Sparkplay is hiring!

[DavidKaye]

Would be threadcops: I am posting this with Tom's blessing. His benediction, if you will.

We're going to be hiring for a bunch of positions over the coming weeks, but as of right now are looking for a Senior Game Designer, a Senior Software Engineer and a Software Engineer.

You can find out more about the positions on the website (http://www.sparkplaymedia.com/jobs.php), but here's a quick blurb about us:

Sparkplay Media is a small but well-funded startup developing casual-ish MMOs and social games. We're a veteran team working outside the publisher system (yarr!) and are backed by the same folks that funded great companies like Tivo and Netflix. Why should you care? Because this translates into an environment in which we as a team have complete creative control over our games and work free from external meddling by corporate drones. At Sparkplay, you're part of a team that's small enough that everybody can (and must) contribute meaningfully. If you just want to punch the clock you're going to hate this job, but if you're interested in stretching your abilities and being part of a fun, independent team get in touch with us.

Sparkplay's office (which is a former speakeasy!) is in the historic, lively North Beach neighborhood of San Francisco. Dozens of restaurants, bars, and clubs are located in the surrounding blocks and a park is right across the street.

If you're interested, drop me a line here or at jobs ( at ) sparkplaymedia.com.

Happy to answer any questions you have about us either in this thread or just PM me.

[The Chinese Lawyer]

If you just want to punch the clock you're going to hate this job
I must ask if this is some language to expect lots of overtime hours. Here in China we have a big problem with this trick.

[DavidKaye]

We're a startup and we do work hard. We control deadlines and schedule, though, so if anything you'll find less insane crunch than at a regular developer. Mostly though, that speaks to the kind of people we're looking for. It's a small team so we need people who don't just want to be put in a very specific little box and just do that thing. We want people who are smart and creative.

[flyinj]

Serious question:

Are you guys furries, and/or is this supposed to appeal to the furry community?

[DavidKaye]

Well, we *do* have Yiffing Fridays but participation is not mandatory.

Kidding. No, we are not furries. They're as welcome to play our game as anyone else, of course, but they are not a specific target for us.

We went with anthro characters because we thought the art style would give us the possibility of cross-cultural appeal: most Western MMOs (except WoW, significantly) tend to go pseudo-realistic which basically eliminates the possibility of appealing anywhere outside the West.

From the reaction we've had so far from potential international distribution partners, that decision was the right one.

[Stroker Ace]

Do you have a family? How do you imagine parents and other people with regular personal obligations will integrate with your smart and creative work schedule?

[Nick Walter]

Do you have a family? How do you imagine parents and other people with regular personal obligations will integrate with your smart and creative work schedule?

What the heck kind of question is that? Are you a communist?

In America work comes first.

[SirBruce]

All I know about Sparkplay is that Matt Mihaly seems like a stand-up guy. But I have no first-hand knowledge of the work environment.

Bruce

[flyinj]

Ok whew... I just sent you a PM.

[DavidKaye]

Well, we already have someone working for us who is a parent. He seems to be doing just fine.

[MattMihaly]

All I know about Sparkplay is that Matt Mihaly seems like a stand-up guy. But I have no first-hand knowledge of the work environment.

Bruce


Thanks Bruce! The work environment is not really 'set' yet insofar as we only picked up the keys to our offices earlier this week. The computers don't even arrive until mid-week next week.

What we primarily want are people for whom this isn't just a job/paycheck. It needs to be a passion, as in any startup that has a hope of being successful. If you're passionate about something, you'll work hard at it. At the same time, making games is a creative enterprise and burnout is, I think, death for creativity.

Is it a job where you show up at 9 and go home at 6 regardless of what has or hasn't been accomplished that day? No. On the other hand, the tales I hear of crunch at most publisher-funded game development studios turn my stomach. I would personally never work for a development studio that abused its employees in the manner that some publishers and dev studios seem to (disclaimer: I've never worked for anyone in the games industry but myself so I don't have first-hand experience there.)

I guess the answer is that saying we're not interested in people who are just there to punch the clock is saying that if you're not going to be passionate about what you're doing, look elsewhere. We don't want to make people work. We want them to be excited about working, and I have a hard time seeing how someone can remain excited about work if some jackass boss has chained him/her to a desk for 12 hours a day. If you're putting in an occasional 12 hour day, it better be because there's this feature you just can't wait to get done rather than because you've been ordered to.

[Jojo]

I'm confused at the correlation between work hours and passion. So if I only work my regular hours (because I'm a parent) I therefore can't possibly have a passion for my job? That seems a little disingenuous. Passion is measured in unpaid overtime!

