Incredible Hulk (08) impressions

[flyinj]

I really dug Ultimate Destruction, and am curious if this game is going to be as engaging. It's a different developer, so I'm a bit cautious.

Tom, you had a post on Fidgit today saying you've been playing it. Other than the fact that you can smash everything (which is awesome), what is your overall take? Anyone else play it yet?

[WarrenM]

smash everything (which is awesome),
Except the church, which is retarded. Way to break immersion to keep religion happy!

Having said that, if there is some logical reason why he can't smash the church I will happily take back my venomous outburst.

[flyinj]

Except the church, which is retarded. Way to break immersion to keep religion happy!

Having said that, if there is some logical reason why he can't smash the church I will happily take back my venomous outburst.

I'm almost positive it was done because of the Church of England threatening to sue Sony over having the Manchester Cathedral destructible in Resistance.

Fucked up, but hey, if they're going to sue you, there's not much you can do about it other than omitting the landmark completely.

[Moore]

replace them with brothels.

[Aszurom]

I don't understand how you can sue someone for allowing the destruction of a building in a video game. Does that mean France can sue if They Came From Hollywood lets Newtzilla knock down the Eiffel Tower?

[Cossix]

I'm almost positive it was done because of the Church of England threatening to sue Sony over having the Manchester Cathedral destructible in Resistance.

I didn't think the church was even destructable. You just shoot a lot of Chimera in it. It was actually a pretty fun level!

[Reldan]

I'm almost positive it was done because of the Church of England threatening to sue Sony over having the Manchester Cathedral destructible in Resistance.

I thought it was because Sony went into the church itself, took a bunch of pictures, and then recreated the exact look of the church interior inside the game and used it as a backdrop for a lot of violent bloodshed.

[dashingly]

I can't say I would be comfortable with purchasing -- or even renting -- the game after reading about the production (http://gamewatch.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=1278).

[Moore]

Yeah, it's the only game ever made by underpaid overworked people who never see their families.

[Tom Chick]

Tom, you had a post on Fidgit today saying you've been playing it. Other than the fact that you can smash everything (which is awesome), what is your overall take?

I'll have a review on Variety at the end of the week, but I'd say it's okay, bordering on disappointing. I don't necessarily recommend it.

-Tom

[Jake Plane]

I'll have a review on Variety at the end of the week, but I'd say it's okay, bordering on disappointing. I don't necessarily recommend it.

-Tom

Hi Tom. Long time reader and frequent poll poster here.

Here's my question: Did you feel the same way toward Hulk: Ultimate Destruction?

I ask because I can understand how not everyone would dig that game, but I certainly did. Basically if this is a next gen update of that game, I would be happy.

[RobotPants]

I can only assume he said it was disappointing due to having played UD. Otherwise, I can't imagine anyone being disappointed that a movie tie-in game turns out to be lackluster.

[zengonzo]

It was made by a different studio, for what it is worth.

The UD guys are now making Prototype .. Which might be what you'd want instead.

[Jake Plane]

Call me a bastard, but I'd like both.

I'm definitely looking forward to Prototype but I also would have liked (am still secretly hoping for) a decent next-gen remake of "Hulk: Ultimate Destruction."

I would be curious to hear how this version differs from the last one. In some ways I thought the last one had a great but simple addictive formula.

[Tom Chick]

Oh, I definitely liked Ultimate Destruction. My editor at Variety made some off-hand comment about how it was the best superhero videogame. My first reaction was 'No way', but the more I thought about it, the more I think he was probably right.

By the way, it turns out I was wrong about not being able to destroy St. Patrick's Cathedral. I updated the Fidgit thing accordingly (http://fidgit.com/archives/2008/06/the-theology-of-hulk.php).

-Tom

[Bill Dungsroman]

"HULK SMAAAAAAASH!"

[zengonzo]

Does Ultimate Destruction beat Crackdown? I missed out on UD ..

Jake, I wouldn't begrudge you both. I'd like to see a proper 360 version.

[WarrenM]

Thanks for clarifying that, Tom!

[Jake Plane]

Does Ultimate Destruction beat Crackdown? I missed out on UD ..

Jake, I wouldn't begrudge you both. I'd like to see a proper 360 version.

Similar games in some respects. Depending on your point of view, here are the differences IMHO:

Pros of Crackdown:
City Climbing
Multiple tiers of leveling (guns, cars, jumping, grenades, etc)
Completely Open World, tackle any enemy as you see fit, when you see fit
GTAish - you can go it on foot or car and with different weapons (sniper rifle, automatics, grenade launchers, etc)
Incredible explosions within the sandbox world

Cons of Crackdown:
No matter how high you level your character, you'll only ever be able to do that lame kick move.
No real "boss battles" - you're basically just shooting everyone; with some people better protected and harder to get to, but people nonetheless.

Pros of Hulk Ultimate Destruction:
City Climbing
Multiple destruction maneuvers (punching, sonic clapping, tank tossing, helicopter commandeering, cannonballing, etc)
Absolutely amazing and memorable boss battles (huge robots, other Hulk like characters, etc)


Cons of Hulk Ultimate Destruction:
Limited weapons (missiles, some melee)
Linear - if you get stuck, you're stuck. You can explore the rest of the world but not if you're stuck before an unlocked area

[zengonzo]

That lame kick sucked. Crackdown desperately needed better melee .. As did driving in cars - even when you had a good one. Somehow it just felt bad. And throwing things almost never worked well.

I liked the lack of bosses. I think it worked better for that game - where you are supposed to be physically superior and facing overwhelming odds. Just my sort of taste when it comes to super-stuff.

Being able to bring buildings down must be interesting, too.

So regarding Hulk's rampaging .. would you level entire city blocks, walk away and then come back to find it instantly refreshed? Surely you couldn't bring down the entire city ..

I'd love to see a game where the city has to gradually rebuild itself - a few levels every day.

[WarrenM]

Jake has me interesting slightly. I would love a Hulk game that was as open as Crackdown though...

[RobotPants]

The only problem I had with Crackdown was that it was too open. I like the fact that I could pretty much just go do whatever I wanted, but a little more structure would've helped a ton.

[zengonzo]

I think it could've used a little more character. I'm not sure in what regards, but the only invested characters were the bosses, and that rarely counted for much.

A Saint's Row-styled ally system might be good.

I could city-climb for hours, though.

[thamer]

I don't understand how you can sue someone for allowing the destruction of a building in a video game. Does that mean France can sue if They Came From Hollywood lets Newtzilla knock down the Eiffel Tower?

You can sue but it doesn't mean you'll win. Sony just doesn't want to piss part of its market off. Japanese companies have a very well developed sense of social responsibility.

[WarrenM]

You can sue but it doesn't mean you'll win. Sony just doesn't want to piss part of its market off. Japanese companies have a very well developed sense of social responsibility.
Tom already clarified that he made a mistake. You can break the church.

[ElGuapo]

Damn this review embargo! I want to know why it's not as good as the first one. Because if it's the EXACT SAME GAME, higher res with upgraded graphics, it's a Day One for me. Hulk: UD's fights in the street versus those hulkbusters were just awesome. Being thrown off a building, through a bus stand, and into a car, then recovering and running up the side of a skyscraper (leaving crushed bricks behind you), jumping off the edge, slamming into the hulkbuster, grabbing him, punching him on the way to the ground, then at the last minute slamming him into a taxi. Great stuff. Holding up a car as a shield while an M1 Abrams trained its main gun on you. Running sideways to try to flank it as it tried to track you then rushing it and slamming into it, shaking it and making it rock. Grabbing it by the barrel and hammer throwing it into another tank, or even more fun just right up into the atmosphere. Catching a MLRS rocket in mid air or punching it wildly back so it blows up a fuel tanker. Leaping, and just missing, at attack helicopters and passing jet fighters. Landing, ripping up an antenna and tossing it at one, taking it out.

It had the best superhero melee I've ever seen, and I'd be sorely disappointed if they changed that formula. If it's MOTS though, I'm in like Flynn.

[Jake Plane]

Exactly. More of the same is fine by me.

In fact, even less is fine by me.

If Hulk 08 has a lame story or less imaginative boss fights or shorter playtime - BUT retains the basic gameplay goodness of the first (see Guapo's note above), i'm sold.

Still holding out hope...

[Jake Plane]

And isn't the game out today? Shouldn't the embargo be lifted?

[ElGuapo]

Funny thing is there is not a single review on gamerankings. Is this game for real?

[zengonzo]

Wow, that sounds pretty awesome.

I sure wish Iron Man could've been so appealing.

[RickH]

Pros of Hulk Ultimate Destruction:
Multiple destruction maneuvers (punching, sonic clapping, tank tossing, helicopter commandeering, cannonballing, etc)

I liked H:UD a lot, but you'll really only use a fraction of the "moves" you can buy, unless you want to engage in a Mortal-Kombat-level degree of memorization and ignore that some moves are so much more useful than others. I'm thinking especially of the one that will automatically leap you up to aerial targets so you can SMASH them.

[Jake Plane]

my favorite was the one where you would slap your hands together causing a massive slow-motion sonic concussion to radiate out, damaging everything in the immediate surrounding area.

