NFL Week 17

[Shmtur]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Rimbo]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

computer sez... (http://rimbosity.com/scores.html)

[Bill Dungsroman]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Not One Of Us]

New England at N.Y. Giants - in a motherfucking fire.
Buffalo at Philadelphia - meh.
Carolina at Tampa Bay - Odd pick.
Cincinnati at Miami - Oh wow, Battle of the Suck.
Dallas at Washington - Yay for picking against the Cowboys!
Detroit at Green Bay - Yay for Green Bay!
Jacksonville at Houston - Yay for Jacksonville!
New Orleans at Chicago - Saints get the Wild Card! Yay!
Pittsburgh at Baltimore - Steelers ain't the Ravens.
Seattle at Atlanta - Boo for picking Seattle!
San Francisco at Cleveland - Come on, Browns!
Tennessee at Indianapolis - Crush 'em!
Minnesota at Denver - You too.
San Diego at Oakland I'll show some sympathy.
St. Louis at Arizona - We win, and this'll be the first time we've had a non-losing record since 1998.
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets - Hmm.

[Mark Crump]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[balut]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington - Changing my pick in the hopes of divine intervention. Instead of Crom, I shall pray to the god of the Four Winds, who is ABOVE Crom.
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Shmtur]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

Good gods, did I really pick that many away teams?

[Robert Sharp]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington (I thought this was at Dallas...hmph)
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Ryan A]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Major Malphunktion]

New England at N.Y. Giants- On motherfucking FIRE!
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[sluggo]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Greedo]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Juan Rayo]

New England at N.Y. Giants - En un hijodeputa FUEGO!
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington - Crom, I have never prayed to you before. I have no tongue for it. No one, not even you, will remember if they were good players or bad. Why they played, or why we watched. All that matters is that the Redskins stood against fucking Dallas. That's what's important! Valor pleases you, Crom... so grant me one request. Grant the Redskins victory! And if you do not listen, then to HELL with you!
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona - (Juan Rayo flips coin in the air. Coin falls on crack on the floor, trough earth´s crust, into the hellish abyss. Chtulu answers: It doesn´t matter, who gives a fuck about this game?) Juan Rayo picks randomly.
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Matt Perkins]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Bill Dungsroman]

Man, what the hell is going on? There are NFL analysts whom I usually trust like Mark Sclereth saying that it's in the Giants' best interests to start all their players and try to beat New England. What kind of retarded shit is that? Not only would they most likely lose, then they'd be too gassed for their road trip to Tampa or Seattle. I'll point out that Dallas was the only team to win (or at least play well) the week after losing to the Patriots this season. Sure, beating them would be a major morale boost, but it's way too much of a risk and the rest were serve them better most likely anyway. This isn't like the Colts of two years ago, who lost their momentum by laying up, it's a team that needs to carve out a quasi-bye week to get healthy enough to go on the road in the playoffs, where the wins really count. Hell, they can't even move up in their seed spot. This is akin to advising a team with a mediocre goal line offense against a team with a stout goal line defense, to go for two in the last seconds of a game instead of kicking the extra point to tie the game and go into OT.

[Nick Walter]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Robert Sharp]

If the Giants beat the Patriots, it would be nice momentum, but that's about it. They gain nothing from it and could lose a lot. If they try and still lose, especially if the Patriots can beat them without having to play Brady et al. for the whole game, that would surely have the opposite affect on the Giants. It would make them realize they aren't good enough, or at least put that question out there. And they would risk injury for a team that is already beat up. The Giants should rest, plain and simple.

[Contrai]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Charlatan]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington Crom - what Juan said.
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Bill Dungsroman]

Holy shit. (http://www.nfl.com/news/story;jsessionid=CC5729AE206375ED7567B162292B3410? id=09000d5d80579400&template=with-video&confirm=true)

[Major Malphunktion]

You love you really love us!
In Boston does this mean it is on NBC,ABC(who usually carries the Pats pre-season and NFL net games) and CBS? All 3 networks? Even if on two- it shows you how much the NFL rules the sports world.

