Sins of a Solar Empire goes gold!

[Brad Wardell]

Well after a couple of years of development, Sins of a Solar Empire has gone gold! It'll be available next week at most stores in North America (more retailers than GalCiv II was at) as well as available for digital purchase via TotalGaming.net.

Here's a link to some screenshots from the last few days of gamma testing and a sneak peek at the successor to Stardock Central for distributing TotalGaming.net games (which, incidentally, will soon be allowing third parties to submit games, name their price, and after review have them automatically available for purchase and download via the new client).

http://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/index.aspx?AID=174092

If you guys have any questions, I'm a lurking. ;)

[Igor Muravyev]

When do we get it digitally (if we have the beta already)?

[Vincent_GC]

And I just now realized that I need to ride to LA and teach for the first half of next week.

Guess I got something to play in between breaks.

[flyinj]

I'm sure we'll have to wait a week for digital download as retail chains (GAMESTOP) have their hands around publisher's throats for ever having the nerve to give customers a more convenient and sooner option to get a game.

Anyhow, here's something I said in the other thread regarding the game:

I've been tooling around in the latest beta, and I'd like to make a few suggestions.

I'm a big pause and give orders kind of guy. It would be really nice if it drew the waypoints of the ships as I gave orders while paused.

And also, I'm sure you're aware of this, but remapping "spacebar" to pause doesn't work. It shows up in the keymapper, but pressing space in-game does not pause the game.

[BlairFraser]

I'm sure we'll have to wait a week for digital download as retail chains (GAMESTOP) have their hands around publisher's throats for ever having the nerve to give customers a more convenient and sooner option to get a game.

Anyhow, here's something I said in the other thread regarding the game:

I've been tooling around in the latest beta, and I'd like to make a few suggestions.

I'm a big pause and give orders kind of guy. It would be really nice if it drew the waypoints of the ships as I gave orders while paused.

And also, I'm sure you're aware of this, but remapping "spacebar" to pause doesn't work. It shows up in the keymapper, but pressing space in-game does not pause the game.

Not sure on when the digital download is available, Brad will know. We'll look into the waypoints during pause issue and we saw your post on the spacebar mapping issue in another thread and I'm pretty sure Jamie (posts here as SpaceFish) took care of it.

[flyinj]

Not sure on when the digital download is available, Brad will know. We'll look into the waypoints during pause issue and we saw your post on the spacebar mapping issue in another thread and I'm pretty sure Jamie (posts here as SpaceFish) took care of it.

Awesome! Thanks.

[Brad Wardell]

The digital download version for pre-orders will be Monday afternoonish EST.

[flyinj]

Would you mind enlightening us to the situation (hard time) that retail gives the physical publisher of the game? Do you hear or have to deal with any of that?

I'm assuming that's why digital is forced to wait for retail to get it in....

[SpaceFish]

You are now able to map the 'Pause' action to spacebar and have it actually function. I looked into it this morning and the problem was the 'Respond to Report' action is mapped by default to spacebar and is blocking your 'Pause' action. Thanks for pointing out the bug.

I agree with you on drawing waypoints of ships while paused. We will see what we can do.

[Tom Chick]

Jamie, in the latest build, there seems to be a similar issue with some of the hotkeys tripping over each other's toes. For instance, if you use the hotkey to find planets with logistics slots (CTL+V), it also triggers the hotkey to zoom the view (V). The net effect is a 70s style zoom shot of a planet with a logistics slot. :)

-Tom

[Chaplin]

I am loathe to bring up the whole "ship date" vs "store date" but the press release on Blues news seems to really contradict what I expected.

http://www.bluesnews.com/cgi-bin/board.pl?action=viewthread&threadid=84592

The release says that Sins will be available both on Totalgaming.net and in most retail stores on February 4th. I was expecting that the 4th would be a ship day (Monday) and the 5th (Tuesday) would be a store date. This combined with the statement that the digital version would probably be available Monday "noonish EST" has me unsure what the fastest method of getting Sins is.

So, for those of us trying to plan our, um, sick day next week, what is the earliest availability (and method) for Sins?

[BlindSwordsman]

Well after a couple of years of development, Sins of a Solar Empire has gone gold! It'll be available next week at most stores in North America (more retailers than GalCiv II was at) as well as available for digital purchase via TotalGaming.net.

Here's a link to some screenshots from the last few days of gamma testing and a sneak peek at the successor to Stardock Central for distributing TotalGaming.net games (which, incidentally, will soon be allowing third parties to submit games, name their price, and after review have them automatically available for purchase and download via the new client).

http://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/index.aspx?AID=174092

If you guys have any questions, I'm a lurking. ;)

Congrats Brad to you and Ironclad! Many of us at work are looking forward to this one! Can't wait to play - pre-ordered a few weeks ago :)

[Brad Wardell]

So, for those of us trying to plan our, um, sick day next week, what is the earliest availability (and method) for Sins?

42.

Actually it's really hard to say as who knows when the retailers will actually put it out. But it'll be available late afternoon via TotalGaming.net either way digitally. I think on Friday they begin shipping the boxes to people who pre-ordered boxes.

[mono]

The impulse distribution app looks cool. Does it support any community features such as friends lists/groups/server browsing ala Steam, or is it primarily a distribution platform?

[BlairFraser]

Jamie, in the latest build, there seems to be a similar issue with some of the hotkeys tripping over each other's toes. For instance, if you use the hotkey to find planets with logistics slots (CTL+V), it also triggers the hotkey to zoom the view (V). The net effect is a 70s style zoom shot of a planet with a logistics slot. :)

-Tom

Fixed, thx for the report. Jamie the SpaceFish wizard waved his magic wand and *flash* all was well in the land of hotkeys. He also completely reorganized them into proper categories and added some new requests such as the collapse/expand all empire tree nodes (already mentionned) plus hotkeys for buying/selling/bidding and most other Underground operations.

[RepoMan]

Oh hot damn. We are in Seattle right now with no PC access. As soon as we get back we have to put the house back together from the blizzard of paint and carpets that descended on it in our absence. I should be able to get the PC set up again by... oh... I don't know... MONDAY NIGHT :-D :-D :-D :-D :-D

<Stimpy> JOY!!!!!! </Stimpy>

[Brad Wardell]

The impulse distribution app looks cool. Does it support any community features ala friends lists/groups/server browsing ala Steam, or is it primarily a distribution platform?

Not initially but it will be Spring/Summer. It'll incorporate blogging, chat, and some social networking features and more of our non-game tech into it.

If you want to see a primitive version of the blogging beta check out http://www.joeuserbeta.com/ (it's still in testing). But picture users being able to chat, see what games their friends are playing (unless set to private), etc. And it'll be an open system. That is, we hope to make it so that even if you're using a third party game not on TG.net that it will still let you know what they're up to and let you join them. But that's a bit down the line.

The goal with Impulse is to bring our various techs into a single sleak environment. And then let developers submit their games, utilities, whatever, name their price, and then after review have them be available for others to buy (we do this now on WinCustomize (http://www.wincustomize.com/skins.aspx?skinid=6344&libid=1)with skins and themes for third party skin authors).

Stardock Central may have the distinction of being the first digital distribution client but it's pretty long in the teeth at this point (i.e. first also means oldest <g>). So Impulse brings a lot of technological improvements to the table.

But for now, we're just glad to get Sins of a Solar Empire out there for people.

I have to say, and you guys have known me a long time, this has been an awesome project to be on. I'm not aware of any examples where the publisher and development teams worked so closely together and I think the final game really shows what's possible when two groups of fans of the genre are working together on something.

[Taranis]

Wonderful news! Any idea if or when a demo will be available for download?

[Xemu]

Nice, can't wait to play Monday night! Just in time for me to have on my laptop for DICE.

[flyinj]

Is it worth playing through the tutorial now, or has so much changed in the retail that I'd be missing out on a lot?

[smallbutwirey]

If I buy and download the beta now, is the Gold version a completely new download, or just a relatively small update? The reason I ask is that I'm limited to 10GB/month in downloads (no such thing as unlimited broadband in Australia) and I don't want to blow out my monthly limit by downloading everything twice.

Also, how big is the download? The specs list 3GB as required HDD space, so I'm guessing something a smidge less than that, after compression.

Cheers.

[Brad Wardell]

Don't bother with the beta. Just wait until the actual release and get that.

The final version is drastically different (better).

[Njal]

Wooot!

[ckessel]

I have to say, and you guys have known me a long time, this has been an awesome project to be on. I'm not aware of any examples where the publisher and development teams worked so closely together and I think the final game really shows what's possible when two groups of fans of the genre are working together on something.

Hey, we wouldn't expect anything less :). Seriously though, Stardock (and you yourself in particular) has a fanstastic reputation amongst gamers for quality, both in designs and stability, and community involvement. I don't like RTS games, but I've ordered SotSE based soley on what I read here and Stardock's reputation. Even if I find it's too much RTS for my taste, I'm sure one or 2 of my more RTS oriented friends will enjoy it.

You've set the bar high and I think I would have been dissapointed if you/stardock hadn't brought that same level of care to it's integrations with a 3rd party developer.

[AaronSofaer]

Hey, we wouldn't expect anything less :). Seriously though, Stardock (and you yourself in particular) has a fanstastic reputation amongst gamers for quality, both in designs and stability, and community involvement.


QFMFT.

I really appreciate the (very) few developers out there who actually get involved with the community on more than a PR level.