[Nick Walter]

I'm confused at the correlation between work hours and passion. So if I only work my regular hours (because I'm a parent) I therefore can't possibly have a passion for my job? That seems a little disingenuous. Passion is measured in unpaid overtime!

Having a passion, having an interest, means not stopping at 5pm if you could complete the function you were right in the middle of with 30 minutes more work. It means being willing to work late in the occasional crisis. It means being a team player. It means working to the job, and not to the clock.

[Stroker Ace]

But day care closes in 17 minutes, Nick!

[Rob_Merritt]

Having a passion, having an interest, means not stopping at 5pm if you could complete the function you were right in the middle of with 30 minutes more work. It means being willing to work late in the occasional crisis. It means being a team player. It means working to the job, and not to the clock.

It also normally means you will be underpaid for your efforts and expected not to have a life outside of work. Family men/women need not apply. You will also be laid off at the drop of a hat since most start ups tend to fail within 18 months

[Nick Walter]

But day care closes in 17 minutes, Nick!

So sometimes you go get the kid, go home, and do more work from home. Having passion for the job isn't about any set time for arrival, any particular departure time, or any specific amount of hours worked. It's about providing exceptional results. That's what any employee owes to their employer.

[Nick Walter]

It also normally means you will be underpaid for your efforts and expected not to have a life outside of work. Family men/women need not apply. You will also be laid off at the drop of a hat since most start ups tend to fail within 18 months

No job is without risks, and in my experience the people who provide exceptional output garner exceptional rewards.

[Wheelkick]

Why all this hostility?
I want to see passion from the members in my team at work. If it's not there I need to find out how get it out of them. Passion means you'll look forward to challenges within your field of expertise. That can translate to working extra hours just to get stuff done, but not necessarily.
We have very passionate people at work, but they can still complain about work demanding too much from them. And that's when the managers step in and see to it that the passionate people get some rest.

[Conrad]

What we primarily want are people for whom this isn't just a job/paycheck. It needs to be a passion, as in any startup that has a hope of being successful. If you're passionate about something, you'll work hard at it.

That's a fine concept, but if I were a prospective employee and you told me this, my first question would be "and what do you plan on doing to sustain and nurture my passion?" Be sure to have a good answer for that.

[SirBruce]

I think part of the hostility was just a unfortunate choice of words by David. I think he meant "If you just want to punch the clock" in the "I'm only here to collect a paycheck" sense, not in the "I'm only here from nine to six" sense. Although passion does mean sometimes staying late, that's not what passion is about.

Bruce

[Kunikos]

No job is without risks, and in my experience the people who provide exceptional output garner exceptional rewards.

I'd like to know how that turned out for the former employees of Sigil Games.

[Coca Cola Zero]

I'd like to know how that turned out for the former employees of Sigil Games.

You consider Vanguard to be exceptional output?

Exceptionally BAD, maybe!

[Nick Walter]

I'd like to know how that turned out for the former employees of Sigil Games.

If they were top performers, even in an unsuccessful project, I'm sure the strong recommendations propelled them on to new opportunities to excel.

[SirBruce]

I'd like to know how that turned out for the former employees of Sigil Games.

Many if not most of the people at Sigil who got "fired" were immediately re-hired by SOE, usually at a higher wage than what they were getting paid before.

Bruce

[Qenan]

What the heck kind of question is that? Are you a communist?

In America work comes first.
Except for us pinkos.

[NoWayJose]

Why all this hostility?
I want to see passion from the members in my team at work. If it's not there I need to find out how get it out of them. Passion means you'll look forward to challenges within your field of expertise. That can translate to working extra hours just to get stuff done, but not necessarily.
We have very passionate people at work, but they can still complain about work demanding too much from them. And that's when the managers step in and see to it that the passionate people get some rest.
The hostility is that many people on Qt3 are veteran game developers who have lived through plenty of the "abuse" Mihaly mentioned earlier, and are leery of being told before even applying that long hours are expected. And then further told that "passion" means "staying beyond your normal workday without compensation regardless of the impact on your family life."

In my case, for example, I've worked on projects in the past which have gone into major extended crunch hours, hours I wouldn't even consider working now that I (like Jojo) am a parent. Which is one of the reasons I left that job. I had no problem telling my new employers during the hiring process that I was not interested in extended crunch and expected them to manage the scope of the project appropriately, rather than relying on the willingness of developers to work extra hours without pay to make up the difference between milestone promises and actual progress during the normal workday. They said this was a priority for them as well, and so far they've pretty much kept to that promise while we've managed to turn out a decent product. I take this as evidence other studios can do the same thing, rather than warn new hires about longer hours.