[BlueJackalope]

H:UD was the best superhero game ever (see El Guapo's post). And probably the reason I was all "Meh" about Crackdown (after I played it). The melee was really fun, lots and lots of moves and options (way more than you actually end up using, but all are fun), and the speed of the game felt just right.

I'm looking forward to Prototype, but I was hoping that I could play a next gen UD with Hulk as the main character.

[Jake Plane]

The Invisible Hulk seems more fitting. Figured after the work day at least one site would have a review. Zilch.

[Other Brendan]

The Invisible Hulk seems more fitting. Figured after the work day at least one site would have a review. Zilch.

It doesn't hit stores until tomorrow. Was there a review embargo expiring today or something?

[Jake Plane]

oh! I thought it came out today. where's the un-screed button?

[ElGuapo]

The game is definately out today. All the Besy Buys near me show it's available for pickup.

No one review, anywhere. Nothing on Metacritic, nothing on Gamerankings.

What's the deal?

[flyinj]

A review embargo that includes release day?

Not very encouraging. At all.

[Rob_Merritt]

The game's release date on gamestop is the 10th.

[Tacitus]

That's the PC version.

The console one is out today.

[Jake Plane]

Indeed. Best I could find was a player who posted his impressions after renting it. He was a Hulk:UD fan and said it's worth a rental but the smashing fun of the first was absent.

I'm continuing to hope that this game retained at least the core gameplay of the first, i.e. a crazy variety of killer moves

[forgeforsaken]

Indeed. Best I could find was a player who posted his impressions after renting it. He was a Hulk:UD fan and said it's worth a rental but the smashing fun of the first was absent.

I'm continuing to hope that this game retained at least the core gameplay of the first, i.e. a crazy variety of killer moves

I never finished H:UD for the PS2 but really liked it. So I've borrowed the Xbox version for the 360 BC and have started it over on that. Looks and runs really well on the 360. Still a really good game.

[ElGuapo]

Fuckit, I think I'm gonna pick it up on the way home. It's only $62, right?

It better be fucking good. I heard you can unlock Maestro!

/me am cry

[zengonzo]

Is there even a demo?

I'd say hold out. Achieve something new in an old game. Or pick up a classic you've always been meaning to.

[John Merva]

Japanese companies have a very well developed sense of social responsibility.

Are you sure about that, or is my sarcasm meter broken?

[Moore]

Fuckit, I think I'm gonna pick it up on the way home. It's only $62, right?

It better be fucking good. I heard you can unlock Maestro!

/me am cry

Hold! Think! Wouldnt you rather play UD again? It's already 720p iirc

[Jake Plane]

Fuckit, I think I'm gonna pick it up on the way home. It's only $62, right?

It better be fucking good. I heard you can unlock Maestro!

/me am cry

Allow me to be the ID to Moore and zengonzo's Superego recommendations.

*ahem*

Do it.

[Moore]

actually I just read it has 1 vs.1 online MP.

now I might grab it this weekend myself....

sigh.. just bought ng2, not done w/ gtaIV yet...

[Alex Dolce]

Tell me about it. I just picked up Lego Indy and NG2, am still working through getting back to where I was in GTA4, and now I want GRID and maybe Hulk. I was on the fence about Bourne, because I love the movies, but all these games should give it plenty of time to make it to the discount rack.

[Jab]

Is Tom's review for Hulk up yet? As yet another fan of UD I'm interested to hear what is different with this one. My 2 problems with UD were the repetitive nature of some of the boss fights, and how the difficulty spiked near the end when your being chased down by infinite respawning enemies.

[ZekeDMS]

I'm going to get my own review up fairly soon but...sigh.

I really loved UD, and the core is there, but so much feels missing in this one. They totally Spider-man 3'd it. There's a few changes which are obvious and bad, a few things which are added and good, but the control is loose, the jumping doesn't feel right, and the combat is less smashtacular.

You don't regen by smashing either now, not directly. You can build up a full regen, which is cool, yay special moves, but it's a different system.

Also, fucking buggy. I've had five times in the last 30 mintues I pick a guy up, and his model freezes in place in the world, while my attacks act as if I've got him. When I throw him, magically reappearing.

I'm not very far in at all, fourth story mission. I've not seen any of the side missions I so loved yet, I hope that changes. I kinda like the new unlock system(based off of doing shit rather than spending points. Smash dudes, wreck things, etc), but I'm not finding much use yet.

I hope this picks up, because...well, big disappointment otherwise, especially compared to how I'm loving Indy and Gaiden II.

[Moore]

Thanks Zeke, saved me $60.

[Jake Plane]

Argh. This is now a must rent title. If Blockbuster ever had a decent selection of games available I would join their gamepass program for times like these

[ZekeDMS]

Okay, hit a few side missions. Still fun. The actual missions are pretty solid too, but the engine is weak. I get some slowdown way more than I should, there's some pretty nasty pop-in of texture(why I cared less in Mass Effect I don't know), shadows(the shadow draw distance is about as poor as that of Sonic the Hedgehog), and whatever the current term for "shit I can walk through" is, specifically, bushes.

This is certainly a rental, but a purchase, I'm not so sure still. At this point, not.

Oh, for the love of god, clipping planes. In the second Enclave mission, every time I did it I would encounter two humvees stuck together like one unit, until I punched them apart and found out that it wasn't just my eyes messing with me when it looked blurry. I've had a few air conditioners sit halfway into another, too. I don't mind rough clipping with random objects, but with enemies, it's a problem.

On the upside, I punched someone into a hot dog cart, just an army grunt, which caused it to fucking exploded from the force of impact. Hot dogs and mustard all over, and a nice flying umbrella. That was worth a few bucks at least.

Jake, tried Gamefly yet? It's my preference, been with 'em for years. Hollywood Video/Movie Gallery also have rental plans, but I only say that because I work at one part time. If it doesn't have a game crazy attached, it's not worth the cost(also, gamefly's selection, way way better anyway).

[Damien Neil]

So, I completely missed Ultimate Destruction. If I want to play it now, am I better off with the XBox or PS2 version? (Either way, I'd be playing through BC on a current-gen console.)

[Jab]

So, I completely missed Ultimate Destruction. If I want to play it now, am I better off with the XBox or PS2 version? (Either way, I'd be playing through BC on a current-gen console.)

Its been awhile since I played UD, but the graphics do look nicer on the xbox and gamecube versions compared to the PS2, other then that I don't think there are any major differences between the versions.

[forgeforsaken]

Xbox version of UD runs at 720p, so I'd go that way.

[ZekeDMS]

720p support makes the Xbox one the way to go, in my opinion. Game looks pretty damn nice still. Textures are a little bland and there's a few low poly things, but the style holds up, it's very smooth overall, and a nice resolution.

[Damien Neil]

Thanks; guess I'll tell GameFly to send the XBox version my way at some point after I clear the Backlog of Doom that's developing.

[ElGuapo]

First, if you liked Hulk:UD I think you'll like this. They added some things to the old game and changed some more. Overall it's a very similar game so far. Differences:

The same:

A lot of animations. General gameplay. Lock onto targets and throw them. Pick up enemies, jump through the air with them, and smash. You'll notice tons of stuff from Hulk: UD, liek when you jump into water you jump right back out moving towards land.

Different:

The city. First, it's New York. A different take on New York than GTAIV, but still Manhattan.

The descruction is much better done. Stuff flies everywhere. You can destroy every building (but I'm trying to be good Hulk and minimize property damage). Throw a car, guy, whatever into a building and a section will crumble instead of just a damage decal. Looks really cool. However, stuff gets destroyed wether you throw a car or a person, both destroy the sides of buildings. A slight nitpick, but whatever. Also, they gave Hulk much more bulk. Hit a building while grabbing it and he smashes right into it. WAlk right through trees. Walk through fences. A car hits you and it gets smashed up. You really feel like a monster.

Climbing/moving around has changed. Sprint is still there (once you unlock it) but you don't sprint up buildings anymore, which I miss. Maybe that unlocks later. Instead, you hit circle to latch onto buildings, as before. But now when moving up them Hulk doesn't go hand over hand, he leaps hand over hand. It took me about 30 seconds to climb the ESB this way.

It looks liek tons and tons of stuff unlocks. This is similar to the old game but now instead of buying moves you have to unlock them by doing deats. Some are stuff like "Kill X enemy" which are obvious story related. Others are more stuff like "Jump a total of one mile, and run a total of 10 miles." So I suppose you can concentrate on something if you want it badly, or just let things unlock.

Gone are the green flashes for everything, and I don't miss them. In fact things are more subdued with that stuff so far and it's more focused on just destruction. Even landin smashes stuff up. It's hard to even move around the city without mashing everything, but I guess that's why you are menace.

The threat system has been complete revamped. You don't get progressive threats until a a big response is issued. Instead it's more GTA IV style with progressive threat levels (I think there are 9!). To get rid of this attention you basically have to run from everything without damaging property or killing civilians. Easier said than done, and in my mind this is better. It really gives that "LEAVE HULK ALONE!" vibe. You try to lay low but they keep coming so oyu either fight and fight and fight or just run away. You can also use the subway system, which acts not only as a way to fast travel but also as a "pay and spray" from GTA IV. The story is that you go into the subway system and lose the cops/military underground.

