature editor than to Civilization or whatever.

I read through the reviews and think "Yep. I agree." I can't even list a single thing I really disagree with from any of the reviews. I just think at the end of the day, the question is, what should one expect out of a $20 game? You might even say it has half the play time of say a $40 game.

I was talking to a friend of mine who designed the original Defender of the Crown (the original Amiga version) years ago and we were saying how cool it would be to be able to go back and remake some of those classic games. The problem is, back then, the scope of those games was pretty small compared to today.

We've talked about rating systems to death on Qt3 over the year and no where does the rating system fall apart than on a $20 game that has very high production values. Because you read the text of the review and they're spot on. It's just when you see the end rating that it seems odd.

I don't think it's a problem with the reviews as much as the review criteria just doesn't really have a way of handling a game like this -- a high polish game with a small scope.

[divorced]

Man, I cannot WAIT to play this one! Been playing the old version in anticipation.

[jpinard]

Played it about 12 hours so far and done all the scenarios except the full campaign.

I'm enjoying the gamme immensely, but I do understand what some people are saying. Despite the "under-the-hood" stuff being different the mechanics appear to be utilized the same as before with a graphical upgrade.

One thing that definitely needs to be added is a randomizer. I'm sure adding new play modes for us modders is a snap (Is Objectx used for that?) and I've got some neat ideas I'd like to create for an additional scenario... but what would make it best is some degree of control for random variables. Say when you go to start the typical 2008 scenario - maybe alien invasion could be the top priority vs. the economy. This would make your standard character have to take a much different tact if he's not strong in that area. Here's an idea of what I'm thinking at the start screen.

Here's what I'm thinking:

When you go to start a game have a similar interface start option like Gal Civ.

Issues by State:
* No Change
* 25% randomness
* 50% randomness
* 100% randomness

National Issue Importance:
* No Change
* 25% randomness
* 50% randomness
* 100% randomness

Party Affiliation:
* No Change
* 10% random variable
* 20% random variable
* 50% random variable

The only thing it needs is to have that variability added. And maybe have the starting stats (on the issues) be much more influential.

[divorced]

Saw the 1UP review today. They gave it a "C" which seemed harsh to me. He said he wanted a game he could play more than twice, but I'm not even sure what he meant by that. Maybe I misunderstood the point of his review. Is he saying that there isn't enough randomization? I haven't played it yet, but it seems like that would be complaining that each game of madden is alike because it's football each time.

[Jason McCullough]

The 1UP review is amusing (http://www.1up.com/do/reviewPage?cId=3168376&p=1&sec=REVIEWS).

1. It's not realistic enough.
2. It's too cynical.
3. It's not replayable enough for some unspecified reason. Never mind it's $20 already.

[divorced]

The 1UP review is amusing (http://www.1up.com/do/reviewPage?cId=3168376&p=1&sec=REVIEWS).

1. It's not realistic enough.
2. It's too cynical.
3. It's not replayable enough for some unspecified reason. Never mind it's $20 already.


I think it's a silly review. I have played 3 games and find it plenty replayable, but I also have realistic expectations. I don't expect each game to be a 100% completely new experience any more than each game of Madden would be. Yes, some more randomization would be nice. It would be cool for state's strengths to be able to be randomized. Make it where North Dakota is the big piece of pie everyone is shooting for! But for $20, and supporting the class of the gaming development community, this is a no brainer if you have any interest at all in the subject.

[Funkula]

He said he wanted a game he could play more than twice, but I'm not even sure what he meant by that.

Maybe he figured that once as a Republican and once as a Democrat showed its full range.

[TomChick]

I don't have any insider knowledge, but I would bet dollars to donuts that Stardock will add randomized stats in a patch. I'm a bit surprised the randomization didn't survive the transition from the old version, but it's pretty loud and clear that's what people want. And when people want something, Stardock tends to listen. :)

-Tom

[Alan Dunkin]

I think it's a silly review. I have played 3 games and find it plenty replayable, but I also have realistic expectations. I don't expect each game to be a 100% completely new experience any more than each game of Madden would be. Yes, some more randomization would be nice. It would be cool for state's strengths to be able to be randomized.

Honestly I don't think randomization is too much to ask for.

--- Alan

[mittens]

Honestly I don't think randomization is too much to ask for.
If I'm remembering correctly, when we were running towards the end of the game's short development cycle we cut randomization from the list because we didn't think people actually enjoyed it all that much. Hearing the post-release feedback, of course, changed that conception quite quickly.