[Sarkus]

You love you really love us!
In Boston does this mean it is on NBC,ABC(who usually carries the Pats pre-season and NFL net games) and CBS? All 3 networks? Even if on two- it shows you how much the NFL rules the sports world.

Presumably. I think it's nice they are doing this, but they are opening a Pandora's Box of issues by doing it. The people who are paying extra for the NFL Network are pissed. The bars who are paying a ton for their football packages are pissed. And the next time the NFL Network has a game that a lot of people would like to see there will be epic bitching if they don't do it again.

Also, don't underestimate the impact of the writers strike here - I'm willing to bet it wouldn't be happening if the networks weren't already running short of new things to show.

[Bill Dungsroman]

Presumably. I think it's nice they are doing this, but they are opening a Pandora's Box of issues by doing it. The people who are paying extra for the NFL Network are pissed. The bars who are paying a ton for their football packages are pissed.
Nobody really "pays extra" just for NFLN, AFIAK. You either get it with your digital cable, or you don't. Speaking as someone who does, I think it's neat and I sure don't feel ripped off...by this particular game, at any rate. Now, talk to me about Sunday Ticker and how I can't get that...

As for why bars would be upset, I don't see that at all, either. It's one game.



And the next time the NFL Network has a game that a lot of people would like to see there will be epic bitching if they don't do it again.
I'm sure the next time the NFLN has a game this epic, which I dunno will be when, in another 20, 30 years? They might be able do this again, probably.



Also, don't underestimate the impact of the writers strike here - I'm willing to bet it wouldn't be happening if the networks weren't already running short of new things to show.
Um...ok? Why is this relevant? There's no way to really know that. Saturday at 5:00PM PST isn't exactly overloaded with premium network content regardless.

[Ephraim]

Also, don't underestimate the impact of the writers strike here - I'm willing to bet it wouldn't be happening if the networks weren't already running short of new things to show.

Nah. It's mid-holidays. There have never been new shows on the air at this point, everything is on hiatus normally, writer's strike or not. It really might just be the political pressure mentioned in the article. Plus the NFL looking for goodwill and more fans.

As for this Canadian, I don't care. Why? BECAUSE I'VE GOT TICKETS TO THE GAME :D. Yep, I am going to be in the NYC area for New Year's, and a buddy managed to snag decent seats to this game. It's going to be chilly; it'll be only my second live NFL game, but it is potentially history in the making, and live NFL football blew my mind last time around, so I can't imagine it being bad this time. Yay! Any tips on how to keep warm at an outdoor game in late December in New Jersey?

[Sarkus]

Nobody really "pays extra" just for NFLN, AFIAK. You either get it with your digital cable, or you don't. Speaking as someone who does, I think it's neat and I sure don't feel ripped off...by this particular game, at any rate. Now, talk to me about Sunday Ticker and how I can't get that...

That may be true where you live, but not all cable systems offer it that way. For example, Comcast sells a seperate "Sports Entertainment" package for $6/month to get the NFL Network. They are even specifically promoting it on their home page for this game.

ESPN's article on this announcement notes that the NFL Network is available in less than 40% of homes.

Also, some cable providers don't carry the NFL Network at all - notably the #2 cable provider, Time Warner Cable (which is a major cable provider in places like LA, Charlotte, Cleveland, and San Antonio).


As for why bars would be upset, I don't see that at all, either. It's one game.

Lost business. People without NFL Network (see above) can now stay home, host parties, whatever.


I'm sure the next time the NFLN has a game this epic, which I dunno will be when, in another 20, 30 years? They might be able do this again, probably.

I didn't call the game epic, I said it was a game a lot of people want to see. The next time there is a great matchup (i.e. Dallas-Green Bay earlier this year) there will people who will point to this game.


Um...ok? Why is this relevant? There's no way to really know that. Saturday at 5:00PM PST isn't exactly overloaded with premium network content regardless.

Let's see: Saturday between Christmas and New Years, game is running in prime time in all continental US timezones, and two networks felt it was better than what they otherwise would have shown. Like say movies or specials they can now use later. And they're willing to make this change four days ahead of time.