Also, you increase your rage and health meters by collecting orbs (instead of buying them). You build up your health by either using a special power (that uses rage meter) or regenerating. You build up your rage by destroying stuff and defeating enemies. This means it keeps the frentic pace of the original, but in a different way. I'm not sure how it's paced so far but several missions in it seems to work.

So far I like it. There are enough changes I am still getting used to the new systems but it's familiar enough to jump right in. I'm curious to see where the story goes and what unlocks. And Joe Fixit is unlocked from the beginning! Now to unlock Maestro.

I'm liking it a lot.

Oh, a few cons. The voice acting and cut scenes absolutely suck. But hopefully it at least lets you do good missions. Also, missions are instant retry and have mid mission checkpoints. Yay!

[forgeforsaken]

Maybe that unlocks later. Instead, you hit circle to latch onto buildings

I swear I saw you playing this on 360...

[ElGuapo]

I swear I saw you playing this on 360...

You did . I'm playing it now!

Edit: Ohhh. Yeah I played the original on the Ps2. Clearly I meant B. Whatever, the button on the right!

[Jake Plane]

El Guapo, you rock. I'm sold.

[Jake Plane]

Hey, how's the move list? Most importantly, can you "hulk out" (animation where you're roaring and what not) and then execute a major move like the sonic clap?

[ElGuapo]

Jake, yes. There is a huge move list. I haven't scrolled down it all but I see some familiar stuff and some other stuff.

Think of this game as GTA IV's answer to GTA:SA. In all it's more "realistic", which is a different direction than the last game. For instance I don't see car surfing or the wrecking ball. Those were nice little touches and if they aren't here they will be missed, but they have done other things. For instance, if you throw a car (or something else, like a lampost or concrete block) into a building it will sometimes stick into it.

So far no blue gorilla floats spotted.

Also, Moore no multiplayer I can see. And yes, I've seen some weird glitches like animations of soldiers resetting occasionally. That stuff doesn't bother me much.

Edit: Wait!


The Xbox 360 and PS3 versions will be upgraded later this month with free downloadable content that allows for competitive online multiplayer modes and other online features.

Helllllll yeah. You know you want some bus throwing action.

[BobJustBob]

Think of this game as GTA IV's answer to GTA:SA.

That bad?

[Other Brendan]

Played a few hours of Hulk tonight and was pretty pleased with the purchase. It's rough around the edges with visual bugs, poor cinemas, and half-hearted voice acting, but the pure havoc of the game is damn fun. Even when I got a little tired of the missions (mostly go to point A and beat up some military guys in the early goings), I took a break and just wandered around New York collecting landmark tokens (which can be obtained only by destroying said landmarks). Empire State Building, Chrysler Building, Carnegie Hall, Metropolitan Museum of Art, St. Patrick's Cathedral... It's the best walking/jumping/pummelling tour of the Big Apple ever.

[Bahimiron]

Does it have the annoying boss battles that H:UD had? That first battle against abomination was nearly enough to make me return the game.

[Jab]

From reviews they mentioned that the story missions are pretty lame, how are the side missions in this one compared to UD?

[Other Brendan]

There's been one boss battle so far for me. It was against all four of the U-Foes and I actually enjoyed it. I think it might have technically been a side mission though.

[Moore]

Got it anyways, along with viking for a total of 8$, by dumping a lot of old shit (like perfect dark 0 and the outfit- OLD!)

So far so good, a few annoyances, and I think I like viking better, but hulk is a nice stress relief title after some ninja gaiden frustration.

[ZekeDMS]

I'd definitely take Hulk over Viking, PD0, and Outfit(suck!).

As I step back, I realize it's a much better game than I'm giving it credit for, it's just that the first was so god damn good. While I don't like the style as much in a few things, and it's got a few more bugs, it is still a really great game. There's a little more and less combat option at the same time(I loved having instant access to thunderclap and ground smash, that should NOT have been changed, but now I have way more useful moves), but it's still pretty fun. A little more defensive what with blocking and no regen bubbles from fallen enemies, but the rage heal works fine for that.

Hulk feels a little small, but eh, pretty good. I don't like jumping to grab buildings and not being able to brute force run up the sides is a real disappointment, that was just so god damn fun, but I can see it being used for balance, especially as jumps get upgraded.

I definitely have to give credit to the devs for making the most collateral damage possible. Lots of chain explosions and such really are satisfying.

As I play more and more, I'm going from 3 to 4 stars from the raw fun it's starting to become.

Once the multiplayer component comes out, I'll be all over it I suspect. Thing Vs. Hulk is ridiculously cool in my opinion.

[Jake Plane]

I'm waiting for Big Brown to become a triple crown winner. But I keep thinking about the big green fellow. I'm picking this up soon.

[Moore]

I'd definitely take Hulk over Viking, PD0, and Outfit(suck!).

As I step back, I realize it's a much better game than I'm giving it credit for, it's just that the first was so god damn good. While I don't like the style as much in a few things, and it's got a few more bugs, it is still a really great game. There's a little more and less combat option at the same time(I loved having instant access to thunderclap and ground smash, that should NOT have been changed, but now I have way more useful moves), but it's still pretty fun. A little more defensive what with blocking and no regen bubbles from fallen enemies, but the rage heal works fine for that.

Hulk feels a little small, but eh, pretty good. I don't like jumping to grab buildings and not being able to brute force run up the sides is a real disappointment, that was just so god damn fun, but I can see it being used for balance, especially as jumps get upgraded.

I definitely have to give credit to the devs for making the most collateral damage possible. Lots of chain explosions and such really are satisfying.

As I play more and more, I'm going from 3 to 4 stars from the raw fun it's starting to become.

Once the multiplayer component comes out, I'll be all over it I suspect. Thing Vs. Hulk is ridiculously cool in my opinion.

Oh Viking is pretty good.. and I liked the outfit more than most, but relaistically, I'll either never want to play it again, or by the time I do, it'll cost like $1.

Vs. should be pretty cool if it works.

[Jab]

How are the side missions so far, I was reading on game faqs and it says you can automatically start them from any spot and be warped to their location, is that true? One of the best feeling in UD was just getting around the city as the Hulk, does that still feel as awesome this time around, not counting losing the ability to run up walls.

[Other Brendan]

I actually prefer the way you scale buildings now since it's more Hulk-like. He just digs a hand into the wall and kinda gorilla swings himself up a few stories before digging in with the other hand and so on. It's not as fast, but I never liked seeing Hulk wall-running in Ultimate Destruction. Wall-running is for ninjas and Persian princes. Hulk is not an agility kinda guy. This feels more in keeping with the character.

[ZekeDMS]

I miss some of the raw brute force feeling still. Hulk lands a little too cleanly, I don't like how traffic actually slows me down to plow through, I still miss wall-running.

That said, the more I play of this game, the more I like it. The problems are still there but god, they're being overcome with every new mission, especially when I just decimate a boss type enemy in seconds.

This is actually beating Ninja Gaiden II for my playtime.

[Jake Plane]

For those who have played both H: UD & Incredible, I'm curious to hear which one gives you a more Hulk-like feel.

Having read through this thread, I like the idea of Incredible taking place in NYC, eliminating wall running (which never felt true to character) and adding the ability to destroy whole buildings.

That said, in the videos I've seen, the Hulk seems... smaller. And he doesn't seem to land with oomph like he did in H: UD.

[Other Brendan]

It's trade-off in feel. Ultimate Destruction's controls are a bit tighter, and it has great touches like clinging to a helicopter cockpit (which isn't in Incredible or just hasn't been unlocked by me yet). But Incredible has the advantage of running on more powerful systems. Hulk seems to be bigger on-screen than he was in Ultimate Destruction, but possibly smaller relative to the environment around him. As for landing with less oomph, I haven't noticed it, and bounding around the city feels just about perfect to me, although you have less mid-air control than in Ultimate Destruction.

Another point in the Incredible column is the way the world crumbles around the Hulk, from busting up buildings to bowling pedestrians down a crowded street. I hurled a piece of debris off the top of a skyscraper just to see how long the game would keep rendering it. It eventually stopped moving right along the side of another building and I thought there was some kind of collision glitch. But when I bounded over there to get a closer look at it, I saw that there was no glitch; the debris was actually lodged partway through the building's facade.

[EDIT: I just realized you can embed entire cars into buildings by throwing them into the corner of the exterior. So satisfying.]

Another nice touch to the city is that it's dotted not only with real-world landmarks like the United Nations building and Radio City Music Hall, but it's got a ton of Marvel Universe landmarks in there too, like The Baxter Building, Doctor Strange's Sanctum Sanctorum, the Latverian Embassy, Daredevil's law offices, the Daily Bugle, and so on.

[ZekeDMS]

Seconding what Brendan said. You don't get the raw indestructable god-like feeling from UD, the absolute asskickery. UD was all about going fucking berserk, which I dug. It was over the top comic book style.

This one has deeper combat options, Hulk isn't as huge(the camera is pulled away a little anyway, and he's not as big as prior, while some enemies are bigger). It's a more...realistic, I suppose, Hulk. Definitely movie version. He's not so invulnerable, he actually blocks and dodges, and you don't just drop off the radar by wiping out a strike group. He climbs buildings by hurling himself up them, instead of running or slowly climbing. He's a bit more out of control, while not as kinetic as in the first game.