[CustodianV131]

Thanks for the fantasy 4X game sneak peak! Glad to see its still forging ahead!

Best of luck with Sins of a Solar Empire, hope it will be a great succes again like Gal Civ II

[Citiznmatt]

Thanks for the fantasy 4X game sneak peak! Glad to see its still forging ahead!


Did I miss something?

[Brad Wardell]

QFMFT.

I really appreciate the (very) few developers out there who actually get involved with the community on more than a PR level.

I'm not really a game developer. I'm just a gamer who learned how to program. Seriously, that's how I got started -- comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic back in the 90s. Just hanging out talking about games we wanted and finally picked up Teach Yourself C in 21 days and the rest is history. :)

[KieronGillen]

Did I miss something?

Concept art on the wall in the link.

KG

[Adam B]

Congrats team on finishing!

So pumped for this game.

[Jonathan Crane]

Two quick questions:

1) Can you adjust the speed of the game? Either via menu or (like DoW) through a hack?

2) How do you handle non-trivial diplomacy in a RTS? Does it all happen from within the paused game state?

Thanks!

[Mike O'Malley]

I think it would work better if diplomacy didn't work within the paused state. The time dimension would give you the ability to pressure other players into accepting that defense pact RIGHT NOW, before they think it all the way through, among other things.

[Brad Wardell]

Regarding speed. yes, you can set the speed of the game.

Regarding diplomacy. Depends on what you mean by non-trivial. It's not nearly as heavy duty as what's in GalCiv or Civ but it's more than I've seen in an RTS before.

The bounty system is a new concept (for me anyway) that turn based games could (and should) have that adds a considerable amount of depth.

[Tom Chick]

There are three gamespeeds, and they vary greatly, but you can only set them at the beginning of the game. I do wish there was an option to change gamespeed as you play, because the pace can be pretty erratic: long stretches of building up, scouting out your enemy, cat-and-mouse fleet movement, and then-- OHSHITEVERYTHING'SEXPLODINATING!!1!. For the most part, the tactical AI plays just fine, but there are definitely some ships that would benefit from some micro. A variable speed slider would help out here, and it would also make it easy to just sometimes slow it down and admire the heck out of the graphics, which are worth admiring. I love the artwork and graphics in this game.

The diplomacy stuff is pretty straightforward: exchange resources, open trade, non-aggression, alliance, and two modes of shared vision. In games with AI, the computer players will make slightly silly offers, such as: "Hey, kill ten buildings belonging to that player across the map and I'll give you 1000 credits! Otherwise, I'll like you 15% less!" It's easy to manage.

Yesterday, I was kvetching a bit about how culture works in team games, which seemed to mess up the dynamics of team play somewhat, at least in terms of the culture system, which is a bit like borders in Rise of Nations. Today, Blair Frasier posts on the game's forum that they've fixed it, and as of the day zero patch, culture will be a full-featured part of team games. Wow. Just freakin' wow.

-Tom

[Lorini]

Are you doing a review of the game for a gaming publication Tom? If so, can you say which one?

[Tom Chick]

Right now, I'm just playing for fun, Jennifer. But I've got plenty to say about this game (mostly 'I <heart> Sins' kind of things), so I'll definitely be posting stuff here about it.

-Tom

[NowhereDan]

Hopefully you've learned to be wary of wormholes, Tom!

[BlairFraser]

There are three gamespeeds, and they vary greatly, but you can only set them at the beginning of the game. I do wish there was an option to change gamespeed as you play, because the pace can be pretty erratic: long stretches of building up, scouting out your enemy, cat-and-mouse fleet movement, and then-- OHSHITEVERYTHING'SEXPLODINATING!!1!.
-Tom

Actually we just finished testing and implementing something that helps smooth this hilly landscape out. Got to it BEFORE you suggested it. We want the activity heavy moments to be slower and the oh my god I have to move my entire 150 ship fleet to the other side of my empire to beat up that back stabbing ally to be substantially faster (this is particularly impt in multiplayer). Moving in friendly territory that is not contested will give your ships who are no longer at battlestations, not diverting powers to shield etc, the ability to travel quite a bit faster. Reinforcements, fleet repositionning, ally defense etc are all much more viable (even before Vasari get Phase Stabilizers) and it saves a lot of *dead* time. Fleet positioning, defensive preparations, scouting etc are still very important and there is still the sense of omg can I get back in time but its not ridiculous. Obviously, ships will remain at a decent, manageable, cool battle maneuver speed when the action starts up and they refocus their power output to combat systems.

This will be included in the day 0 BONUS PACK (there is actually more content, tools and new features in this than fixes so its not a patch :P)

[Lorini]

Well I can't wait for the game myself. I'm still agonizing over the retail box vs the download vs the download + CE stuff. The retail box is actually $5 cheaper than the download, at least from Best Buy, but I'll probably cave if I can download it on Monday vs waiting til Tuesday.

[BlairFraser]

Well I can't wait for the game myself. I'm still agonizing over the retail box vs the download vs the download + CE stuff. The retail box is actually $5 cheaper than the download, at least from Best Buy, but I'll probably cave if I can download it on Monday vs waiting til Tuesday.

If you could see the gorgeous mega awesome double-sided 300+ research topic tech tree poster in the CE you wouldn't be having this debate. It's honestly my most favoritist piece of game art of any game (including my Final Fantasy I world map poster!!!).

[Pentadact]

If you alter the tech tree in an update, will you supply a sticky patch for the tech-tree poster to make it 1.1 compliant?

Great to hear about the friendly-territory speed boost - even on Fastest, I seem to spend a lot of time waiting for things to move. I actually just wish fastest was faster. You can always use pause for fleet-battle micro-management.

[Tom Chick]

We want the activity heavy moments to be slower and the oh my god I have to move my entire 150 ship fleet to the other side of my empire to beat up that back stabbing ally to be substantially faster (this is particularly impt in multiplayer). Moving in friendly territory that is not contested will give your ships who are no longer at battlestations, not diverting powers to shield etc, the ability to travel quite a bit faster. Reinforcements, fleet repositionning, ally defense etc are all much more viable (even before Vasari get Phase Stabilizers) and it saves a lot of *dead* time. Fleet positioning, defensive preparations, scouting etc are still very important and there is still the sense of omg can I get back in time but its not ridiculous. Obviously, ships will remain at a decent, manageable, cool battle maneuver speed when the action starts up and they refocus their power output to combat systems.

Hmm, I'm not sure how I feel about this. Right now, I really like the pace of the strategic gameplay. I like how important it is to scout and pay attention to factors like fleet positioning. I like that it matters on which side of a system my fleet sits. I also like how you have to get ready for incoming pirates, which can really be a dilemma. I like that it takes a while for reinforcements to arrive, and that a bigger empire needs more frigate factories. I trust you guys know your game well enough, but my first inclination is to be skeptical that intraterritorial movement should be any faster. Whatever you do, don't change it because you think the game plays too slowly!

Besides, it's not a micromanagement issue. That stuff is easy enough to handle, particularly if you know enough to right click on the Grouping Status button. My complaint is more with managing -- or, heck, even slowing the game down enough to watch and enjoy -- ships' special abilities. I'd much rather you guys just toss in a speed slider like Kohan and Rise of Nations has. :)

Of course, it's easy for me to type that (Just toss it in!), but I'm not sure how hard it is to actually do it. And I'm also not sure how widely used the feature would be, so it might not even be worth the effort.

-Tom

[Tom Chick]

See, just the fact that Pentaduct wants the game to play faster -- Pentaduct, have you watch what your ships are and aren't doing while the game whizzes by? -- makes me think the solution is a speed slider, not an innate adjustment to the strategic pacing. With a speed slider, we can both play how we want to play!

-Tom

[Tom Chick]

Hopefully you've learned to be wary of wormholes, Tom!

Man, you aren't kidding. BTW, I assumed it was Dan Morris last night! Doh!

I don't know if you guys could see the chat I left for you in the lobby, but that was an excellent game. A fair bit of fumbling around, like a bunch of guys playing chess who don't quite know how to checkmate each other, but I learned a lot. BTW, did the pirates do anything other than feed your cap ships xp? Because that cost us a heck of a lot of money.

Looking forward to a rematch!

-Tom

[Igor Muravyev]

Does the retail version have a campaign?

Is there a newbie guide somewhere for those of us who have preordered? I am getting lost in all this.

[Tom Chick]

No campaign, if you care about that sort of thing. Frankly, I'm glad they didn't bother. But there is something even better: Achievements!

As for a newbie guide, the manual is a bit vague in places, but it suffices. However, when it comes to ingame tooltips and tutorials, Sins does a great job.

-Tom, at 29% Achievements and counting

[Ben Sones]

Yeah, this game needs a campaign like Civ needs a campaign. Which is to say: not even a little.

[mouselock]

No campaign, if you care about that sort of thing. Frankly, I'm glad they didn't bother. But there is something even better: Achievements!

Wait.. does that mean the retail game is only useful for MP? Or is it a "free form" type thing like Civ?

(I bought this a long time ago but haven't checked out the beta because, well, it's beta and I have no time. But I'll probably check out the released version eventually, so I'm curious.)