[Cronox]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Elton]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[BennyProfane]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Uncle Larry]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Major Malphunktion]

Keeping warm: First you are from canada right? Shouldn't you be telling us?
Big fan of: Hand and feet chemical warmers. Mittens not gloves if it is really cold(sub 10 degrees)
Layers for upper body- I recommend silk long undies, they breathe well, and are super warm. Also cold weather Underarmor works better than traditional long undewear.
Lower body layers again. If snowing or raining, wear snowpants- a wet ass sucks.
Alcohol thins blood and you might not feel the cold, but you will get cold.
Wear a good hat-that covers your ears.
Don't be afraid to bring a blanket or buy a nice Patriots one while you are there.
Irish Coffee.

[Matt Bowyer]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Major Malphunktion]

My Sat night Score sheet: There are more but here are the 'important ones from the Boston Globe:

New Records:

New England became the first team in NFL history to start a season with 15 consecutive wins and tied the NFL record for most victories in a regular season, joining the 2004 Steelers, 1998 Vikings, 1985 Bears, and 1984 49ers.

Winners of 18 straight regular season games dating to last year, the Patriots would break their own NFL record for consecutive regular season wins if they finish 16-0. They won 18 straight regular season games between 2003 and 2004 as part of a 21-game winning streak, including playoffs.

With 71 touchdowns through 15 games, New England broke the NFL record of 70 touchdowns in a season, previously held by the 1984 Miami Dolphins.

Tom Brady and Randy Moss have paired up for a record 21 passing touchdowns. The previous NFL record for touchdown connections between a passer and receiver was 18, completed by Miami’s Dan Marino and Mark Clayton in 1984 and by Green Bay’s Brett Favre and Sterling Sharpe in 1994. (When Jerry Rice caught his NFL-record 22 TDs in 1987, he caught 13 touchdowns from Joe Montana, 8 from Steve Young and 1 from running back Harry Sydney).

Could be broken Sat night:

Randy Moss, Brady's favorite target this season, has already broken the franchise mark for touchdown receptions in a season with 21 thus far. He will break the NFL mark of 22, set by 49ers wide receiver Jerry Rice in 1987, if he catches two more TD passes against the Giants.

Tom Brady has thrown at least three touchdown passes in every game but three this season (he had two TDs against the Ravens, one against the Eagles, and none against the Jets in Foxborough), and has 48 total for the season. He will break the record of Colts quarterback Peyton Manning, who threw 49 in 2004, if he throws two TDs against the Giants.

The Patriots have scored 551 points this season and are on pace to set a new NFL record for points if they score six points against the Giants Saturday. The record for points in a season is 556, set by the 1998 Minnesota Vikings (a team that also had Randy Moss at wide receiver).

With Eugene Wilson's interception return for a touchdown against the Jets, the Patriots now have 21 players who have scored a touchdown this season. That ties the NFL record shared by the 1987 Los Angeles Rams and the 2000 Denver Broncos.

Of the many NFL records targeted by the Patriots, one perhaps overlooked is the team's knack for avoiding turnovers. The Patriots lead the NFL, having turned the ball over just 11 times. The NFL record for fewest turnovers in a season is 11, set by Baltimore in the strike-shortened 1982 season. The 2006 Redskins, who favored a more conservative approach, have the record for fewest turnovers in a 16-game season, with 12.

The Patriots are averaging 36.7 points per game, which is a bit shy of an NFL record. The 1950 Los Angeles Rams averaged 38.8 points per game.



TEAM RECORDS
With 6,190 total net yards this season, the Patriots set the franchise mark in that category. The previous mark was 5,965 set in 1978... The Pats also established a new franchise mark for first downs with 366 this season. The previous mark was 348 set in 1994.

Mike Vrabel recorded two sacks against Miami, bringing his season total to 11.5, the most by a Patriot since 1987, when Andre Tippett totaled 12.5.

With a 6-0 mark in conference play, the Patriots finished undefeated in the AFC East for the first time.

Wes Welker now has 101 receptions for the season and has tied Troy Brown for the team record with 101 receptions set during the 2001 season. Welker needs one more catch to hold the record on his own.