This one is definitely designed to be more cinematic whereas the first one was raw comic destruction. I'm actually at the point where I'd say it's just about as good overall, even if I thought the first was a little more fun.

Like El Guapo said, it's GTA:IV to GTA:SA. Same idea, different execution, but I'm enjoying it just the same it turns out, once I adjust.

[ElGuapo]

3 little things I miss:

The slight bounce Hulk did when he did a really high jump. Kind of a little hop he did when landing. I loved that animation.

Grabbing things in mid air. Unless you can do it later this is a huge miss. Can't beleive it's not in there.

Grabbing things on the go. You have to stop moving to pick up things. Another big miss.

3 things I like:

No matter where you go and how careful you are, Hulk DESTROYS areas he's moving through. He walks right through fences, railings, billboards, etc. That feeling is awesome. One can see why he's a threat by just existing.

The "chuck em" move you do by default with the Y button. This is different than the B button toss. He carelessly flings whoever he's holding by grabbing their arm and leg and tossing them. I love tossing people into watertowers and through billboards with that move.

In the two different type of orb collections, you get audio clues as to where they are, just like Crackdown. It's actually pretty fun to collect in this game because not only does it refill your meters to max, every 20 or so collectibles it ups the max meter for you. Every collectible in a game should be thus.

Oh, ok, one more bonus like. This game has the best title screen, ever. Someone hit it out of the park with that one (pay attention to what's going left to right on the screen and what comes back right to left... :)

Ok, one more bonus. *slight spoiler* The first fight against the U Foes was an epic fight for me. We fought ALL OVER the city. Both the Chrystler Building and Empire State Building were destroyed in the process. Sorry New York!

[forgeforsaken]

Oh, ok, one more bonus like. This game has the best title screen, ever. Someone hit it out of the park with that one (pay attention to what's going left to right on the screen and what comes back right to left... :)



Better than Dead Risings?

[Jab]

Does anyone know if a demo is planned for xbox live, and besides the multiplayer option are there any more DLC options coming?

[Moore]

Better than Dead Risings?

Nope.

[ElGuapo]

Where the zombies are moving away from the mall? I'm talking about title screen, not opening cinematic.

But yeah, personally I like it better than Dead Risings. I guess it comes down to if you are a huge Hulk fan or zombie fan. :)

I also miss that there is no scream button (it was Select on the PS2 version). That was fun to play with.

Last night I got attacked by helicopters. There is no grabbing them out of mid air, which was one of the most fun moves in the old game. You can however leap at them and then hit the weak punch button to fly at them and smack them down.

In fact I think the game is missing most of the aerial attacks. This is more in keeping with the comic book (Hulk usually smashes stuff on the ground), less kinetic/frentic for sure. I do like this new Hulk game though. It's fun as heck to go tear assing through the city with the new destruction model. This is the best city smashing game ever made. At times it feels like you are playing next-gen rampage (the way the outside walls of the buildings crumble exposing the inside).

A few things I noticed last night:

* Almost all storefront windows can be smashed. You can't go inside but it's a cool touch because when you throw people/cars/lamposts, whatever those windows and storefronts break.

* Lots of fun stuff to smash. Smash a stand full of purses and there are purses everywhere. Smash a fruit stand and boxes of fruit are everywhere.

* The mechanic of making an instant shield out of asphalt or rooftop is really cool. You never lack something to chuck in this game.

* Almost ANYTHING durable can be stuck into the side of a building. Usually it has to be a fairly large building. Cars, antenna, buses, light poles, air conditioners, garbage containers, etc. I think it depends on the angle you throw them at (i.e. when you are straight on perpendicular it has the best chance of sticking).

* I LOVE how when you are climbing buildings pieces of debris are raining down, including fire escapes and anything else on the side of the building that is knocked off. Hulk goes right through that stuff and it all falls below. Climb up a building sometime knocking stuff down then drop straight down. You'll see all that stuff on the street below.

* SPOILER* After you defeat the U Foes the first time they turn into random encounters in the game. A nice touch that is really enjoyable. One time I had the Army on my ass, then an Enclave strike team started beaming down, THEN the radiation guy (X-Ray?) showed up. That was a hell of a 4 way fight. Sometimes the Army would be shooting X-Ray and he'd retaliate. Then I'd toss an Enclave and the Army would taken them on. Eventually someone would break free of melee and attack me. I'd build up rage, power in, and HULK SMASH! everyone at the same time. It's a teeny disappointing you can't throw the U Foes even when they are stunned. Those are cool fights but taking on people you can throw is even more fun. The battles between Ironclad and Hulk seriously need some "FEATS TO STRENGTH" quick button events where you wrestle each other and the loser gets thrown. There is a lot of variety in those fights though. I've been reading about the U Foes and they all fight pretty much exactly as they do in the comics.

[zengonzo]

Glad to hear this has a happy ending - my GameFly copy should be coming any day now ..

I'm getting the impression that the reception is much more favorable than Iron Man.

So from what do you guys imagine the review lockout derived? If this is not simply a cheap release?

[ElGuapo]

Dunno. If you have an Iron Man save game it unlocks the Iron Man Hulkbuster armor as a playable skin.

[BlueJackalope]

Another nice touch to the city is that it's dotted not only with real-world landmarks like the United Nations building and Radio City Music Hall, but it's got a ton of Marvel Universe landmarks in there too, like The Baxter Building, Doctor Strange's Sanctum Sanctorum, the Latverian Embassy, Daredevil's law offices, the Daily Bugle, and so on.

Between this (I am a huge Marvel dork) and...



Ok, one more bonus. *slight spoiler* The first fight against the U Foes was an epic fight for me. We fought ALL OVER the city. Both the Chrystler Building and Empire State Building were destroyed in the process. Sorry New York!


...This.

I'm sold. (Good timing 'cause I just finished GTA).

Thanks fellahs.

[Other Brendan]

So from what do you guys imagine the review lockout derived? If this is not simply a cheap release?

I think they just didn't send advance copies out to Web sites (1Up got a review up for launch by playing a copy sent for EGM's reviews). Nothing really shady going on that I've heard of. And this way, Web sites will be getting their reviews up closer to this Friday's release of the movie, which probably suits the PR people just fine.

[Moore]

Dunno. If you have an Iron Man save game it unlocks the Iron Man Hulkbuster armor as a playable skin.

Just re-started gamefly to get that without buying iron man, hehe.

[zengonzo]

I think they just didn't send advance copies out to Web sites (1Up got a review up for launch by playing a copy sent for EGM's reviews). Nothing really shady going on that I've heard of. And this way, Web sites will be getting their reviews up closer to this Friday's release of the movie, which probably suits the PR people just fine.

I suppose so. Just sure seemed like they were keeping their heads down - no demo, no reviews.

[ElGuapo]

Just re-started gamefly to get that without buying iron man, hehe.

You huge dork. I heard you don't have blasters and can't fly or anything though. Kinda lame. It'd be sweet as hell if they had some true Hulkbuster armor to fight in MP with. Make it weaker and with less health than the Hulk but make it able to hover/fly and shoot repulsors.

Me myself, I'm going to unlock Maestro and start destroying the entire city to prove I'm the only one fit to rule.

[Moore]

I suppose so. Just sure seemed like they were keeping their heads down - no demo, no reviews.
It does share some plot w/ the movie, so they may not have wanted movie spoilers out too early.

[zengonzo]

Perhaps.

So how does city destruction work? Can you level the skyline, or does it regenerate every time you turn your back?

[ElGuapo]

I'm actually not sure how the destruction works. I do know there is an acheivement for knocking down every building in a neighborhood (which would take a loooooooooong time), so perhaps it stays a while. I bet it regenerates when you load a mission/minigame and when you enter the subway. Though I don't know yet. I did fool around with trying to destroy a whole neighborhood last night. Crushed about 10 buildings, looked like I had about 30 more to go. The army was after my ass in a big way so maybe it's better to do this early on in the game.

FYI I was all over the place and the buildings weren't regenerating.

[zengonzo]

So you could conceivably - with enough dedication and time - level the entire city?

Does the multiplayer include the destruction and response? Because I could see some interesting co-op opportunities.

[Moore]

So you could conceivably - with enough dedication and time - level the entire city?

Does the multiplayer include the destruction and response? Because I could see some interesting co-op opportunities.

The MP doesnt exist yet, but I hope it includes the response. It kind of HAS to include the destruction.

[zengonzo]

Well, I suppose my real concern would be whether or not it had arena-ish levels, or gave you full run of the city.

[Moore]

If it has arenas it'll suck. no idea whats planned though. Not sure they've said anything except 1 on 1 vs.

[Jake Plane]

You know what else the Incredible Hulk doesn't have?

Reviews.

Seriously, no one but 1up reviewed this game?

[Tom Chick]

Ooh, I know of at least one other (http://www.variety.com/review/VE1117937358.html?categoryid=1079&cs=1)!

-Tom

[ZekeDMS]

I...don't! Still haven't finished mine, whoops!