[davidf]

More like a realtime Galciv meets Imperium Galatica IMO

[davidf]

I pre-ordered how can i find out which version i bought? Someone said you could check in stardock, but i didn't see a way. I'm really hoping I ordered the box version, I REALLY want to dig into the manual. Despite playing the beta for a bit and all the tutorials, i still feel like i'm dog paddeling around some parts of the game :)

[Taranis]

Wonderful news! Any idea if or when a demo will be available for download?
I'm not sure if my post was missed or if I'm on Brad and Blair's ignore list, but I'm very interested in this game and would like too demo it before I purchase to see if its my type of strategy. Everything I've heard so far makes it out to be a terrific game. ;-)

[PCG_Norman]

BTW, did the pirates do anything other than feed your cap ships xp? Because that cost us a heck of a lot of money.


The pirates were really annoying, especially since the bidding war left us penniless. But some of the time, we just abandoned the sector under attack and let the pirates have their way with Dan's orbital sattelites. It wasn't a big deal since they didn't bring siege frigates to bombard the planet/asteriod, and would leave after a little while.

[Jab]

As for retail vs download, is the collector's edition going to be available in store ,or only from stardock ? And on the website it says that shipping will be $15 last time I checked, is that right? I thought $7 from Telltale was high but does the collector's really come with alot more stuff?

[Jonathan Crane]

Besides, it's not a micromanagement issue. That stuff is easy enough to handle, particularly if you know enough to right click on the Grouping Status button. My complaint is more with managing -- or, heck, even slowing the game down enough to watch and enjoy -- ships' special abilities. I'd much rather you guys just toss in a speed slider like Kohan and Rise of Nations has. :)


The ideal "flow" state is going to vary from player to player, and even at different times in the course of a game for any individual player. For multiplayer, it makes sense to have a discrete speed that is constant for the whole game. Since most gamers play single player, however, I think it makes sense to let people customize the game so that it is more enjoyable for them. Whether they just have a slower (or older!) nervous system, or as Tom says above, just want to slow things down to watch the magic happen.

Using Dawn of War as an example (and a mixed one, as you have to use the console to enable the option to change the game speed), I can speed the game up in the early going, slow it down when things get complicated, or really slow it down to watch an Avatar of Khaine destroy something in glorious slow motion. Game speed sliders make this possible.

[Don Quixote]

I'm not sure if my post was missed or if I'm on Brad and Blair's ignore list, but I'm very interested in this game and would like too demo it before I purchase to see if its my type of strategy. Everything I've heard so far makes it out to be a terrific game. ;-)

I'm going to echo this- My laptop is a bit on the old side, and I'd like to see if I can run it (even if I have to turn all the options down).

[AaronSofaer]

As far as campaign goes, the campaign in Dark Avatar was a total pleasure to play... just wow.

So don't assume that just because it's a 4X style game it can't use a campaign.

That said, I'm certainly not averse to the dev resources being spent on, well, the game instead!

[Brad Wardell]

As far as campaign goes, the campaign in Dark Avatar was a total pleasure to play... just wow.

So don't assume that just because it's a 4X style game it can't use a campaign.

That said, I'm certainly not averse to the dev resources being spent on, well, the game instead!

Jeff Pinard (who I met on Qt3) made the campaign for Dark Avatar. I think that's why it was so good.

[Marcus]

As for retail vs download, is the collector's edition going to be available in store ,or only from stardock ? And on the website it says that shipping will be $15 last time I checked, is that right? I thought $7 from Telltale was high but does the collector's really come with alot more stuff?

Yeah I really want to know about this as well. I'd be all over the CE.

[John Reynolds]

Yeah I really want to know about this as well. I'd be all over the CE.

Same here. I Googled around and couldn't find any info on the CE.

[BlairFraser]

NP guys, CE stuff is listed here: http://www.sinsofasolarempire.com/store.aspx. Taranis, we are looking at putting a demo out about a month after release.

[Igor Muravyev]

A few questions:

I got Sins a loooong time ago. Back when Beta 1 was announced. I can't remember if I ordered the CE or regular, how do I check?

Where is the manual TomChick claims this game comes with?

[NowhereDan]

The pirates were really annoying, especially since the bidding war left us penniless. But some of the time, we just abandoned the sector under attack and let the pirates have their way with Dan's orbital sattelites. It wasn't a big deal since they didn't bring siege frigates to bombard the planet/asteriod, and would leave after a little while.

That was only if they attacked a new and relatively undeveloped system where all I had to lose were resource miners - and later in the game they started bringing siege frigates. They certainly did annoy the hell out of me, and kept me from hitting you a lot harder. You guys were really serious about that bidding war!

[Tom Chick]

I'm glad the pirates had some effect. I figured that was the main reason you weren't being very aggressive against me. Sean* and I were a bit worried when you said you'd been playing the beta, so we coordinated making sure to have lots of spare cash as the pirate bidding came up, specifically to sic them on you. At first, I was worried that we were just crippling ourselves economically, but since you guys have to tie up your own money to drive the bid up, I presume it evens out.

And, yeah, I've definitely seen pirates bringing in siege ships in my games against the AI. I really like how the pirate attacks can vary by content and location. I think the strength of the attack depends on the amount of bounty, which would keep the attacks from being too overwhelming early in the game.

BTW, it was totally awesome seeing the how the bounty works in a game against other humans! Against the AI, the bounty tends to be modest amounts. But as M.U.L.E. proved way back when, there's the whole psychological angle that comes into play with humans.

-Tom

* BTW, it was Sean Malloy, not Shawn Elliott, on my team. I kept spelling his name "Shawn", so he mentioned something about how you guys probably thought he was Shawn Elliott. My bad.

[Tom Chick]

Hey IgorMuravyev, the manual I have was a PDF I printed out. I presume the boxed copy comes with a hard copy.

-Tom

[NowhereDan]

Actually, I think the strength of the pirate attacks increases as the game progresses. That's certainly true of the pirate base - it's strong in the beginning of the game, but after you've been going for a few hours, there can be well over 100 ships guarding it. But yeah, the bidding war is awesome! It turns into an eBay-style snipe competition in the last few seconds, except here the lowest bidder gets the "prize."

I'm a bit disappointed to learn that it wasn't Shawn Elliot's butt we were kicking last night. I guess that means I still don't have satisfaction for his attack on my honor (http://boards.1up.com/zd/board/message?board.id=games&message.id=569346#M569346) last week.

[Beefeater1980]

So who's in for a QT3 game or two in release week? I feel the need for more humiliating online defeats.

[TurinTur]

I hope the demo for the game will be multiplayer, if it's an experience different (and better) than the single player it should be important to show off to potential buyers.

[Marcus]

So I really am all ready to order the CE but is the shipping really 10-15 bucks? That just kills any interest in getting it for me.

[Chris Nahr]

You're really supposed to buy the download version anyway. The CE is for people with money to burn.

[Ben Sones]

That's cool, because that's exactly what I did. :)

[Marcus]

You're really supposed to buy the download version anyway. The CE is for people with money to burn.

OK I guess I'll just get the boxed copy in the store then. Sucks for them I guess.

[Tom Ohle]

The CE box is several pounds, which would account for the higher shipping costs. I can't confirm that the shipping is that much, though -- Brad?

[McBain]

I've intentionally been avoiding pre-release hype for this game.

Somebody sell me on this game in three lines or less. I'm a MoO2 kind of guy who doesn't mind real-time stuff, if that helps.

[wisefool]

I've intentionally been avoiding pre-release hype for this game.

Somebody sell me on this game in three lines or less. I'm a MoO2 kind of guy who doesn't mind real-time stuff, if that helps.

It's
Not
Moo3

[McBain]

It's
Not
Moo3

Alright, so I'm no longer filing it mentally under the "DO NOT BUY UNDER PENALTY OF DEATH" category.

Come on, I'm lazy, do my research for me.

[Drastic]

"This game was made for MoO2 kinds of guys who don't mind real-time stuff and who are too lazy to do research! 9/10!" --box sticker

[McBain]

I'm not feeling the love, guys.

[tiohn]

"This game was made for MoO2 kinds of guys who don't mind real-time stuff and who are too lazy to do research! It also helps them feel the love! 9/10!" --box sticker below the first box sticker

[KieronGillen]

I'm not feeling the love, guys.

The fast-and-dirty-and-a-bit-inaccurate one is "GalCiv but real time". Much deeper and slower than a standard RTS, but without being completely overwhelming - you'll find analogues of most of the 4X mechanics in there. It manages a fascinating mixture of stately and panicked - Tom talks upthread about how the positioning (that is, where in your empire they are) of your fleets is central, and that's a lot of it.

I write quite a bit more at RPS. It's interesting. You should like it. At the least, you'll have a lot to pick apart and say why you don't like it.

KG

[Ben Sones]

Tom and I were talking about this in PM, and he mentioned that he thought that the game has sort of a Kohan vibe to it, and I think that's a good way of looking at it. The two games are different in a lot of ways, but it is like Kohan in that it focuses on high-level decision making rather than micromanagement minutiae. So if you liked that aspect of Kohan, it's definitely worth checking out.

[McBain]

Feeling the love, thanks Kieron.


Tom and I were talking about this in PM, and he mentioned that he thought that the game has sort of a Kohan vibe to it, and I think that's a good way of looking at it. The two games are different in a lot of ways, but it is like Kohan in that it focuses on high-level decision making rather than micromanagement minutiae. So if you liked that aspect of Kohan, it's definitely worth checking out.

Interesting. I liked Kohan quite a bit, I think I might just have to get this.

[Brad Wardell]

Last night we played a FFA game. Well, FFA only in the sense that the other scum at Stardock thinks FFA means that they team up against me and put a $17,000 bounty on me so that the pirates and me were on a first-name death basis.