[Ed Solomon]

So sometimes you go get the kid, go home, and do more work from home. Having passion for the job isn't about any set time for arrival, any particular departure time, or any specific amount of hours worked. It's about providing exceptional results. That's what any employee owes to their employer.

So, all employees owe exceptional results?

Must all children be above average as well?

[MattMihaly]

The hostility is that many people on Qt3 are veteran game developers who have lived through plenty of the "abuse" Mihaly mentioned earlier, and are leery of being told before even applying that long hours are expected. And then further told that "passion" means "staying beyond your normal workday without compensation regardless of the impact on your family life."



Nobody said anything about without compensation. The implicit startup bargain is that you're probably going to end up putting in more than 40 hours a week, but if you're a good fit with the company you're doing it primarily because you're motivated to get that great product/game out the door. You're also doing it because you're provided with an incentive for the company to do well (stock options that should be worth more in the case of company success than overtime would have been).

Now, that's a risk, of course, but then generally the only way you can achieve rewards over and above "market rate" is to take risks, whether that's regarding investing your money in the stock market, betting on the ponies, or starting/working for a startup.

That's not for everybody, but then working a 9-5 job where there's less risk (even the biggest companies can go bankrupt and lay off the entire staff) and will never be an outsized reward (most jobs) isn't for everyone either (it's certainly not for me). It's just a personal preference based on inclination, where you're at in your life, and so on.

[MattMihaly]

So, all employees owe exceptional results?



Ideally, yes. More achievable in a smaller company of course, where you can really hand-pick your candidates vs. filling seats as larger companies have to do.

In practice I don't see any reason why you as a company (whether as CEO or junior designer) wouldn't want to work as much as possible exclusively with people who produce exceptional work.

[Ed Solomon]

Ideally, yes. More achievable in a smaller company of course, where you can really hand-pick your candidates vs. filling seats as larger companies have to do.

In practice I don't see any reason why you as a company (whether as CEO or junior designer) wouldn't want to work as much as possible exclusively with people who produce exceptional work.
Because exceptional means unusual; uncommon; extraordinary. You know, rare. It's like planning on only buying winning lottery tickets.

Hiring and retaining the exceptional is hard work, look at the effort Google goes to. Unless you're willing to go to a similar effort, basing your business plan on only employing the far-above average is ludicrous. "We'll only hire the exceptional. They'll do twice the work an average person can and we'll finish in half the time. It's fool-proof."

[MattMihaly]

Because exceptional means unusual; uncommon; extraordinary. You know, rare. It's like planning on only buying winning lottery tickets.

Hiring and retaining the exceptional is hard work, look at the effort Google goes to. Unless you're willing to go to a similar effort, basing your business plan on only employing the far-above average is ludicrous. "We'll only hire the exceptional. They'll do twice the work an average person can and we'll finish in half the time. It's fool-proof."

Oh, even Google doesn't employ only exceptional people. The company is far too large to manage that. The idea is to try to get as close to the ideal as possible (as in most things in life) all the while knowing it's essentially impossible to get there.

Scheduling-wise, I agree it'd be ludicrous to schedule based on the idea that you'll only hire exceptional people. Getting exceptional people is a bonus, albeit one you want to repeat with every hire if you can (again keeping in mind that of course that kind of universal perfection is not really achievable).

[Ed Solomon]

(...keeping in mind that of course that kind of universal perfection is not really achievable).

Well said.

[NoWayJose]

Oh, even Google doesn't employ only exceptional people. The company is far too large to manage that. The idea is to try to get as close to the ideal as possible (as in most things in life) all the while knowing it's essentially impossible to get there.

Scheduling-wise, I agree it'd be ludicrous to schedule based on the idea that you'll only hire exceptional people. Getting exceptional people is a bonus, albeit one you want to repeat with every hire if you can (again keeping in mind that of course that kind of universal perfection is not really achievable).
My experience tells me the truly exceptional people in this industry will be equally wary of "be prepared to work long hours" help-wanted ads of the type you've posted here. It's hard enough getting them to come to companies with established track records and with current employees confirming a manageable workload.

[SirBruce]

My experience tells me the truly exceptional people in this industry will be equally wary of "be prepared to work long hours" help-wanted ads of the type you've posted here. It's hard enough getting them to come to companies with established track records and with current employees confirming a manageable workload.

Can I point out *again* that nobody at SparkPlay posted any such thing? The just said they wanted passionate people who don't automatically go home at six (unless they have to). This "work long hours" is completely fabricated by posters reading subtext into what was actually said.