I just finished the storyline and hit the credits, though there's apparently more afterwards to do, which is nice. 75 percent upgraded too, that's fun. Some are trickier than others obviously, and I think the mace/tank upgrades came a little too late, but...well, pretty good.

I hope I can replay missions somehow, so I can get the achievement points for an earlier one.

[Tom Chick]

One of the loading screen tips says you're supposed to be able to replay missions from the map screen. As near as I can tell, it's totally lying!

-Tom

[Other Brendan]

Can't you replay levels from the start menu map by pushing left or right to switch the filter from "active" to whichever storyline path the level was on?

[Bahimiron]

Ooh, I know of at least one other (http://www.variety.com/review/VE1117937358.html?categoryid=1079&cs=1)!

I don't trust that reviewer. The guys at NMA said he was bad news.

[Rob_Merritt]

Ooh, I know of at least one other (http://www.variety.com/review/VE1117937358.html?categoryid=1079&cs=1)!

-Tom

Question about this line.

"Instead, the story is moved along by such uninspiring visuals as a picture of a cell phone or a computer readout."

Instead of a cut scene, a cell phone pops up? Are you saying the Hulk carries a cell phone in this game???

[Tom Chick]

That would be awesome! No, it's obvious they recorded voiceover, but couldn't afford to do a cutscene, or didn't have time, or assets, or whatever. So there are these horrible pre-mission briefings where you're staring at a picture of a cell phone while Bruce Banner and his annoying sidekick have lines with each other. You know, to represent the fact that it's a cell phone conversation. Sometimes there's a tagline that reads something like "surveillance audio recording", as if, ha ha, this is how we meant to do this!

But my favorite 'WTF?' cutscenes were the ones where four color-coded Master Chiefs sit around a table and talk about The Hulk. Actually, they might have been Power Rangers.

-Tom

[zengonzo]

I think the enemies are really strange in the context of the city and the Hulk, which both look to be going for some realism. The enemies are more stylized and brightly-colored.

I found the game a bit dumb, but pretty enjoyable .. Until the nanite escort mission.

I don't want to spoil, but essentially I had to go find the MacGuffin in one of five garbage trucks moving aimlessly throughout the city, all while being harassed (not obstructed) by a Benny Hill string of aggressors. My reward for stopping to take out a few of the nagging bees was their immediate replacement, so I ran on with them yipping at my heels. The real problem with this situation is that you can't tell from the minimap how far away each target is, and the large map doesn't show current mission objectives, so you can only hope that the one you've chosen to head towards isn't the absolute farthest point on the map.

Once I gained possession of the apparent film reel MacGuffin, I headed to the drop-off location, a tiny square in which Hulk must leave the item while destroying the remaining enemies. Enemies try to pick it up while you are fighting, and if they do you kill them and bring it back to the tiny square. I couldn't be sure, but it seemed like every time one managed to pick it up, the remaining enemies would replenish, so I started to become very paranoid about the disc, and a mission that was starting to take too long.

Ultimately I was left with four targets on my map, surrounding me and not wishing to approach. I discovered later that two of those were rooftop rockets, but the other two were dudes in powersuits apparently stuck on the corners of buildings while trying to get to me. Eventually one would make it over, but seemed to be immediately replaced. All the while the tiny target disc is being battered around on the ground since traffic keeps coming through and chain explosions result with each of Hulk's slightest moves. At some point, the disc disappeared from the map, so I warily hoped I was in good shape, and finished off the remaining enemies.

The game told me I should now bring the disc back to my pal. After trying to level the entire street in the hopes of revealing this disc, I found that every time I whacked a building with a car it would tell me that one of those ASSCAP soldiers was making off with it, and I realized it must have clipped through to some world between worlds, an I hadn't yet unlocked Hulk Interdimensional Footstomp.

So I spent a good twenty annoying minutes on that mission this morning, and has severely colored an otherwise moderate game for me.

The writing is pretty sad. What's with Bruce making all the veiled references to his alter ego with people that are explicitly aware of his nature? But you can mostly ignore that, and with regard to the cellphone bits, I'm glad they didn't waste any more time than they had to with the weak cutscenes. Makes sense to me - get back to the smashing.

[Drastic]

Instead of a cut scene, a cell phone pops up? Are you saying the Hulk carries a cell phone in this game???
That would be pretty great.

"HULK SMASH! PUNY HUMANS MAKE HULK ANGRY! HULK SMA..." ringtone. "PUNY HUMAN WAIT. HULK GOT TAKE THIS!"

The escort mission complaint reminds me of when I rapidly lost interest early on when I rented Hulk: UD--a mission early on where you had to protect a building, which I promptly dubbed a building escort mission. It wasn't that it was a particularly difficult mission, but just the spirit of it. Hulk preventing a building from being smashed was just terribly wrong.

[Rob_Merritt]

Well if Banner has Sprint or AT&T it might explain why he is so angry all the time.

[zengonzo]

They ought to make one of those dropped call commercials where Hulk misunderstands someone and the end result isn't a bit of embarrassment or awkwardness, but the complete razing of Manhattan.

[Alex Dolce]

...I realized it must have clipped through to some world between worlds...
No. You mean the spaces between space! Knowledge was their treasure!

[zengonzo]

That would explain why the Hulk failed that particular mission.

I suppose I should've tried smashing the faces off of the building ..

[MSUSteve]

I'll take the opportunity to post my own humble impressions, though I must admit I posted them previously on another forum that I frequent. So they're not EXCLUSIVE. Ha ha!

I'm liking it a lot. It's an open world game where you're given free reign to trash New York as the Hulk. You can demolish any building in the city if you hit it enough times, which is fun. Unfortunately the buildings fall in a canned smokey/sinking animation which, while cool, isn't procedurally made for each building. Also, the buildings don't deform based on how you beat them up. You essentially punch off the outside skin to make a damaged tile at that place on the building. This produces some rubble, which can be picked up and used as shields, so it's not a total waste or anything. There are a bunch of "landmark" buildings in the city that, if destroyed, provide collectible tokens. As far as I know they don't do anything in-game, but probably unlock bonuses or achievements if you collect enough.

The game itself is open world, with flashing icons on the map that you can go to in order to start missions. The missions invariably involve (at least so far) fighting the army or the Enclave, a group led by four super scientists or something. Usually you have some goal to get to and destroy, though I have done a ferrying/protection mission (which was not annoying actually) and a mission where I had to run away from pursuing missiles while locating the satelite dishes that allowed the missiles to get me. It's fun, if not very creative.

If you decide not to do missions, you can still have fun in the city itself. There are two types of tanks to collect. Think orbs in Crackdown. One increases Hulk's health and regeneration rate and the other increases his rage meter, which is what fuels use of his super powers/attacks. You can also cause random havoc, which increases what is essentially a wanted rating, where the army's response to your threat becomes bigger and badder. You can lose all of this generated threat by entering any of the city's subway entrances and riding a train (presumably anyway) from one station to another. This doesn't make any real sense, but it's awesome that you can drop your wanted level at will if you just want to go back to tooling around the city without army interference. Finally, you can address Enclave attacks on the city, which is similar to fighting the army guys except the Enclave shows up on their own, unlike the army, which shows up in response to you doing bad stuff.

The controls in the game work well. You can lock on to any enemy with the L trigger. There are two attack buttons that can be used in different combinations to perform various combos. Hulk can also pick stuff up and either throw it or smash things with it. He can also grab enemies and do the same, which is pretty satisfying. Locomotion is accomplished by either normal running, sprinting while holding a bumper, or jumping. Jumping is very similar to Ultimate Destruction or the Venom portions of Ultimate Spider-Man. You can essentially bound from one leap to the next and cover a lot of ground. Hulk can also latch onto and quickly climb up buildings, though he doesn't run on buildings as he did in Ultimate Destruction. All of the controls work nicely and you're never fighting the controller while trying to accomplish something. The camera is more than capable and does a good job of keeping the action in focus.

Hulk also has unlockable abilities and super powers. Right at the beginning of the game you get the ability to regenerate health by consuming some of your rage. Hulk's health comes back by itself over time, but if you're in a pinch you can do a charge up move that returns you to full health right away. The only other super power I have is a recently acquired super slap, which levels pretty much anything around the Hulk. This consumes 10 bits of rage though, so it's not something you can do a lot. So far I've also unlocked a couple of normal abilities, including being able to use shields and being able to rip a car in half to create two "gloves" for Hulk, which increase his attack power by quite a bit, but stop him from being able to grab things.

So far I love this game. It's the right mix of focused action and freeform roaming that I love. I can always get into a mission if I want, but screwing around is addicting fun as well.

[mojovonio]

Cross posting, eh?

I'll be sure to report this to the moderation team.

;)

[zengonzo]

Does jumping actually move you farther forward than merely sprinting? It initially seems like you go faster, but has anyone timed it?

[mojovonio]

Does jumping actually move you farther forward than merely sprinting? It initially seems like you go faster, but has anyone timed it?

I think its does, I've noticed it somewhat.

[Bahimiron]

Jumping increases your awesome velocity by a factor of hells yeah.

[Moore]

No, haven't. Sprinting while holding a bus gets you through streets pretty fast though, nothing slows you down much...