The one thing about the pirates though is that if you are in a position to handle them, they make great canon fodder for getting new levels on your capital ships.

[Troy S Goodfellow]

Tom and I were talking about this in PM, and he mentioned that he thought that the game has sort of a Kohan vibe to it, and I think that's a good way of looking at it. The two games are different in a lot of ways, but it is like Kohan in that it focuses on high-level decision making rather than micromanagement minutiae. So if you liked that aspect of Kohan, it's definitely worth checking out.

I can see that.

It also feels a bit to me like WW2 naval warfare. You need to find the other guy's ships, and somehow force a decisive battle on your terms. Lots of scouting, and lots of decisions about where to focus your fleet development. And the pirates throw a nice wrench into everything by giving you another enemy to watch and defend against.

There's a real classical feel to the search and destroy nature of the warfighting bit.

Troy

[docvego]

New article up at IGN (http://pc.ign.com/articles/848/848665p1.html) with some details on the Advent, interface changes since the last beta and achievements.

I can't wait for Monday! A PDF of the final manual isn't floating yet is it?

[Jab]

Well I decided to order the CE ( A birthday present for me) So the game should be up for download tomorrow, and shipped out on Monday correct? How stable is the multiplayer , I assuming better then Rise of Legends was?

[Brad Wardell]

Download is Monday later afternoon EST.

[Charles]

Hey, what's the DRM like with Totalgaming.net? I'm thinking about impulse buying this just because I need a good spaceships fix, but I'll want to be able to play it on both my laptop and my computer. Is this going to be a problem?

[BleedTheFreak]

Hey, what's the DRM like with Totalgaming.net? I'm thinking about impulse buying this just because I need a good spaceships fix, but I'll want to be able to play it on both my laptop and my computer. Is this going to be a problem?

Read this:
http://blogs.ign.com/Stardock_Games/2008/01/29/78711/

See if that helps.

[Quaro]

There's no DRM on Totalgaming.net.

One thing I was wondering though, does that mean we can do LAN multiplayer with a single copy?

[wisefool]

Login to stardock central once to install or get updates. No client sits around to verify validity at every reboot or whatever. I forget if it caches setup files locally, but it's never a problem to download it at any time at speeds from 50Kb-400Kb/sec (I reformat a lot.)

Just remember which email address you associated your account with so you can always log back in five years down the line.

If there was any less DRM they would probably have to send you empty cd's and labels so you can mail copies to your friends.

[Pentadact]

The thing I really like about it is that it doesn't insist on updates: it'll tell you there's a new version, but if you just want to play the version you've already got right now, it always lets you. It's friendlier than Steam that way.

In fact, it's the only digital distribution system other than Steam that doesn't make me want to physically beat the people who made it. Looking forward to... Impulse, was it? The replacement thingy. About the only thing Stardock Central needs is a slicker interface, and it's not like you guys don't know how to do those.

[Charles]

Read this:
http://blogs.ign.com/Stardock_Games/2008/01/29/78711/

See if that helps.

It's kind of grey about whether or not I'd be able to get the extras on both my machines.

[McBain]

Hey, what's the DRM like with Totalgaming.net? I'm thinking about impulse buying this just because I need a good spaceships fix, but I'll want to be able to play it on both my laptop and my computer. Is this going to be a problem?

Shouldn't be a problem. I have Space Rangers 2 installed on my laptop, my gaming PC, and my "use this to open word .docs for work/school" virusbox. TotalGaming updates them all the same. Had the same experience with GalCiv2, so from what what Bleed posted, I'd say you're good.

[NowhereDan]

Stardock has no DRM at all on their games. You'll have no problem.

[SwampIrish]

Well, I purchased tokens in anticipation of getting this and they took my money without giving me tokens.

[JM]

So contact support.

[SwampIrish]

48 Fucking business hours for a response? Didn't take them that long to charge me.

[Tom Ohle]

48 Fucking business hours for a response? Didn't take them that long to charge me.

Chances are you used a different email address for your Stardock and store accounts... if you PM me your email addy I might be able to get something sorted.

[JM]

48 Fucking business hours for a response? Didn't take them that long to charge me.

Does this mean you've waited 48 hours or that's what their site says?

[Ranulf]

Gah, I finally caved and pre-ordered. I had to fork over for the box + download though. Old habits die hard, despite the fact that my galciv cd's are still sealed. Still fighting the urge to get the galciv expansions though and my wallet thanks me.

[John Reynolds]

Yep, $10-15 for shipping is a bit too much for my preferences. I think I'll wait to see how the retail distribution goes first.

[mlatin]

Fry's price for the retail box being $34.99 + s/h + tax seems like the best deal. I really can't see myself paying essentially $60 for the CE from Stardock directly, unfortunately- that's what it came out to be when I almost went through with an order there just to see how bad the shipping would be. Yowza!

[Pentadact]

Another new preview, this one by me: http://computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=181023

I'm in love with the sky-blue nebula the main shot of that article was taken against. Just generally, too, Sins screenshots so well. There are some in that latest batch of official ones, Blair, that just look like the best space game ever. There are about thirteen lasers going off.

It'd be great to have an easier way to appreciate the spectacle at that zoom level when you're playing. Empire At War has a nice take on this - you just hit enter, and an auto-director flicks between the most exciting scenes going on right now, tracking and zooming as appropriate. It's actually slightly better than George Lucas at it.

[Taranis]

Taranis, we are looking at putting a demo out about a month after release.
hmmm.......that just happens to fall around my Birthday, if the game is as good as I think it is SOSE will make the top of my wish list!

[nabeel]

Nice short interview/article with Brad and Blair. (http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=8933&Itemid=2&limit=1&limitstart=0)

[Igor Muravyev]

Is there a better way to control fleets that I am not aware of? Whenever I tell them to move or phase to a different system, all the ships seem to do it at their own pace instead of synchronizing their movements to that of the slowest.

[BlairFraser]

Select them all and right click the movement button until you see all 3 arrows go green. If you have units in the selection that aren't in Group Movement mode one of the arrows will be gray. Be sure to turn off group movement when you need to retreat. The retail build also has a specific fleet system that helps out even more and a specific retreat button.

[Jonathan Crane]

It is an interesting pricing scheme they've set up. The MRSP seems to be $39.95 judging from Amazon, and yet the digital download through Stardock is $44.95, and the CE is $49.95 plus the aforementioned shipping charge (listed as $10-15). For a US customer, you're probably looking at 39.95+sales tax//$44.95//$59.95 as the price points. What struck me is that Stardock appears to be charging more for the direct download, which is also (per past interviews) the more profitable option for the company.

Now perhaps this is because getting physical distribution was a harder sell for them, relative to Valve's ability to put the Orange Box into retail, or maybe most fans already have Stardock tokens, which would provide a discount. On the other hand, if people just buy the digital download or the CE straight up through Stardock, this pricing structure has the effect of getting the hard core fans (who are likely the vast majority of people who would buy the game through Stardock) to actually pay more for the game. In the past (Gal Civ II) I seem to remember that the digital download price was equivalent to the MRSP.

I don't object to this idea of the fans giving a bit more to the developer - I would have gladly kicked in an extra bit for Thief 2 if that meant Looking Glass might have survived, but it is the first time I've seen it.

[ElGuapo]

Why not just set the price at what your retailers set their price at? (I'm assuming when negotiating retail distribution there were "you will not undercut our price with your digital distribution" clauses.

Just set it at retailer price and be done with it.

[Marcus]

And not rape on the shipping.

[Kalle]

Add international shipping to this and I have a fucking headache on my hands since there's apparantly no Euro release until the end of March at best.

On one hand, digital distribution now. On the other hand, I want the CE goodies.

[Tom Ohle]

It's all related to the retail situation -- Stardock is not a sales juggernaut in the retailers' eyes, so they have to give in to retailer pressure. They're trying to make up for that price discrepancy by offering the CE content in digital form to people who buy the digital version. And the CE itself (the highest-priced product) is packed with content and weighs several pounds, making shipping and production more expensive.

[Igor Muravyev]

How do we check if we ordered the CE version or not?

[Marcus]

So the tech tree must be made of lead. Got it.

[Brad Wardell]

It is an interesting pricing scheme they've set up. The MRSP seems to be $39.95 judging from Amazon, and yet the digital download through Stardock is $44.95, and the CE is $49.95 plus the aforementioned shipping charge (listed as $10-15). For a US customer, you're probably looking at 39.95+sales tax//$44.95//$59.95 as the price points. What struck me is that Stardock appears to be charging more for the direct download, which is also (per past interviews) the more profitable option for the company.

Now perhaps this is because getting physical distribution was a harder sell for them, relative to Valve's ability to put the Orange Box into retail, or maybe most fans already have Stardock tokens, which would provide a discount. On the other hand, if people just buy the digital download or the CE straight up through Stardock, this pricing structure has the effect of getting the hard core fans (who are likely the vast majority of people who would buy the game through Stardock) to actually pay more for the game. In the past (Gal Civ II) I seem to remember that the digital download price was equivalent to the MRSP.

I don't object to this idea of the fans giving a bit more to the developer - I would have gladly kicked in an extra bit for Thief 2 if that meant Looking Glass might have survived, but it is the first time I've seen it.

The digital download version at the website is still the Collector's Edition in which they receive additional stuff.

You can see this for the full details:
http://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/?forumid=402&aid=174282

But in short, the collector's edition (even the digital version) includes an extra CD of music, tech tree poster, and a free desktop theme.