Bruce

[jerri blank]

Wow, Sparkplay folks, aren't you glad you posted your announcement here? Did that go exactly as planned, or what?

Not giving you a hard time - as someone outside the industry, I've just found the conversation really interesting, and I mean that sincerely. The same tensions exist in my field, which is law. I could have chosen to pursue the big firm route and work 80 hours a week for an assload of money, but I decided to have a life and work at a failing non-profit and be poor. :)

[VegasRobb]

Well it's still a discussion.

[Lorini]

Can I point out *again* that nobody at SparkPlay posted any such thing? The just said they wanted passionate people who don't automatically go home at six (unless they have to). This "work long hours" is completely fabricated by posters reading subtext into what was actually said.

Bruce

Bruce, they could have just said they wanted passionate people, which is great and positive. Adding the 'not automatically going home at 6:00' is going to raise a big red flag in most people's mind. I wouldn't want to work there, no matter how passionate I am about games. I have a kid and need a life balance. Also, as someone else posted, what's in it for me? Is this an employee owned company or a company with an equitable compensation plan? Or is my passion going to be used to give a couple of guys multi-million dollar boats?

[Shadari]

Well it's still a discussion.
Patience, my friend. :)

[Jojo]

I actually agree that working more than 9-5 is usually important for people at a start-up, which is why sadly I won't be working at one, probably ever, now I am a parent (whose partner also works full time). Assuming that people stand to profit down the line from the start-up's success, that's part of the gamble you take with a new company.

I just resent the implication that passionate = works long hours. I fully understand that David may not have meant to suggest that passion=long hours, but it struck a nerve because SO MANY employers in games believe this to be the case. I apologise for contributing to a threadjacking, as I don't wish to demean Sparkplay, not knowing them from Adam :)

And for full disclosure I worked on the same team as NoWayJose for several years of unpaid overtime. The results were a couple of great games, but I question whether we could have made equally great games with a bit more organisation and focus and little less mandatory overtime. I often see the people who stay at work for long hours, wasting several of those hours browsing the web, taking screen-breaks, having chit-chats, taking super-long lunches, arriving at work 2 hours later than everyone else etc. My hours are now determined by daycare hours, but I have the same schedule as I used to, so I am learning to be much more self-disciplined than ever before. Its a valuable skill that all employees should take a crash course in, and all employers and managers should learn to recognise.

[Damien Neil]

Why all this hostility?

Just about every software development job has a bit of crunch time. A schedule starts to slip, and a couple extra weeks of hard work will keep you on plan. That's fine.

When the job starts in crunch time, however, you'd better watch out. When the person trying to hire you cheerfully tells you that a 45-hour work week is too short, odds are that they're going to expect you to start out at 60 hours a week or so and ramp up to 80-hour weeks when the schedule falls apart.

Which isn't necessarily the case here. But after that kind of introduction, I wouldn't touch a job at Sparkplay with a twenty-foot pole.

[Damien Neil]

And for full disclosure I worked on the same team as NoWayJose for several years of unpaid overtime. The results were a couple of great games, but I question whether we could have made equally great games with a bit more organisation and focus and little less mandatory overtime. I often see the people who stay at work for long hours, wasting several of those hours browsing the web, taking screen-breaks, having chit-chats, taking super-long lunches, arriving at work 2 hours later than everyone else etc.

That's how it always goes. Work more hours, get less done. Want to get more done? Get enough sleep. Sleep deprivation kills productivity.

I've worked 80-hour weeks. I've worked 40-hour weeks. After three months of 80-hour weeks, I'm getting less done in a week than I'd get done in a single day if I'd been sticking to 40-hour weeks.

This is why when I hear an employer talking about how many hours they expect me to put in, I walk away quickly. I'd rather work somewhere that knows how to produce quality work without destroying their employees.

[SirBruce]

Bruce, they could have just said they wanted passionate people, which is great and positive. Adding the 'not automatically going home at 6:00' is going to raise a big red flag in most people's mind.

Again, re-read the original post. The unfortunate phrase "punch the clock" is in there, but nothing about not automatically going home at 6:00. They're talking about passion, not how many hours you work a week. It was someone else who overreacted to that, and it wasn't until Matt came in that Sparkplay even mentioned working past 6:00, but he clearly said that was not the norm and he didn't want people working 12 hour days.

Look, I've done the startup thing twice and I know what being worked to death is like. But not all startups are like that, and I don't think Sparkplay was trying to imply that anyone who they hire better be prepared to work 60+ hour weeks.

Bruce