[zengonzo]

It definitely is awesome, particularly when you charge your jump midleap and release immediately on landing, so you become this big, green, bunnyhopping Hulk, bounding through the city - hippity-hop.

[ZekeDMS]

It seems the jumping is slower than dashing to me, in a straight, clear line. If buildings are a factor, over is better, if traffic is, little hops over it.

It's funny, when I sit down to write my thoughts down on the game, there's a LOT of complaints. Tons and tons of them. The shitty lock-on, the weak climbing, the boss fights, a lack of impressive enemies, a lot of too little too late.

I'm subjected to that god damn "but it's fun" problem. I mean, I've played all the way through and I'm even trying to get all the extra power. So, fuck. Objective disappointment, and I bet I'll go back to Hulk:UD, but there's something compelling me to keep playing.

[Bahimiron]

I love superjumps, as I may have mentioned before.

The place where Crackdown lost me was how little kinetic energy you seemed to put into your jump. In H:UD if you jumped and then hit your stomp attack, you knew the street would shake. The Crackdown team eventually gave a stomp in one of the patches, but it was a little late by then.

[zengonzo]

One of the issues that bothers me, admittedly somewhat trivial, is that the bounding box on Hulk seems to be rather large, so that even when he walks by a line of street decorations they explode in a fury. I think that detracts somewhat from when he really does go aggro - wherein all of the environmental reaction is actually great.

[MSUSteve]

It seems the jumping is slower than dashing to me, in a straight, clear line.

Agreed. I feel like running is faster for some reason. I jump if I need to get over things or to cut corners, but I've noticed I've been running most of the time since I discovered that ability.


One of the issues that bothers me, admittedly somewhat trivial, is that the bounding box on Hulk seems to be rather large, so that even when he walks by a line of street decorations they explode in a fury. I think that detracts somewhat from when he really does go aggro - wherein all of the environmental reaction is actually great.

Heh. I kinda like that actually. I especially like how nothing short of a military vehicle or a building slows Hulk down. He just runs through or over everything in his way.

[zengonzo]

I like the carnage, mind you - just not when it happens three feet to my right. I could see a little rumbling and damage, but these things are flying apart like I've given them a full uppercut.

[MSUSteve]

I'm just a simpleton that likes wanton destruction, whether I apparently caused it or not. Ha ha!

[Moore]

my only real complaint is I can't lift the military vehicles unles they blow up? what? I can throw a firetruck, but not a hummer? if thats is for balance reasons, someone is a fucking moron, because the military are powder puffs anyways, you are the hulk.

[MSUSteve]

Yeah Moore, that is annoying. My guess is they did that to force you to "fight" the military vehicles instead of just tossing them around. I don't know what would've been so wrong with tossing them around, but whatever.

[mojovonio]

So does anyone know if you can get the Shell Head achievement without having played Iron Man?

[zengonzo]

It would've been better if they'd made it to include a random chance that when you attempt to pick them up they unload in your face, so that you'd at least have to clobber them once before you grab them. My natural instinct is to pick one up even though I know better, so, yeah, that results in some frustration.

[MSUSteve]

So does anyone know if you can get the Shell Head achievement without having played Iron Man?
I know that I got the achievement immediately when I loaded the game up because I'd played Iron Man. I also have Hulkbuster Iron Man unlocked in the extra characters/skins section.

[ElGuapo]

Just unlocked/encountered the M1 tanks last night. I like the ones in UD much better. These fire gas cannister shells or something.

Have you guys fought Bi-Beast yet? The cinematic of when he attacks you the first time is comic book mayhem awesomeness.

[MSUSteve]

I haven't seen bi-beast yet, except for a picture on the back of the box, if I recall correctly. I'll look forward to it now though.

[ElGuapo]

Oh, the Classic Hulk skin (unlocked after collecting 5 comic book covers) is pretty sweet. I'm reading the old comics now and they did a pretty good job bringing him to life. He's obviously way more detailed in the game than the book (his muscles and such aren't defined/rippled as much in the comics) but he looks cool. Has the purple pants, super bright green skin, and everything.

By the way almost all of the Marvel buildings in NYC have comic book covers on them somewhere if you are looking for them. Baxter building, Stark Tower, etc.

[MSUSteve]

Oh, the Classic Hulk skin (unlocked after collecting 5 comic book covers) is pretty sweet. I'm reading the old comics now and they did a pretty good job bringing him to life. He's obviously way more detailed in the game than the book (his muscles and such aren't defined/rippled as much in the comics) but he looks cool. Has the purple pants, super bright green skin, and everything.

By the way almost all of the Marvel buildings in NYC have comic book covers on them somewhere if you are looking for them. Baxter building, Stark Tower, etc.
Cool! I haven't spent any time really looking at the landmark buildings on the map, but I was hoping Stark Tower was there.

[Moore]

ok, I got iron man as a rental to get my hulkbuster model unlocked.. whats neat is, it unlocks it for hulk, then if you load up ironman, it notices the hulk and unlocks it in the ironman game. With full artillery etc.. It flys like a dog but holy shit, you crush tanks with a single punch, and it remove having to tap B to rip them apart, you just hit b once and he throws them out of sight practically. Kind of neat, though iron man is nowhere near the hulk in terms of quality, it does have some cool things, like re-routing power on the fly to different systems and a forza-lite approach to suit components (it has a zillion suits, but you can tinker with the parts as well for several different catagories)

nice rental.

[Other Brendan]

This game is getting hammered in reviews, and as much as I love the game, I gotta admit it deserves a critical drubbing. Anyone else find that odd?

[DennyA]

This game is getting hammered in reviews, and as much as I love the game, I gotta admit it deserves a critical drubbing. Anyone else find that odd?
Game reviews have lost much of their usefulness in recent years, because they're all about playing critic on what's wrong, instead of judging the game experience as a whole. Sometimes what's wrong does make a game stink, but at other times, reviewers seem to feel obligated to spend half the review on a laundry list of what's wrong, or what they'd like to have seen done differently.

I've found that I've really enjoyed a number of games that have gotten scores in the 70s lately. Gosh, how can that be, when they're so imperfect?

Look at all the LEGO Indy review scores under 80% -- that's criminal. Sure, you can nitpick the differences from LEGO Star Wars, but the fact is, it's a hellaciously fun game, and deserves a much better score. But so many reviews today seem to be all about flaw-finding...

So does Hulk deserve a critical drubbing? Or is it like one of those movies that has some scenes that could have been done better, but overall you like so much that you can easily forgive the issues? (I can't answer that, actually, because I haven't played it yet. ;-)

[zengonzo]

What's wrong with 70s representing good but flawed games?

That's really why scores suck - they are so arbitrary.

[Moore]

I love the game and I think 70 is a fair score. I like iron man but I'd call it a 50.

[mojovonio]

EDF 2017 was a terrible game full of technical faults, but I put 160+ hours in to that game.

I feel the same about this game, it just gets right what makes games fun. If you get everything wrong, but that, you still have an enjoyable game.

I think too many reviewers are jaded. I remember the whole backlash for Kane and Lynch, and after it, reviewers would talk about how terrible it was. I played it and found myself wondering how anyone could find it TERRIBLE. It wasn't amazing, but I had a great time with it.

Same with Army of Two. I watched a 1upshow with... I can't remember his name, blonde guy with glasses, around the time Army of Two came out, and he spent the whole time talking about how bad the story was. Really, who gives a shit?

[Moore]

I liked K&L. So long as you never remembered who made it it was more or less enjoyable.

Comnig form the hitman folks, it was a big let down though.

[zengonzo]

I remember the whole backlash for Kane and Lynch, and after it, reviewers would talk about how terrible it was. I played it and found myself wondering how anyone could find it TERRIBLE. It wasn't amazing, but I had a great time with it.

That was pretty annoying. It became essentially an inside joke among outsiders, referencing the unrivaled shittiness of a game they never played. Why would they play it, considering how indefensibly crap it apparently was?

Though, I think that case in particular was more an issue of a bunch of nerds desperately wanting to be in on the joke.

What would a 100 mean for a game genre in which you're not already interested?

Drop scores. Talk about what you liked and didn't about the game. End with a recommendation to buy, rent or skip.

[mojovonio]

That was pretty annoying. It became essentially an inside joke among outsiders, referencing the unrivaled shittiness of a game they never played. Why would they play it, considering how indefensibly crap it apparently was?

Though, I think that case in particular was more an issue of a bunch of nerds desperately wanting to be in on the joke.

What would a 100 mean for a game genre in which you're not already interested?

Drop scores. Talk about what you liked and didn't about the game. End with a recommendation to buy, rent or skip.

Yep, that's what review metrics should be.

[ElGuapo]

Buy rent or skip is a fantastic metric. The problem with that is that game publishers and developers might not be too keen on giving you review copies if you like a game and tell people to RENT it.

[Moore]

Solution would be to buy your games to review. Or for developers/pubs to make games that are more than one play session long, and/or not mediocre.

[Wholly Schmidt]

Buy rent or skip is a fantastic metric. The problem with that is that game publishers and developers might not be too keen on giving you review copies if you like a game and tell people to RENT it.
That's not a problem, that's evidence that the system we have is broken.