The reason it's $44.95 and not $49.95 is that we took off the $5 in materials cost on the digital version of the Collector's Edition.

So to be clear: The Collector's Edition is $49.95. The standard edition is $39.95. They aren't the same.

BTW, this is exactly the same system we've had for GalCiv II since the start.

[Jonathan Crane]

The digital download version at the website is still the Collector's Edition in which they receive additional stuff.
<<snip>>
So to be clear: The Collector's Edition is $49.95. The standard edition is $39.95. They aren't the same.

BTW, this is exactly the same system we've had for GalCiv II since the start.

Ah, I see. Thanks for the correction.

[Brad Wardell]

No problem.

BTW, I've posted a game play example:

http://tgnforums.stardock.com/?aid=174326

[Marcin]

Are you using mass driver weapons!? Monster!

My resolve crumbles every time I see shots like that, but then it builds back up when I see the overview. That's way more info than I can handle (not an RTSer).

[Brad Wardell]

Londo was on that ship. I can assure you of that.

[Igor Muravyev]

Fine, don't get the extra $ that I would've paid for if I could check that I ordered the digital-only and not the boxed edition.

[NuclearWinter]

Sins of a Solar Empire, new Gal Civ 2 expansion and Sword of the Stars all for £35. Thank you weak dollar! :)

For those in the UK it's well worth buying the 10 tokens from TotalGaming.

[Ben Sones]

Hey Brad or Blair--are there more (or revised) tutorials in the final version? Just curious.

[BulletSponge]

Hey Brad or Blair--are there more (or revised) tutorials in the final version? Just curious.

The tutorials now cover many of the new concepts introduced since beta 4, and all known bugs that prevented the player from progressing through the tutorials' state triggers when they did something unexpected have been fixed. If you're very familiar with the game already I'd only recommend playing through the last pair of advanced tutorials since they cover almost all the new mechanics.

[Tom Chick]

The tutorials are great, and I look forward to barking "PTFT!" at people who ask basic questions. :) See Igor's query about moving fleets, for instance.

-Tom

[Dave Weinstein]

How well does it run on a min-spec machine?

[Ben Sones]

My machine is pretty retro these days (Athlon 64 3400, GeForce 6800GT, 1 GB RAM, XP), and it runs quite well at my monitor's native res (1600x1050). Well, the beta does, but presumably the final would be, if anything, a little better.

[Adam B]

Stupid siege frigate spam. Seriously, how does one counter this early/mid-game? Weak-ass light frigs don't take 'em down fast enough to prevent wholesale planetary nukery.

'Course, it's a hilarious tactic if you can pull it off yourself...

[Igor Muravyev]

The tutorials are great, and I look forward to barking "PTFT!" at people who ask basic questions. :) See Igor's query about moving fleets, for instance.

-Tom

Considering I can't find a manual anywhere I'm not ashamed to be asking those questions.

[Brad Wardell]

Stupid siege frigate spam. Seriously, how does one counter this early/mid-game? Weak-ass light frigs don't take 'em down fast enough to prevent wholesale planetary nukery.

'Course, it's a hilarious tactic if you can pull it off yourself...

They got nerfed quite a bit in the 1.01 update which is the version that will be available on Feb 4 (and includes the modding tools and support).

[BlairFraser]

Stupid siege frigate spam. Seriously, how does one counter this early/mid-game? Weak-ass light frigs don't take 'em down fast enough to prevent wholesale planetary nukery.

'Course, it's a hilarious tactic if you can pull it off yourself...

They are nerfed in v1.01 and damage against them improved as Brad mentionned.

Here are a few ideas that are useful whether they are nerfed or not:

Emergency Facilities, static-d and mobile garrison forces at your key worlds are all very important. Make sure your defense and base building are designed around the anticipation of a siege run from the most likely direction(s). Civilian buildings as blockades to slow them down, overlapping coverage, minimize safe zones near the planet etc. Never move too from your homeworld in the early game until you can see what the enemy is going for or you've established a sensor net. e.g as TEC, use probes and/or stationary scouts on the the usual paths between enemy homeworlds to act as an early warning system against this sort of thing. You have to detect them as soon as possible. If you do, you know he's committed a lot of resources to building them (they cost near as much as tier 4 heavies) and he's likely handicapped himself in some other fashion. You can then act in a variety of ways: Examples: exploit whatever his particular handicap is, harass the siege enroute, send the main fleet back early, pump out more garrision, build more defense, increase emergency facilities. The last thing you ever want to happen is to not know about those siege until they are at the front door, you won't be left with many options. Intelligence and preparation is key or you will be caught out of position without a town portal.

[Adam B]

Oh yes, I'm all up on the static D + roving defense fleet tip. Does fuck-all against heavy siege raid forces, but hopefully 1.01 helps that a bit since it's a bit uncounterable.

Also, holy hell did the strategic AI get improved. Playing a crystal-heavy (and consequently metal-light; at least in my quadrant THANKS FOR THE 4 METAL ROIDS BETWEEN 5 SYSTEMS LOL) map on a 4p FFA Convergence, I obviously teched up early-ish and started pumping out missile frigates, which handily crushed the light/heavy frigs that I was facing early on from the neutrals/pirates/rivals. Upon expanding at the pace I was comfortable with -- which means dropping a couple hangars/repairs/platforms in a system before i send the fleet a-stomping again -- I figured, "hey, I've got a plurality of the galaxy under control, two pretty badass fleets at each end of my empire for defense, let's turtle up a bit and tech up and secure my planets."

FUCK. Two giant-ass fleets from each of my neighbors came up and dominated my latest conquests. Part of it's bad timing -- got 'em both at the same time -- but at the same time, I'm the biggest empire, so bully for these AI assholes for taking a piece from the big dog. One fleet is about half-and-half light frigs and missile frigs, which neatly counters my "all missiles all the time" method of fleet construction, while the other is OMG CARRIER CRUISERS HAX which crushes my capitals while plowing through the static D and obliterating the modest flak frigate brigade I had waiting for it.

Of course, my economy is strong enough to suck it up and torch enough enemies in attrition to get my counterattack on (at least enough to prevent the bad guys from realizing any realistic positive gains from toasting my planets), but still -- it's damn rare in any RTS *or* 4X to have AI attack/counterattack with enough of a stack to do real damage.

Yeah, I'm having to fight it out in pretty rough fashion with the normal AI, which is a bit humbling for a guy who spends a ton of time playing both 4X and RTS games. But it's damn fun.

[Cal]

Looking forward to this. Will echo the words of the poster above, well worth buying it in tokens for UK and Euro peeps, with the very weak dollar it only worked out to £18, which is less than half the price of most PC games over here! Bargain, cant wait!

[moss_icon]

where are you buying your games? you can get almost any game online in the UK for £17.99, or £24.99 if it is a new big one like bioshock or crysis.

i only have 4 tokens in my account :(

[flyinj]

Is there a way to buy individual tokens? I want to get Avencast and Astral Masters, but that would leave me 1 token short.

(I already own GalCiv+expansion and Sins)

[wisefool]

Real Menbari use OS/2.

Sorry, sorry, I can't help being so punny.

[MrAnderson]

All this talk about the game is making me want to play, I do not usually buy these sorts of game blind, but I may need to make an exception. Though I wish, since the demo is more than a month away, that the beta would open up this weekend for the public. It would let me see how the game plays in a general sense without me committing any money yet.

One question for those that know, please tell me there is a "keyboard map scrolling". I am still at a loss for why GalCiv2, after all the patches, does not have an option to let me use the keyboard to scroll the map. It makes me crazy every time I go back to play, and if Sins makes that same design decision, I will have to pass.

[Ben Sones]

There is, but you actually won't use it much. It's sort of hard to explain without having you just play the game, but you'll probably find it a lot easier to just move the view around by zooming. The smart zoom is really well implemented, and it's something that you'll use constantly anyway. I normally like to use the keyboard for scrolling in this sort of game, but in Sins I usually just end up moving the view by zooming in and out.

The zoom also lets you give a lot of orders from vantages that don't require scrolling. It's easy to give orders from a view in which you can see the entire gravity well of a planet, and everything in it.

[MrAnderson]

There is, but you actually won't use it much. It's sort of hard to explain without having you just play the game, but you'll probably find it a lot easier to just move the view around by zooming. Yay! Thanks for the info.

I remember hearing the same sort of thing, about not needing/using keyboard scroll, back before GalCiv2 was released, but I am a many of habits apparently and I curse every time I try and scroll but end up moving a unit instead. I am very glad to hear Sins at least gives me the option and removes one more reason for me to not buy the game.

Short thread take over, since Brad has eyes on this thread: I like Galciv2 a bunch, and would totally buy the expansions if you would please add keyboard map scrolling. Thank you, and I return you to your SoaSE talk.

[BleedTheFreak]

There is, but you actually won't use it much. It's sort of hard to explain without having you just play the game, but you'll probably find it a lot easier to just move the view around by zooming. The smart zoom is really well implemented, and it's something that you'll use constantly anyway. I normally like to use the keyboard for scrolling in this sort of game, but in Sins I usually just end up moving the view by zooming in and out.

The zoom also lets you give a lot of orders from vantages that don't require scrolling. It's easy to give orders from a view in which you can see the entire gravity well of a planet, and everything in it.

Which brings up another point, I'm really happy with the scope and zoom of Sins, because it's like a bitch-slap to all the other RTS games I've wanted to zoom out but always felt my zoom ceiling was WAY to close to the action (starting with Warcraft 3 and continuing through other other-wise fun games like CnC3, Rise of Legends, Company of Heroes, etc.)