The Patriots have an average margin of victory of 20.8 points through 15 games this season, much to the chagrin of the rest of the league. The largest average margin of victory ever recorded by an NFL team -- 26.5 points per game -- belongs to the 1942 Chicago Bears, who went 11-0 during the regular season. Since the NFL introduced a cap on how much teams could spend on players and introduced free agency in 1993, at least 44 percent of the games each season have been decided by 7 points or fewer.

Both Randy Moss and Wes Welker have eclipsed the 1,000 receiving yards mark for this season. They are only the second pair of receivers in Patriots history to have more than 1,000 yards each in the same season (Stanley Morgan and Harold Jackson did it in 1979).

[Slainte Mhath]

New England at N.Y. Giants - They wil go 16-0, but lose in playoffs.
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami - meaningless game of the week (among many)
Dallas at Washington - Dallas will rest Romo, Witten, Owens
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston - Meaningless game for JAX, starters rest
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland - Cleveland will play full 60 minutes
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets - Homecoming loss tops off Herm's lousy season

[Troy S Goodfellow]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

Troy

[Squirrel Killer]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Alan Dunkin]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

Get ready for a wild and wacky week.

--- Alan

[BlueJackalope]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Sarkus]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

Five picks against Rimbot. Time to roll the dice!

[Rimbo]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

Five picks against Rimbot. Time to roll the dice!

You are, of course, really picking against statistical probability here.

Not usually a good choice. But of course... it's now or never. :)

[caesarbear]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Raife]

It's like John Henry versus the steam hammer.

[Jon Rowe]

New England at N.Y. Giants B.J.'s back baby! (Gotta make something interesting)
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets[/quote]

[Talisker]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Talisker]

# of picks per team:

NE 25 @ NYG 5
(NYG: Contrai, Jon_Danger, Nick Walter, Not One Of Us, Uncle Larry)

BUF 3 @ PHI 27
(BUF: Matt Perkins, Nick Walter, Not One Of Us)

DET 3 @ GB 27
(DET: Andrew Myers, Charlatan, Contrai)

JAC 21 @ HOU 9

CIN 28 @ MIA 2
(MIA: Contrai, Greedo)

CAR 5 @ TB 25
(CAR: Bill Dungsroman, caesarbear, Cronox, Greedo, Not One Of Us)

SEA 28 @ ATL 2
(ATL: Alan Dunkin, Bill Dungsroman)

NO 13 @ CHI 17

SF 2 @ CLE 28
(SF: Contrai, Shmtur)

SD 28 @ OAK 2
(OAK: Alan Dunkin, Not One Of Us)

MIN 24 @ DEN 6
(DEN: Contrai, contrarybear, Mark Crump, Not One Of Us, Ryan A, Uncle Larry)

STL 5 @ ARI 25
(STL: balut, Juan Rayo, Matt Perkins, SolomonGrundy, Troy S Goodfellow)

DAL 8 @ WAS 22

PIT 26 @ BAL 4
(BAL: Bill Dungsroman, Charlatan, Contrai, Juan Rayo)

KC 12 @ NYJ 18

TEN 11 @ IND 19


Vegas Line:
NE PHI GB HOU CIN CAR ATL NO CLE SD MIN ARI WAS PIT NYJ TEN

The QT3 consensus:
NE PHI GB JAC CIN TB SEA CHI CLE SD MIN ARI WAS PIT NYJ IND

Straight Vegas Line pickers (lame!): (nobody)

Maverick ratings (# of picks that differ with the QT3 consensus):
8: Contrai, Not One Of Us
5: Bill Dungsroman, Uncle Larry
4: Alan Dunkin, Andrew Myers, Matt Perkins, Nick Walter
3: BennyProfane, BlueJackalope, Charlatan, contrarybear, Greedo, Juan Rayo, Robert Sharp, Sarkus, Shmtur, Troy S Goodfellow
2: caesarbear, Cronox, Jon_Danger, Mark Crump, Rimbo, Ryan A, Slainte Mhath, SolomonGrundy, Squirrel Killer
1: balut, sluggo
0: Kid Socrates