[mojovonio]

That's not a problem, that's evidence that the system we have is broken.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

[MSUSteve]

I think too many reviewers are jaded. I remember the whole backlash for Kane and Lynch, and after it, reviewers would talk about how terrible it was. I played it and found myself wondering how anyone could find it TERRIBLE. It wasn't amazing, but I had a great time with it.

Same with Army of Two. I watched a 1upshow with... I can't remember his name, blonde guy with glasses, around the time Army of Two came out, and he spent the whole time talking about how bad the story was. Really, who gives a shit?
I couldn't agree more. I finally rented K&L and have so far really enjoyed it, so much so that I elected to Keep It from Gamefly. As for Army of Two, I loved that game. My brother and I plowed through it and had a blast the entire time. I remember seeing that episode of the 1upShow where Matt Chandronait trashed it for a bunch of ridiculous and irrelevant reasons and being really irritated; so much so that I think I actually posted a long-winded rebuttal in the comments section of the show.

[ElGuapo]

I couldn't agree more. I finally rented K&L and have so far really enjoyed it, so much so that I elected to Keep It from Gamefly. As for Army of Two, I loved that game. My brother and I plowed through it and had a blast the entire time. I remember seeing that episode of the 1upShow where Matt Chandronait trashed it for a bunch of ridiculous and irrelevant reasons and being really irritated; so much so that I think I actually posted a long-winded rebuttal in the comments section of the show.

Hey I think Gamespot may have a job opening for you. :)

[MSUSteve]

Hey I think Gamespot may have a job opening for you. :)
Accepted! Ha ha! My righteous indignation was with respect to Army of Two, not Kane & Lynch though. Still think I have a chance working for Gamespot?

Seriously though, Gerstmann's review of K&L wasn't really too bad. What'd he give the game? It was in the 6.0 range, right? One can still have an enjoyable game score in that range.

[zengonzo]

I really didn't like his Gamespot reviews. I think he rushed reviews for games he isn't interested in, and made up shit some of the time when he can't be bothered. The only reason I ever noticed him was when I had to stop reading and ask, 'who the fuck wrote this?' His Scarface review, for instance, seemed to have all of its problems backwards. For one he noted the controls as the most significant problem.

'The Wii Remote and Nunchuk are perfectly capable of playing a wide variety of exciting games, but Scarface isn't one of them.'

Everyone has room to disagree, but Scarface featured the best use of the Wii remote I had seen at the time. Possibly the best for a third person-actioner on the Wii, and in some ways better than the dual sticks.

He also dings both Scarface and Kane and Lynch heavily for their bad language, which seems to me a relatively marginal problem when the games involve massive violence.

Anyhow, I just don't see him as a very helpful reviewer, and I don't think anyone but Gamespot viewers would ever have known his name if it hadn't been for the controversy. Probably the best thing that could have happened to him.

[MSUSteve]

I always liked Jeff Gerstmann, even if I didn't always agree with his reviews. I don't recall ever thinking he was way off base on a review, but I must admit, my memory for such things isn't exactly photographic.

[Rob_Merritt]

Warning for pc gamers who were thinking about pickup the pc version. The pc version is a port of the much crapper PS2 version, not the 360 version. :\

[zengonzo]

I always liked Jeff Gerstmann, even if I didn't always agree with his reviews. I don't recall ever thinking he was way off base on a review, but I must admit, my memory for such things isn't exactly photographic.

To be fair, I did only take notice of the fact that he was the writer when I felt the review was way off-base, so if he had better reviews I wouldn't have been aware. But I sure knew when he couldn't give a shit.

I've since grown a little more interested in the details of the industry, and less so in just reading the reviews of sites like Gamespot. The conversations and opinions I've received on here, even when objectionable, dissenting or indifferent, are much more engaging than the shallow churn-out from the big pro sites.

[MSUSteve]

I agree zen. I've noticed that in last year or so reviews have become fairly irrelevant to me, regardless of who writes them. I tend to get my gaming discussion and criticism from message boards and podcasts. I think the discussion format is much for helpful and insightful than any typical review could be. I'm not any kind of radical that thinks we should always discuss games on some deep existential level; that is, I think there is a place for discussions of how controls work, how the graphics/sound are, etc, but I like that stuff interspersed with personal feelings about, I dunno, how fun a game is or a cool anecdote about a particular part of the game.

[zengonzo]

Right on .. Once the game is reduced to its technical elements and the formulaic ratings of each element - well, just doesn't sound fun.

[BlueJackalope]

Picked up and played a gang of this over the weekend.

Its undeniably fun. Quite a bit more like H:UD than I had hoped.

The Hulk looks great, he did seem a little small at first, but that is a function of the camera more than anything. The camera being set back pays dividends as the game goes on. Being able to target helicopters on the run is a godsend.

I've been playing as Joe Fixit or Gray Hulk, but I'm searching for those comic book covers and will getting my classic Hulk on (where Bruce Banner was able to get his supply of purple toughskins was always the most Incredible thing about the 70's Hulk).

I like that if he wants the Hulk can stand his ground and fight would be Hulkbusters, but eventually he just gets annoyed and runs or jumps away.
I love how destructive the battles are, I regularly try to battle flyers at the top of buildings, that are then regularly reduced to rubble. The battle against the U-Foes was epic. I really hope there are a lot more supervillain battles in the future of this game. I'm actually encouraged for the future of comic book action games by the combat.

It has its share of problems (more than a few bugs, some amusing, some not so amusing) and I miss H:UD's desert setting for sure, the city is pretty well realized, but can feel a little small and cramped at times. (I'd also like a reason for the invisible walls that block off the bridges).

It's not H:UD, but it will do until Prototype is released.

[zengonzo]

The battle against the U-Foes was epic. I really hope there are a lot more supervillain battles in the future of this game.

Don't know how far you've gotten, you might be playing more of the side-stuff than run straight through the main story as I have .. But after you fight the U-Foes once they start to appear through the city, much like the Enclave. It can get pretty messy when you end up fighting off both them and the military ..

[BlueJackalope]

Don't know how far you've gotten, you might be playing more of the side-stuff than run straight through the main story as I have .. But after you fight the U-Foes once they start to appear through the city, much like the Enclave. It can get pretty messy when you end up fighting off both them and the military ..


Yeah, I've gotten into a few of those scrapes, really good when you've got a level 5 going on with tanks and the advanced hulkbusters and one of two of the U-Foes to deal with.

[zengonzo]

Ah, gotcha'. I like that they've given a complete menu on what you need to do to get every unlock - very cool in light of an open worlder .. But I sure wish they'd organized it better. It can be very tedious to go through and figure out what I'm missing, what I need to get this or that .. Tabs and categories would've made it vastly better.

[BlueJackalope]

Ah, gotcha'. I like that they've given a complete menu on what you need to do to get every unlock - very cool in light of an open worlder .. But I sure wish they'd organized it better. It can be very tedious to go through and figure out what I'm missing, what I need to get this or that .. Tabs and categories would've made it vastly better.

The unlocks (the combat and movement related ones anyway) seem appropriately related to the story. You have to do some open world stomping around to defeat so many of these guys or jump the equivalent of a trip around the moon, and beat a certain story segment. Which gives a feeling of Hulk getting steadily stronger.

On the minigames, I played the smash cars one, but want to go back and do it now that I can combo with a lightpole. I can see it on the minimap if I filter for mini-games, but the starting thingy isn't there. Can I not re-do these things?

[zengonzo]

I think if you click on them at set them as a waypoint they will let you .. That was just speculation, though, I hadn't actually tried it. It isn't obvious, though. I remember the game saying you could come back to any challenge, didn't it?

[BlueJackalope]

While I'm thinking about it...I like the way he climbs buildings a lot more than wall running. He isn't the Flash, he's the Hulk.

Plus I like the level of control his new ape swinging ways give him.

[Adree]

wii version looks GREAT!

http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2008/167/reviews/944984_20080616_screen005.jpg

[Bahimiron]

It's like a photograph!

Of a game!

Being played on the Wii!

And it looks like hell!

[Other Brendan]

Desolate city shrouded in mist, no cars, two people who look straight out of Robotron in that screen... I think this qualifies as a post-apocalyptic Hulk game.

[Bob Violence]

Um, wow...that's some sort of unpopulated prototype, right? Right???

(And why is it 1200x661?)

[ElGuapo]

Poor Wii.

Anyway, I read on the official website that the free multiplayer DLC will have co-op, objective (whatever that is), and free play. Supposed to be out at the end of the month. Exciting!

[zengonzo]

Hmm, not sure if that's enough to make me hold onto it (from GameFly). I feel like I've plumbed the depths of making a building come down.

I haven't unlocked any of the other characters yet - do they add much to the game?

[ElGuapo]

Not really but they are fun. I particularly like Classic Hulk and Maestro. They are more for fans of the comic storylines, and appreciated. But they don't do anything different, they are just slightly different models/skins.

I'm going to use Maestro eventually to get the "destroy every building in a neighborhood" achievement.

[BlueJackalope]

Would be nice if the skins actually did do something to the game play.

Classic Hulk could be quicker to rage but quicker to lose rage (for instance).

Gray Hulk(s) could be weaker in the daytime.

Red Hulk could suck.