[Ben Sones]

I remember hearing the same sort of thing, about not needing/using keyboard scroll, back before GalCiv2 was released, but I am a many of habits apparently and I curse every time I try and scroll but end up moving a unit instead.

There's not any danger of accidentally moving units when using the zoom in Sins. It's a smooth scrolling that uses the mouse wheel, and the zoom autocenters on wherever you have the cursor. So basically, you roll the wheel back a little to zoom out, point the cursor at whatever you want to focus on now, and then zoom back in. You don't have to click anything, and it's very responsive. It also pretty much makes screen-edge scrolling obsolete, because I almost never use that in this game, either.

I think the main thing that makes the zoom a better way to navigate in this game is the scale. The scale of the playing field is enormous, and it's very playable even zoomed very far out. There are almost no circumstances where panning the camera to see something is more convenient than simply pulling zooming out.

Like I said, you'll see what I mean when you play it.

[Brad Wardell]

I can't wait to be able to play this online with people. I'm about to start a game with my 2 sons which, while fun, is not quite the same (they're 11 and 8).

[Quitch]

Well perhaps if it was released over SDC we'd be joining you :P

[PCG_Norman]

anyone down for a game sometime this afternoon?

[Troy S Goodfellow]

anyone down for a game sometime this afternoon?

I have time for a quick one.

Troy

[Tom Ohle]

I have time for a quick one.

Troy

If I had my final version I'd play :(. Damn beta!

[Brad Wardell]

BTW, for those of you with review copies, the 1.01 version is available. It has some modding support and increases the pacing at "fast" game speed a tad. Just hit the "update game" from the main menu. It also has some of Tom's requests made on the forum implemented (but I don't recall what they were off hand).

[Tom Chick]

A hotkey for buying and selling resources! Yay! I still have some issues with the way Ironclad did their hotkeys -- many of which are simply alternatives to mouse clicking in very particular situations instead of bona fide shortcuts -- but I'm too busy digging the game to whinge.

BTW, check out my sweet new wallpaper (http://www.quartertothree.com/inhouse/news/385/).

-Tom

[Raife]

BTW, check out my sweet new wallpaper (http://www.quartertothree.com/inhouse/news/385/).

What the hell is with the ribs on that light factory? Totally unrealistic. And that Broadcast Center, does it rotate? How does it generate gravity? Terrible design.

[Brooski]

(1) This game is pretty great.

(2) Why is Tom spelling "whine" like he's from England? Is Tom from England?

(3) In the opening explanation of the history of Sins of a Solar Empire, it says that we don't know where the aliens came from. Is that true? Nobody knows? How about Brad Wardell? Does he know?

[BleedTheFreak]

What the hell is with the ribs on that light factory? Totally unrealistic. And that Broadcast Center, does it rotate? How does it generate gravity? Terrible design.

No kidding, I've seen tons of orbital light factories and they *never* have ribs on them. Sheesh. And what's with things rotating in space? WTF!? These guys didn't seem to do any research, totally unrealistic AND unbelievable. SOASE=FAIL.

[RepoMan]

Whoa. Brooski playing this on his own? Might we actually see a SoaSE Tom Vs. Bruce wherein Bruce will not resemble a moth in a fusion flare?

[Unicorn McGriddle]

I preordered this game so hard it broke my credit card's online verification system. Very much looking forward to starting that download at midnight Monday night.

[Rob O'Boston]

I preordered this game so hard it broke my credit card's online verification system. Very much looking forward to starting that download at midnight Monday night.

I am helpless against the firepower of this fully ARMED and OPERATIONAL hype thread. I'll be a first day buyer.

[Marcus]

Oh yes I'll be at frys first thing Tuesday Morning. 34.99!

[Jarrodhk]

I would play the beta... but from the sound of it the final changes/adds so much I can't really bring myself to start a game.

Can't wait.

[Igor Muravyev]

Yep, according to an Ironclad dev the retail adds about 40% more features than beta 4.

[Quitch]

I would play the beta... but from the sound of it the final changes/adds so much I can't really bring myself to start a game.

Can't wait.

Yep, I have it here sitting around and I can't be bothered to start.

[Jon Shafer]

Although I don't play many games any more (damn you Civ!) I think I'll be picking this one up, mainly because of how cool Tom's wallpaper and accompanying post makes the game sound. ;)

Jon

[John Reynolds]

$40 at Best Buy this week.

[Jon Shafer]

Oooo... I have a leftover $25 Best Buy gift card too... although I'd prefer to go the digital distribution route I do like having a box.

Jon

[IndridCold]

I have about $75 bucks left over from a Future Shop (a canadian electronics store (just like Best Buy)) gift card since Christmas. I had been mulling over dropping it on some shiny new 360 game like Assassin's Creed or Burnout:Paradise.

But Sins has won me over... especially considering it's only 40.00 on this side of the border as well.

I bought Gal Civ II a while back, played it once or twice and never touched it again, but Sins looks to be more like Homeworld. Homeworld is a game that I loved. A lot.

[SlyFrog]

But Sins has won me over... especially considering it's only 40.00 on this side of the border as well.

Only? Doesn't that mean it is actually worth $2,000, or two small Thai orphans, in real money given the U.S./Canadian exchange rate now?

Seriously enough, I might have to get this one too. I've really resisted the buzz on stuff well lately, but I'm succumbing to this.

[Brad Wardell]

At the rate things are going, in a few months $40 (American) will be the equivalent of some pocket lint and some gum.

[Jonathan Crane]

I pulled the trigger on the Collectors Edition + the DVD. Shipping is a bit steep at $10, but the whole thing was still about the retail price of a 360 game, so that's really not too bad.

Does Stardock central do any sort of preloading? I received an email with an order number, but I don't think that is the serial number that Stardock Central requires.

[RepoMan]

I raved about the beta months ago -- I was having fun back in beta 2, and more fun in beta 3. Can't wait to see what they've done with the full game (I totally missed beta 4 due to personal life insanity).

[BleedTheFreak]

I raved about the beta months ago -- I was having fun back in beta 2, and more fun in beta 3. Can't wait to see what they've done with the full game (I totally missed beta 4 due to personal life insanity).

It comes out today, but I'd imagine it will take me until tomorrow to pull the whole thing down. Too bad though, as I have today off actually. Ah well. Maybe the PDF file will be made available as a separate download so I can read through that while I pull down the game?

I also heard the Beta 4 download isn't compatible with the full version, and that will need to be uninstalled (albeit automatically during the full version install) so that's to bad, that the Beta 4 files can't help lessen the download load.

[Skipper]

I checked yesterday, still no gold version on Stardock. I'm hoping it'll be online today.

[Acoustic Rob]

You guys are really tempting me. I have this weird love/hate relationship with RTS games; I buy about one a year, but seldom go more than four-five missions deep before I drop 'em. Sounds like this one works at a different scale, though; it might stick around longer.

One question, though: how long does a typical medium-size game take to play? I really can't dedicate the time to play a big sprawling TBS like Civ or GalCiv anymore, which is why I keep taking stabs at finding an RTS to love, but if a game of Sins takes an 8-hour marathon to complete, then I'll save my money.

[Charles]

Okay, I preordered and downloaded stardock central. When will I be able to see the game in my list? I thought maybe I'd be able to pre-load or something...

[Troy S Goodfellow]

One question, though: how long does a typical medium-size game take to play? I really can't dedicate the time to play a big sprawling TBS like Civ or GalCiv anymore, which is why I keep taking stabs at finding an RTS to love, but if a game of Sins takes an 8-hour marathon to complete, then I'll save my money.

A medium sized game can easily take hours. Six to eight is not out of the question if you have no allies and are forced to conquer every one. The game is much closer to Civ or GalCiv than Age of Empires.

Troy

[Saxman_72]

Okay, I preordered and downloaded stardock central. When will I be able to see the game in my list? I thought maybe I'd be able to pre-load or something...
Yeah, a pre-load would have been awesome. =(

[Charles]

Yeah, a pre-load would have been awesome. =(

If I can't play this today, I'm seriously not touching totalgaming.net again. The whole point of digital delivery is to not have to wait, like you do with the physical copy. Friggin hell.

[Brad Wardell]

It'll be available in a few hours... Stay tuned. The process has started.

[Njal]

Download is Monday later afternoon EST.

Here is the timing on the download Charles. Or listen to Brad

[Chris Nahr]

I don't usually like RTS games but I might like this one. Did anyone already say whether there's a demo planned?

[Saxman_72]

If I can't play this today, I'm seriously not touching totalgaming.net again. The whole point of digital delivery is to not have to wait, like you do with the physical copy. Friggin hell.
That'd be a shame, because there really is no service out there that is more free of hassle than totalgaming, imho. All digital distribution systems should aspire to be like it.

[Charles]

That'd be a shame, because there really is no service out there that is more free of hassle than totalgaming, imho. All digital distribution systems should aspire to be like it.

If I can get and install a physical copy faster than I can get it through digital distribution, then failure abounds, IMO.

Anyway, I'm tied to it for the moment. I guess we'll see if I at least get good download speeds when it goes up later.

[Drastic]

Just fired up SDC, and it's up now.

[Lorini]

I have an 'order number' but no 'serial number'. I ordered the downloadable CE + box. What should I do to be able to download the game?