No picks entered yet: BaconTastesGood, Cosmic Hippo, Crispus, delirium, Desslock, ElGuapo, jeffd, Lorini, NatCox, Ryan Markel, shadarr, Supersport, Taranis, theKevin, TheRock, yurislave

[Talisker]

1. Rimbo 167-73 (70%) NE PHI GB JAC CIN TB SEA NO CLE SD MIN ARI DAL PIT NYJ IND

2. Robert Sharp 164-76 (68%) NE PHI GB HOU CIN TB SEA NO CLE SD MIN ARI WAS PIT NYJ TEN

3. Sarkus 163-77 (68%) NE PHI GB HOU CIN TB SEA CHI CLE SD MIN ARI WAS PIT KC TEN

4. Crispus 161-79 (67%)

5. Andrew Myers 160-80 (67%) NE PHI DET JAC CIN TB SEA NO CLE SD MIN ARI DAL PIT KC IND

6. Slainte Mhath 159-81 (66%) NE PHI GB HOU CIN TB SEA NO CLE SD MIN ARI WAS PIT NYJ IND
6. Troy S Goodfellow 159-81 (66%) NE PHI GB JAC CIN TB SEA CHI CLE SD MIN STL DAL PIT KC IND

8. caesarbear 158-82 (66%) NE PHI GB JAC CIN CAR SEA NO CLE SD MIN ARI WAS PIT NYJ IND
8. contrarybear 158-82 (66%) NE PHI GB HOU CIN TB SEA CHI CLE SD DEN ARI DAL PIT NYJ IND

10. Desslock 157-83 (65%)

11. Bill Dungsroman 156-84 (65%) NE PHI GB HOU CIN CAR ATL CHI CLE SD MIN ARI WAS BAL NYJ TEN

12. Alan Dunkin 153-87 (64%) NE PHI GB HOU CIN TB ATL CHI CLE OAK MIN ARI WAS PIT NYJ TEN

13. Kid Socrates 152-88 (63%) NE PHI GB JAC CIN TB SEA CHI CLE SD MIN ARI WAS PIT NYJ IND

14. Ryan A 151-89 (63%) NE PHI GB JAC CIN TB SEA CHI CLE SD DEN ARI WAS PIT NYJ TEN
14. Shmtur 151-89 (63%) NE PHI GB JAC CIN TB SEA CHI SF SD MIN ARI WAS PIT KC TEN

16. BlueJackalope 146-94 (61%) NE PHI GB JAC CIN TB SEA NO CLE SD MIN ARI WAS PIT KC TEN
16. shadarr 146-94 (61%)

18. Matt Perkins 145-81 (64%) NE BUF GB JAC CIN TB SEA NO CLE SD MIN STL DAL PIT NYJ IND

19. Charlatan 145-95 (60%) NE PHI DET HOU CIN TB SEA CHI CLE SD MIN ARI WAS BAL NYJ IND

20. Nick Walter 142-98 (59%) NYG BUF GB JAC CIN TB SEA NO CLE SD MIN ARI WAS PIT NYJ TEN

21. sluggo 141-83 (63%) NE PHI GB JAC CIN TB SEA NO CLE SD MIN ARI WAS PIT NYJ IND

22. Juan Rayo 140-100 (58%) NE PHI GB JAC CIN TB SEA CHI CLE SD MIN STL WAS BAL KC IND

23. balut 137-89 (61%) NE PHI GB JAC CIN TB SEA CHI CLE SD MIN STL WAS PIT NYJ IND

24. Uncle Larry 133-86 (61%) NYG PHI GB JAC CIN TB SEA NO CLE SD DEN ARI DAL PIT KC IND

25. Squirrel Killer 133-91 (59%) NE PHI GB HOU CIN TB SEA CHI CLE SD MIN ARI WAS PIT KC IND

26. Not One Of Us 131-109 (55%) NYG BUF GB JAC CIN CAR SEA NO CLE OAK DEN ARI DAL PIT KC IND

27. SolomonGrundy 130-109 (54%) NE PHI GB JAC CIN TB SEA CHI CLE SD MIN STL WAS PIT KC IND

28. Cronox 128-50 (72%) NE PHI GB JAC CIN CAR SEA CHI CLE SD MIN ARI WAS PIT NYJ TEN

29. Greedo 125-83 (60%) NE PHI GB JAC MIA CAR SEA CHI CLE SD MIN ARI WAS PIT NYJ TEN

30. BennyProfane 124-67 (65%) NE PHI GB JAC CIN TB SEA NO CLE SD MIN ARI DAL PIT NYJ TEN

31. NatCox 120-90 (57%)

32. yurislave 114-110 (51%)