(I don't know if the Red Hulk sucks, I haven't read anything post WWH - which ruled most awesomely, just jokin)

[zengonzo]

Particularly for when the multiplayer comes around.

[Bahimiron]

Finally got it and god, do I love it.

I won't lie. I wish that the world was as fully realized as GTA4 or that the draw distance was as amazing as Crackdown, but at the end of the day I sit down and say I'm gonna play this game for fifteen minutes and then an hour later I realize I'm still playing. Thanks to the sound effects, finding Gamma thingies is the new finding orbs. Thanks to the microachievements, the game totally has that 'just one more!' quality.

I wish the fury cannisters had as unique a sound effect as the gamma ones do, though. Their sound effect is too similar to that of some of the flying enemies.

Also, while I understand the necessity for the threat meter, there are times where I'm just enjoying myself with some Hulkour and I don't want to deal with a bunch of stupid tanks and laser dudes with jetpacks.

Finally, when I knock out a bunch of struts under the raised highway and then I knock down a highway section, it's a pretty egregious bit of immersion shattering to look back and see that the rest of the highway is just floating there with nothing holding it up.

[zengonzo]

I liked the various interpretations of melee weapons: lampposts as foils, vehicles as hammers and gauntlets, pavement as discus.

[ElGuapo]

When you break a big tree apart you get all three. A section that's like a lamppost, one that's a smashing bit, and one that's a hammer.

I just got the "Threat Level 9" achievement last night at the same time as the "Destroy a whole neighborhood. It was epic, huge fight.

[BlueJackalope]

You unlock threat levels by playing the story missions yes?

I noticed that no matter how hard I tried I couldn't get it above 5 for awhile, but now I get to 8 pretty easily.

[ElGuapo]

Yes. It announces in a bar in the bottom when the Threat Level has been upgraded. In specific, Threat Level 9 is unlocked




**************SPOILERS*****




*******************************************
After the first fight against a Tony Stark Hulkbuster ****
*******************************************




******** END SPOILER ****************


How do you do that scroll bar thing embedded in a post?

[Bahimiron]

Is there a way to save without quitting?

I lost a bunch of non-story work because I assumed (stupidly, I guess) that the game saved every time you did anything important, like finding gamma or fury cannisters. Crackdown and Assassin's Creed did!

Now every time I find four or five cannisters, I just quit out to make sure I don't lose that work due to my dying X-Box.

[BlueJackalope]

Is there a way to save without quitting?

I lost a bunch of non-story work because I assumed (stupidly, I guess) that the game saved every time you did anything important, like finding gamma or fury cannisters. Crackdown and Assassin's Creed did!

Now every time I find four or five cannisters, I just quit out to make sure I don't lose that work due to my dying X-Box.


I don't think so, I actually had the game freeze the other night, after I'd spent 45 minutes systematically destroying every land mark I hadn't already destroyed.

I haven't turned the box back on, but I'm pretty sure it didn't save. I don't know if it auto-saves after mission though.

[zengonzo]

Ugh, that's painful! I guess you have the joy of getting to do it again.

By the way, what's the quickest way to raze? I assume someone has a good strategy nailed down.

[Bahimiron]

Someone needs to tell these devs that if their night cycle is just going to be a hideous muddy mess, they shouldn't bother.

[Bahimiron]

Okay, is there an easy way to defeat Hulkbusters?

They seem to be immune to every attack except for the rage-powered thunderclap. So the fight is me trying to avoid dying while running around and smashing cars to fill my rage meter so I can get off six to ten thunderclaps on the guy, assuming he doesn't jump out of range during the twenty minute powerup animation?

Cos if that's really the only way to beat this guy, someone at Sega needs a kick in the balls. It's not hard, but it's quite possibly the most tedious boss battle I've dealt with outside of a JRPG.

[ZekeDMS]

I never found one. Sometimes a fully charged attack will do it without spending rage, but the fight was really irritating. It exemplified my biggest complaint with the game's combat, they were everything wrong with it. Block block wait, run away block, spend a rage power and hope you can get in reasonable damage in the short stun period. Nearly impossible to get near in the first place, and when you got close enough to use the power, they often hit you with something before you can finish charging it up.

[Bahimiron]

It doesn't help that the lock-on mechanism for the game is fucking awful, so when you defeat one Hulkbuster and it regenerates and a thousand helicopters come at you, they're way harder to defeat than they should be. Toss in questionable combo mechanics and the fact that even the regeneration supermove takes longer to execute than it should and you've got an absolute pain in the ass boss battle.

Oh, also a fun wrinkle. I've had to do it four times, but I've only died once. Every other time has been because my 360 decided to stop working at some point.

I love the fact that the game teaches you these goddam Fury moves and says 'hey, they point of doing this is that they can't be blocked!' and then you get into a boss fight and he blocks every goddam one of them. Excellent level design, Sega, you bunch of fucking dipshits.

[Nengjanggo]

The anti-hulkbuster strategy that work for me was: hit them with three or so X attacks, all of which they block, but it makes them stand still for a second so I can do hit them with a fully charged Y attack. I think I had my Y attack upgraded to the "can't be blocked" level, which can of course be blocked but isn't most of the time. That stuns them (I think), then you hit them with a couple of other attacks. Then jump away because they come out of stun by doing some super attack. Repeat this over and over and over. Tedious as hell but maybe slightly better than using Rage attacks (which also don't work very well, because they almost always jump away).

I agree with bahimiron's complaints.

[Bahimiron]

Ugh.

I need to stop playing this game. Everyone else has. I need to set down the controller before I lose it.

I'm doing this challenge where you need to get through a certain level without getting hit by lightning. But it requires precise control, which Hulk does not provide. Not only will Hulk routinely not aim the direction you are pointing the stick, but there are times where he doesn't grab ahold of things when you press the grabby button. Worst of all is the fact that to dodge the lightning the game tells you to jump laterally, but Hulk will routinely get stuck on the corners of buildings. And if you do manage to get to the end of the level, you have to blow something up in a very, very small area and Hulk will routinely get distracted from hitting the extremely important thing that will end the level and will instead punch some of the random bad guys who are just wandering around. I cannot imagine anyone beating this challenge through anything other than sheer, dumb luck.

Whoever at Sega came up with this? I want you to open your desk drawer, put your balls in it and then shut the drawer as hard as you can.

[Nengjanggo]

Did you get the "Don't touch the ground" achievement on that other level? I replayed the level several times and couldn't get the stupid hulk to land in the stupid green square at the end (landing outside it means you don't get the achievement, apparently), because when you fall from a great height about halfway down the camera suddenly points sideways, not down, no matter how badly you want to see the ground, and you can't aim for where you want to go.

[Bahimiron]

I didn't even try. I really just wanted to unlock every power and this was my last one.

I just did it. The lightning never touched me. Not once.

Then the game didn't give me credit for it. Mission over. No upgrade. No achievement.

This POS is going on eBay.

[ElGuapo]

Where's the free multiplayer DLC?

[BlueJackalope]

I haven't finished, but out of boredom more than frustration. Its a shame the game seems to peak so early (the U-Foes appearance). I'll probably finish it out of curiousity more than anything, at some point.

In the meantime, I'm hoping to use it for trade bait with one of my friends who bought BF:BC.

[Bahimiron]

My main advice to anyone playing it is to get all of the achievements you might want to go for (destroy a neighborhood, destroy all the landmarks) out of the way before you beat the game. Once it unlock threat level 9, it starts sending Hulkbusters after you. The game's first fight with the Hulkbuster isn't fun at all. Combining a Hulkbuster coming after you with infinite respawning armor guys? It's misery.

[ElGuapo]

So I guess the 360 version of this is never getting multiplayer? Since it says it has multiplayer on the box and on the website, can I return it and claim fraud?

I liked it, but it's irritating we never got the free DLC promised.

[ZekeDMS]

I don't know. I find it pretty damn annoying, since the MP promise was so strong at the start. I'm not normally too concerned with it, but the idea of double hulking on the city, too awesome. And no, Crackdown is not a substitute.

Very irritating that it's been so long, given the claims of the box itself.

[Bahimiron]

...really?

Well. Here's hoping I can get $30 for this at Gamestop and I hope it gets bought used and then sold back and then bought used and sold back and someone at Sega sheds a tear.

[ElGuapo]

Free DLC multiplayer for this is out for 360! I don't have time to try it out tonight but I downloaded it. It's a patch/update + free 500 MB download in the DLC section.

I'll post some impressions if I get a chance to try it out.

[zengonzo]

Get out!

[ZekeDMS]

You lie! I may actually bother with this game over the original again.

[ElGuapo]

Just tried it. First match was a little frentic. It was hard to keep track of each other as we jumped around. It appears there are several different game type (I did Hulk Smash!) and several arenas, which are parts of the city walled off by a green forcefield. The Times Square map I played on was probably 3 x 3 blocks. So it's not the whole city, but enough to have a little chase. Gameplay is exactly as in the single player game, with lockon and buttons and such.

There is no documentation or help or anything with the multiplay so I was a little lost, but I want to try it again.

[BlueJackalope]

Any more impressions? I didn't notice this (been noodling with my new PC more than the 360 these days).

Its competitive MP or co-op?