[OblivionSHO]

I just recieved The Political Machine from Amazon yesterday. So far, I am having a really fun time learning how to play this game so I am very happy I ordered it, and even more happy that it only cost $20.

Even though Brad is a "filthy republican" (Don't deny it Brad! ;) ) He and his team sure put out some good games.

[Shadari]

When is this game coming to Steam?

[Cubit]

When is this game coming to Steam?

I would highly doubt that it will come to Steam, seeing as how it is released on Stardock's own distribution platform Impulse.

[fuzzyslug]

My only real complaint so far is that I hate the higher gas prices issue. What politician in their right mind would come out for higher gas prices?

[CommunistWalrus]

My only real complaint so far is that I hate the higher gas prices issue. What politician in their right mind would come out for higher gas prices?

My opponent, according to my television spots.

[Gremlinclr]

My opponent, according to my television spots.

So is there any ingame penalty for lying about things like that? Like will my opponent accuse me of lying or something? Really I never thought of doing that. I was just attacking him on his actual stance.

I would no doubt make a bad politician.

[jpinard]

So is there any ingame penalty for lying about things like that? Like will my opponent accuse me of lying or something?

Good question.

[TomChick]

One of the many things not clear in the game is the difference between support an issue and saying your opponent opposes the issue.

The manual implies that a candidate with a high credibility rating will be more effective attacking his opponent, and his opponent's ads will be less effective if they're attacking him. But as near as I can tell, other than comparing two candidates' credibility ratings and just always going on the attack if your credibility is higher, I have no idea how that translates into the game. You'll note that ads and speeches, I think, show a little credibility modifier icon when you attack your opponent, but I don't think its value ever changes, even when your credibility is lower.

But either way, no, there's no penalty for "lying" about your opponent, because there's no lying in Political Machine. The issue system is based entirely on perception, which varies by geography, political leaning, and the effect of speeches and advertising.

-Tom

[Brad Wardell]

So is there any ingame penalty for lying about things like that? Like will my opponent accuse me of lying or something? Really I never thought of doing that. I was just attacking him on his actual stance.

I would no doubt make a bad politician.

Depends on your definition of lying is.

I've seen plenty of people saying how Obama must be for high gas prices because he isn't in favor of more drilling.

[Unicorn McGriddle]

Swiftboating doesn't get real politicians in trouble; why should it be any different in the game?

[Machfive]

Brad, any sales results come in yet?

[UncleSmoothie]

I've noticed that attacks (i.e. "My opponent supports high gas prices) in speeches and in ads tends to lower the prominence of the issue.

For example, if in a given state, the top 5 issues are:

1. The War on Terror
2. High Gas Prices
3. More Jobs
4. Illegal Immigration
5. The Environment

and I give a speech saying that my opponent is for high gas prices, that issue will fall out of the top 5. If, on the other hand, I give a speech saying that I am against high gas prices, the issue will rise in prominence.

I think this is the way that the game penalizes negative campaigning; you'll take your opponent down a notch on a particular issue, but then that issue becomes relatively unimportant because voters tend to be turned off by attacks.

Am I nuts with this theory? I'm pretty sure this is the way it's been working in my games.

[Brad Wardell]

Brad, any sales results come in yet?

We got the first week's sales in and they were very high but everything does well its first week. But it hasn't yet gotten into most channels so it won't be appearing on NPD (Best Buy JUST ordered it for instance).

Re what Unicorn said: He's absolutely right. In some of the reviews I see a lot of projection of how people wish politics were rather than how they actually are.

Maybe in someone's ideal world "swift boating" wouldn't be so effective. But the fact is, it is effective. Saying something about your opponent enough times without them countering it will make people think that is that person's position.

[TomChick]

Don't leave us hanging about the differences between an ad or speech in favor of something, and one that says your opponent opposes it! I know credibility is supposed to come into play, but how? And is Uncle Smoothie's theory true? It sounds wrong to me, but I'd love to know.

I just launched a campaign (http://fidgit.com/archives/2008/07/political-machine-2008-preside.php) and these are the sorts of things I need to know to keep John McCain out of office.

-Tom

[mittens]

Am I nuts with this theory? I'm pretty sure this is the way it's been working in my games.
It depends if you're playing an up-to-date version of the game; before v1.02 (I think) there was a bug where giving a speech on an issue would reset the important and position on that issue and would cause it to decrease in importance for the state that it's in.

If you're playing an up-to-date version of the game then, well, that's undesired functionality. Giving a speech or creating an ad on an issue should always raise the issue's importance.