[Sam Jones]

I have an 'order number' but no 'serial number'. I ordered the downloadable CE + box. What should I do to be able to download the game?

If you preordered but weren't in the beta, you need to wait for the email with your serial no. If you were in the beta, you should be able to grab it now.

Details from official forums. (http://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/index.aspx?forumid=402&aid=174664)

[Lorini]

If you preordered but weren't in the beta, you need to wait for the email with your serial no. If you were in the beta, you should be able to grab it now.

Details from official forums. (http://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/index.aspx?forumid=402&aid=174664)

I pre-ordered 5 days ago, I would have thought they could get the serial number to me in 5 days. I just wrote their sales people to say that either I get my serial order number very soon or I want a refund. It makes absolutely no sense to pay them an extra basically $20 so that I can get the game after the retail release. Jeezus.

[Tom Ohle]

Woot, downloading. Dunno if I'll have time to play today, but anyone up for a game tomorrow? I suck so don't worry about losing.

[Rob_Merritt]

I'm weak. I just ordered the digital download.

[Njal]

Ah, time for my daughter to dl so I can play when I get home. Gamerkids ftw.

This may be the first rts where I actually want to play against humans so I'll probably suck but it should be fun anyhow.

[Rob O'Boston]

Can I walk into Bestbuy today and be playing with the downloaders tonight?

[Lorini]

Best Buy shows the release as tomorrow:
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp;jsessionid=0QFMFUSK5WMHNKC4D3IVAFQ?_dy ncharset=ISO-8859-1&id=pcat17071&type=page&st=solar+empire&sc=Global&cp=1&nrp=15&sp=&qp=&list=n&iht=y&usc=All+Categories&ks=960

[Rob_Merritt]

Best Buy shows the release as tomorrow:
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp;jsessionid=0QFMFUSK5WMHNKC4D3IVAFQ?_dy ncharset=ISO-8859-1&id=pcat17071&type=page&st=solar+empire&sc=Global&cp=1&nrp=15&sp=&qp=&list=n&iht=y&usc=All+Categories&ks=960

Which means it might be on the shelf by friday.

[Brad Wardell]

I have an 'order number' but no 'serial number'. I ordered the downloadable CE + box. What should I do to be able to download the game?

If you pre-order, you don't get a serial # until the game ships.

Check out this thread for more info:
http://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/?forumid=402&aid=174664

[Dave Weinstein]

Since the demo isn't out yet.

P4-2.53ghz, 1gb RAM, nVidia 6200 (AGP) video card.

Will it play acceptably?

[Brad Wardell]

The download speeds should be insanely fast. There's a guy on the forum getting 2 megabytes per second.

[Brad Wardell]

Dave - should be fine. How much RAM is on the 6200?

[mouselock]

The download speeds should be insanely fast. There's a guy on the forum getting 2 megabytes per second.

I was getting between 1 and 1.5.

Of course, we may have been the only two people downloading, but I was impressed. (That hit my ISP cap I believe, but I've very, very rarely done that.)

[Ben Sones]

I'm also getting between 1 and 1.5.

[Gendal]

Maxing out my pipe too, and that's not an easy task at 1.5+. Already 1/5th of the way done, not going to take long at all unless fifty gajillion other people show up.

Damn, 40% done and it's down to 40k/s. Would you like to know more?

[Charles]

Uh, so where exact do we download from? It's not showing up in stardock central.

[Tom Ohle]

Uh, so where exact do we download from? It's not showing up in stardock central.

Hmm... technically you should just boot up Stardock Central and it should be in your Games tab under Purchased Software.

[Dave Weinstein]

Dave - should be fine. How much RAM is on the 6200?

I think 128mb, might be 256.

[MikeJ]

Hmm... technically you should just boot up Stardock Central and it should be in your Games tab under Purchased Software.

Don't you have to cut and paste the serial code you get by email? I see to recall having to do that for previous purchases.

[Gendal]

Uh, so where exact do we download from? It's not showing up in stardock central.
I was in the beta so it just showed up for me, otherwise I think you should have gotten an email yesterday according to the following thread. Should have instructions and sn# for activating it on stardock central?
http://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/?forumid=402&aid=174664

[Ben Sones]

It's currently only available for people who were in the beta (i.e. people who preordered a long time ago). According to the FAQ that was linked, Stardock is in the process of processing the more recent orders, and you'll get an email when yours is available.

[Charles]

Hmm... technically you should just boot up Stardock Central and it should be in your Games tab under Purchased Software.

It's not.

I guess based on one of the previously linked threads, I have to wait for the system to send out an email or something?

Bleh.

[RepoMan]

Aaaaah, we're busy packing up our house so I'm going to be schlepping boxes after work every night this week. Have fun y'all, I'll probably be sinning it up this weekend at the earliest. Fortunately I don't do multiplayer RTS (I loves me some pause key), so the bits will wait patiently for me on my hard drive, without me being outskilled by everyone else.

[Citiznmatt]

People on the official forums are starting to report that the pre-order serial numbers have been mailed out. Wish I weren't at work.

[docvego]

It's not.

I guess based on one of the previously linked threads, I have to wait for the system to send out an email or something?

Bleh.

Might want to try this: (http://www.octopusoverlords.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=59312)

One thing I learned from the official forums, if you were in the beta - make sure you uncheck the box that says "Show pre-release versions" in the SDC interface, or you won't see it.

[Brad Wardell]

They're just starting to go out. There are thousands of pre-orders to process and only a few hundred have been processed so far.

Once processed, user gets email. Then they can see the game on SDC.

[Lorini]

They're just starting to go out. There are thousands of pre-orders to process and only a few hundred have been processed so far.

Once processed, user gets email. Then they can see the game on SDC.

I don't understand this though. Basically you are asking folks to pay (from our point of view) a big premium to be able to download the game, then you are telling those same folks that you couldn't create serial numbers at the time that you got their money and so now those people have to wait. For a computer company that is supposed to be making computer tools this seems really really backward. "Thousands of preorders" are nothing to a properly designed system. Doesn't look like yours fits that definition.

Now Brad, love ya, love your games, happy to support an independent games company, but this really could have been done better. Also, if what you were really trying to do is reward the beta testers with an early download opportunity, then just say so (particularly at the time others pre-ordered) and this would be a lot more acceptable. At least I wouldn't have the expectation that I would get the game at the same time as the others.

[SirTomster]

Ahh one advantage to working so close to home. Eat lunch at home! Going home in a few hours to download. So it will be all ready for me when I get home. Woohoo.

[Jab]

Still waiting for my email. One bit of confusion is that Stardock asked me to create a different account from my TGN will that be a problem once my email is shipped?

edit: I ordered it late Thursday night.

[tmastern]

I ordered at 11:59 AM Eastern time, and was playing by 12:45 PM....not sure why others are not seeing it. My Email with serial # went out about 10 seconds after I pressed "enter order", and the game showed up in SDC as soon as I started it up........

[Brad Wardell]

I don't understand this though. Basically you are asking folks to pay (from our point of view) a big premium to be able to download the game, then you are telling those same folks that you couldn't create serial numbers at the time that you got their money and so now those people have to wait. For a computer company that is supposed to be making computer tools this seems really really backward. "Thousands of preorders" are nothing to a properly designed system. Doesn't look like yours fits that definition.

Now Brad, love ya, love your games, happy to support an independent games company, but this really could have been done better. Also, if what you were really trying to do is reward the beta testers with an early download opportunity, then just say so (particularly at the time others pre-ordered) and this would be a lot more acceptable. At least I wouldn't have the expectation that I would get the game at the same time as the others.


I have to disagree here. It's pretty rare for anyone to have a problem with the system.

No one gets charged until the serial # is sent out. You weren't charged for your pre-order until today.

When someone pre-orders, they provide their info and they receive a confirmation and they're put on a list.

When the game is released, those on the list are processed and serial #'s with links to download the game are available.

I'd agree with you IF Stardock were charging you when you put in the order. But it doesn't.

[shang]

Stardock seems to have some serious bandwidth. Downloading now at about ~900 kilobytes/sec which is pretty close to the theoretical maximum downsteam I have.

[Waltzer]

I think 128mb, might be 256.

It doesn't matter; I'm running it on integrated nForce graphics and it's playable, if a little slow. Any *real* 3D accellerator should be fine.

[Lorini]

I have to disagree here. It's pretty rare for anyone to have a problem with the system.

No one gets charged until the serial # is sent out. You weren't charged for your pre-order until today.

When someone pre-orders, they provide their info and they receive a confirmation and they're put on a list.

When the game is released, those on the list are processed and serial #'s with links to download the game are available.

I'd agree with you IF Stardock were charging you when you put in the order. But it doesn't.

I'm taking this to PM because I don't want it to overshadow your release.

[tiohn]

I downloaded that bonus pack, but can't figure out what it adds. It also makes Stardock Central think that I need to update the game.

[Goonch]

I preorderd on Friday, Feb 1st.

I just checked my home email account from work and the Stardock email is in my inbox. It wasn't there an hour ago, so it must have come in within the last hour.

I can't wait till the end of the work day!

[Ranulf]

Got my email, its time stamped around 11am (PST I believe) and I'm downloading now. SDC updated then just let me click install for Sins (guess I didnt need to enter the actual serial number).

[Quitch]

I had to uninstall from SDC before I could install? Come on lads, even my graphics driver doesn't require me to do that any more!

Getting a decent rate though, looking forward to this.

[Vincent_GC]

Got my email at 10:40 PST. Having my wife download it now so I can play when I get home.

[Jab]

Installing now, the actual download was pretty fast, maybe 20 minutes. That's weird Quitch, I didn't have to do that, installation just finished as I was typing this. I'll be up to getting killed online tonight.

[McBain]

That....

... that's some bandwidth, right there. Holy SHIT, I didn't even realize *I* had this much bandwidth.

[Brad Wardell]

That....

... that's some bandwidth, right there. Holy SHIT, I didn't even realize *I* had this much bandwidth.

FEEL the power! ;)

This is exactly why I wanted to be a game developer. To try to address all the things about gaming that drives people nuts (DRM, slow update speeds, lack of post-release updates, etc.).

The highest download rate I've heard so far is 2 megabytes per second. Anyone getting better than that?

[Jab]

I have a question regarding the tutorials, is there supposed to be some kind of guidance for the basic interface one or is it just the player messing around with the various buttons? I loaded it up and there was nothing going on.

Also for registering to play online it says it needs my CD Key, can I just copy and paste the serial number from the email to the box?

[Vic Davis]

The highest download rate I've heard so far is 2 megabytes per second. Anyone getting better than that?

Don't do it! It's a trap! If the needle passes 2 MBytes a second it's game over for all of us. The internet will probably just melt or explode.

Seriously, if I didn't have a wireless connection that was basically a shade better than dial up, I'd be Sinning now.

[SlyFrog]

Dare this luddite ask whether anyone has seen the physical copy in an actual store yet? Stupid release date voodoo, we wants it now (but don't wants to pay the extra $5.00)!

(Plus we has a gift certificate and coupon for Best Buy.)

[Sam Jones]

The highest download rate I've heard so far is 2 megabytes per second. Anyone getting better than that?

I got just over that very briefly, but it mainly varied between 1.5 and 2mb/s.

[Brad Wardell]

I have a question regarding the tutorials, is there supposed to be some kind of guidance for the basic interface one or is it just the player messing around with the various buttons? I loaded it up and there was nothing going on.

Also for registering to play online it says it needs my CD Key, can I just copy and paste the serial number from the email to the box?

There's an interactive tutorial included in the game right in the "single player" area.

The serial # is your CD key.

[flyinj]

So, I preordered this game months and months ago, when the first preorders were taken. I have played the beta, etc.

I hear I can pay an extra $5 to have the game/manual/etc shipped to me on top of my already paid for DD version of the game. Does this apply to my stardock central bought version too? How do I "upgrade" my purchase to get the box sent as well?

Thanks-

[Charles]

Now if only I had my serial number.

[Kryten]

Registered and ordered 10 minutes ago, downloading now - international is a bit slow, I'm peaking at 700KB/s, averaging 350KB/s (and I assure you, it's NOT my connection - I run the ISP I'm using and we've got more than enough international capacity). TCP tuning is probably playing it's part.

Don't if this means I can play when it's done downloading though - we'll see I guess :)

[Hetzer]

Whow, i got the link as i was playing with my buddies pen and paper rpg... at 2000 gmt... it was ready when i looked the next time at 2100 gmt... dont know exatly how much bandwith i got from you.. i have a 5mbit down line but havent observed the process...

and this is in europe, germany.... well Brad i dont know if the game is good (i find out tonight) but the service is superb...

thx

[Charles]

Registered and ordered 10 minutes ago, downloading now - international is a bit slow, I'm peaking at 700KB/s, averaging 350KB/s (and I assure you, it's NOT my connection - I run the ISP I'm using and we've got more than enough international capacity). TCP tuning is probably playing it's part.

Don't if this means I can play when it's done downloading though - we'll see I guess :)

So how is it that this system is so backwards that people who order now get it, but people who ordered earlier don't?

Messed up, IMO.

[Gendal]

The highest download rate I've heard so far is 2 megabytes per second. Anyone getting better than that?
I started at 3mb/s which is a service of my isp, but they quickly throttle that back to a bit over half. So my download flew to 40% and promptly stalled down to a pathetic 40k/s. I had to leave then for a couple of hours so no big deal, it's all installed now so after lunch it's time to sin.

Then I plan to play this new space rts I just downloaded.

[Cal]

Anyone else notice the tutorial is broken, doesnt seem to be any voice-over / text tutoring me!

Also is there no manual? Can't seem to find one, feeling a bit out of my depth now. No idea what to do

[Saxman_72]

So how is it that this system is so backwards that people who order now get it, but people who ordered earlier don't?

Messed up, IMO.
Yeah, I gotta admit, that is not cool. I can't even remember how long ago I preordered this thing, and I still haven't received an e-mail. It's like their system is processing the most recent orders first and working backwards. And that ain't right.

[Volksy]

The first time I loaded the basic tutorial - or at least I thought I did - I just had a Gauss cannon firing at some incoming enemy ship with no explanation. Exited the game, started again, loaded the basic tutorial and something "took" this time. It gave me text instructions and stepped me through things properly. The other 3 tutorials worked fine after that as well.

Download speed was quite impressive, maxing out my 6mbps Road Runner connection for most of the download. I saw it dip a few times, but most of the time it was showing 600K+ . This is rare, as most sites seem to cap a bit below this, and several I never even see 300K sustained. Being used to Steam I was initially concerned that getting the game would take awhile, since there was no preload option here. Not an issue whatsoever. Steam often times takes longer than this to download the Day 1 files and activate the game that I preloaded.

[Cal]

The first time I loaded the basic tutorial - or at least I thought I did - I just had a Gauss cannon firing at some incoming enemy ship with no explanation. Exited the game, started again, loaded the basic tutorial and something "took" this time. It gave me text instructions and stepped me through things properly. The other 3 tutorials worked fine after that as well.

Download speed was quite impressive, maxing out my 6mbps Road Runner connection for most of the download. I saw it dip a few times, but most of the time it was showing 600K+ . This is rare, as most sites seem to cap a bit below this, and several I never even see 300K sustained. Being used to Steam I was initially concerned that getting the game would take awhile, since there was no preload option here. Not an issue whatsoever. Steam often times takes longer than this to download the Day 1 files and activate the game that I preloaded.


Yeah someone else suggested that - No dice. Logistics seems to work fine, worked my way through that tutorial, but cant get the text on the other 3.

[Rob_Merritt]

So how is it that this system is so backwards that people who order now get it, but people who ordered earlier don't?

Messed up, IMO.

I don't think so. I ordered it this morning and didn't get any notice and I know people who ordered it weeks ago go their email already.

[Dalai]

I can't even remember how long ago I preordered this thing, and I still haven't received an e-mail.

I preordered this game ages ago and I didn't need an email. Just fire up Stardock Central and see if the game is available.


The first time I loaded the basic tutorial - or at least I thought I did - I just had a Gauss cannon firing at some incoming enemy ship with no explanation. Exited the game, started again, loaded the basic tutorial and something "took" this time.

I had to start the tutorial 3 times before the text came up.

[Cal]

seems there is a fix for the no tutorials, taken from the official forums, not ideal but i seem to be botching through now.


Hi guys, it appears there a problem with some computers and various resolutions with the tutorials. You should be able to play them if you stay at 1024x768.

[Sebmojo]

Just got mine - ordered last night.

[mono]

Installed via Stardock Central and home waiting for me. Thanks Hamachi/RDP!

[Lorini]

Discussed the lack of serial numbers with Brad over PM and he said for their next release, he is going to put in place a system where the preorders will get theirs at the same time as the same day orders. In the meantime, looks like you have to wait.

[Adam B]

FYI: The Ion Bolt (for the TEC Akkan Battlecruiser) is amazing. Totally disables a ship for 5 seconds at first level with I think a 12sec cooldown. Nothing like screwing somebody with a early-game capship kill -- since those huge bastards take a year and a half to accelerate, it's awfully difficult to get away from an Ion Bolt-spamming Akkan.

[JM]

So how is it that this system is so backwards that people who order now get it, but people who ordered earlier don't?

Messed up, IMO.

Ordered mine months ago. Got it earlier than most people in this thread. "YMMV", I guess.

[Igor Muravyev]

I ordered mine back in 2007 in time to be accepted for beta 1, I was able to start downloading it as soon as I woke up and realized it was up already (around 2PM CST I had it already).

To anyone who complains about not being able to download it yet, please realize this game is supposed to come out today at midnight, so even if you get it before the end of the day, its still a few hours earlier than you were supposed to get it.

Let's contrast this with practically any Steam release, I remember Half-Life 2 files started unlocking several hours after it was released, and after that it took a few days before I got the game to work because my invalid precached files were getting falsely validated.

[Jab]

So how does the friend's list work, can we send requests and such without the person being online? My name is Pfreak and I just got my account up.

This is pretty bad for me, how do I mine an asteroid that's outside of my initial planets gravity well? Also there aren't any planets that I can colonize.

[NowhereDan]

Build a colony frigate, pfreak.

[Jab]

Sigh, I built one but wasn't sure if that's what you use. Also the basic interface tutorial is not working for me, the other 3 are. I get the same thing that's mentioned above, a frigate arrives and attacks the defense platform, and nothing else happens.

[Demon G Sides]

This game looks pretty sick. When I get a computer that can handle something more complex than Starcraft and Warcraft III, I'll definitely pick this up!

[NowhereDan]

If you're trying to capture a mine that's not around a capturable planet/asteroid, it depends on which race you are. As TEC and Advent you use the colony frigate's second ability. As Vasarri, it's on the scouts.