[ZekeDMS]

Well, I'm certainly enjoying the game, even if being distracted or irritated by some typoes and stats I find uncertain. The intelligence stat seems a bit less of intelligence and more eloquence, at least in my own view, or rhetorical ability. Maybe just a bias toward the right wing with intelligence scores that seems off to me ;)

I am disappointed by a lack of Kucinich in this! There's Ron Paul, but not his left wing equivalent? I totally wanted to use the "hot wife" bonus!

[UncleSmoothie]

I was indeed playing with an older version; I haven't been on Impulse since I bought it so I haven't patched the game.

Doh. I thought I was being a keen observer of the nuances of TPM's gameplay.

[mittens]

Doh. I thought I was being a keen observer of the nuances of TPM's gameplay.
You most certainly were a keen observer; I just see the code, so I have a lower level of observations.

[Tim James]

My only real complaint so far is that I hate the higher gas prices issue. What politician in their right mind would come out for higher gas prices?Maybe someone that wants to raise the federal gas tax to "push the market" toward renewable energy? Is the game that subtle?

[TomChick]

Don't leave us hanging about the differences between an ad or speech in favor of something, and one that says your opponent opposes it! I know credibility is supposed to come into play, but how?

No comment on this?

-Tom

[mittens]

Don't leave us hanging about the differences between an ad or speech in favor of something, and one that says your opponent opposes it! I know credibility is supposed to come into play, but how?
I always forget the specifics and I don't have the code on this computer to remind me, but the idea is that both ads and speeches modify your candidate's stance on an issue and the public's feelings on an issue. Speeches have an incredibly strong effect on both the overall importance the issue being campaigned on and its position.

The political score that you see represented by thumbs throughout the game (and as an actual value if you hover-over the thumbs) is the product of importance ([0,10] by default, though it can go higher over the course of a game) and position ([-10,10]; also can get higher in-game).

So, let's say that "Law Enforcement" is a particularly important issue for my campaign. The left, the right, and independents are in favor of enforcing the nation's laws; the variance on the issue is how important Law Enforcement is to each party. So I give about four-five speeches on the issue and it rises to the second most important issue in the state. Now my candidate, Obama in this case, is triple-thumbs-up in favor of Law Enforcement and I've raised the importance of the issue across both Democrats and Independents ten-fold. Democrats are almost always going to be voting for a democratic candidate so, while their support is important, campaigning solely for them can be a waste of time. The independents, however, can go either left or right, so garnering their support is a fantastic strategy. Now that their opinion on Law Enforcement is strongly aligned with my own, I have their support, and can further harm my opponent's chances of getting independent voters by giving a few speeches saying that he is against Law Enforcement -- this action will just continually alienate his base in the independent camp.

The biggest difference between speeches and advertisements is a matter of short-term versus long-term campaigning. An advertisement is far more costly than a speech but, once it's been in place for a long time it has a tremendous "time active" boost and, on top of that, the more expensive ads have a regional/national effect; once you put an advertisement out it's in a player's best interests to keep it active. Speeches are very powerful, don't cost a lot, but they're a one-trick pony effect: they're fantastic for quick movement on issues, but they lack the long-term stability of ads.

A candidate's stats come into play in the form of modifiers and bonuses that are applied to the various equations that dictate the effect of advertisements and speeches. Credibility is kind of a "defense modifier" against negative attacks across any medium. Charisma always boosts the effect of advertisements, interview responses, and speeches. Media bias is the primary stat for boosting the potency of interview effects. And comeliness has a small boosting effect on advertisements and interviews. These are the only stat effects I can remember off hand, though.

[Cubit]

This just came in my e-mail box:

Pick Your Candidate to Win with The Political Machine 2008 v1.5

* The Vice Presidents: Joining the race are Sarah Palin and Joe Biden , the vice presidential picks in the 2008 campaign. Will Biden's experience and Palin's charisma help pull in votes for their buddies Barak and John.
* Enhanced Multiplayer: Match-making is now supported via Stardock's Impulse, allowing players to easily and quickly find online opponents.
* Randomization Options: Keep each game fresh with new game options: randomize issue importance, state demographics, and more!
* Campaign Printshop: Players can take their custom candidates and print out bumper stickers campaign pins, and even working bobbleheads from within the game.
* Online Library: User created candidates - with customizable stats, issue platforms, and physical appearance - can be uploaded to our online Candidate Library for anyone to download and use!


Thanks Brad & Co. Looks like welcome improvements.