33. Mark Crump 110-68 (62%) NE PHI GB JAC CIN TB SEA CHI CLE SD DEN ARI WAS PIT KC IND

34. Contrai 102-122 (46%) NYG PHI DET HOU MIA TB SEA CHI SF SD DEN ARI WAS BAL KC IND

35. BaconTastesGood 91-69 (57%)

36. Lorini 90-56 (62%)

37. Taranis 86-60 (59%)

38. theKevin 55-39 (59%)

39. Ryan Markel 53-36 (60%)

40. delirium 43-30 (59%)
40. Supersport 43-30 (59%)

42. TheRock 38-24 (61%)

43. Jon_Danger 33-15 (69%) NYG PHI GB JAC CIN TB SEA NO CLE SD MIN ARI WAS PIT NYJ IND

44. ElGuapo 28-12 (70%)

45. jeffd 14-14 (50%)

46. Cosmic Hippo 11-19 (37%)

[mono]

NYG!?

Edit - Well, maybe not, but at least the classic NFL film of the game can use adjectives such as gritty or pesky to describe the Giants.

[Juan Rayo]

Man for a couple minutes there it seemed like the Giants would actually pull it off. Shame.

[Shmtur]

They haven't been trying to win for a while.

[theKevin]

Take that, Don Shula.

[Crispus]

Bah, missed NE's weekly "gimme" pick of the week.

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

[Sarkus]

Congrats to the Patriots for the unprecedented 16-0. Never thought I'd see that in my life. And congrats to the Giants for trying and not just resting everyone.

[theKevin]

Yeah, the Giants really didn't make it easy for them. It was a fight all the way to the last minute.

[Bill Dungsroman]

Take that, Don Shula.
And especially take that, Mercury Morris. I hope this fucking shuts him up forever.

[Major Malphunktion]

Yeah that was an awesome game. kudos for the Giants playing out of thier minds. If they play like that every week going forward they could be a force in the playoffs. Who is this Boss kid?

[Sarkus]

Wow, some ugly games early. I'm glad I picked a few of them, but still.

It makes me wonder if the "rest the starters" theory is worth it. Sure, Seattle and Jacksonville have nothing to play for, and they've pulled a lot of their starters, but do you really want to end the regular season with this kind of pounding? Giving up 40+ points if giving up 40+ points, not matter what the excuse for it is.

[Bill Dungsroman]

Wow, some ugly games early. I'm glad I picked a few of them, but still.

It makes me wonder if the "rest the starters" theory is worth it. Sure, Seattle and Jacksonville have nothing to play for, and they've pulled a lot of their starters, but do you really want to end the regular season with this kind of pounding? Giving up 40+ points if giving up 40+ points, not matter what the excuse for it is.
For teams that have to play next week, I think it's advisable. If anything, it's motivation, especially if your going to play at home next week. But, getting totally slaughtered might be a psychological problem, but it's weighed against risking injuries and other things. You don't know at kickoff that you're going to end up losing big, so you make a discretionary decision.

[Robert Sharp]

Don't the Pats actually have to win the SB to match the Dolphins though?

[Sarkus]

Don't the Pats actually have to win the SB to match the Dolphins though?

Pretty much. Impressive as it is, undefeated regular season is just a footnote if you don't win the championship. Look at Seattle in the MLB in 2001 - most regular season wins, now just a minor trivia note because they didn't win the World Series.

[Mark Crump]

Don't the Pats actually have to win the SB to match the Dolphins though?

For a perfect season, yes.

But the Pats beat Miami's record of 14-0 in the regular season.

[Robert Sharp]

I realize that. But I bet the Dolphins still break out the bubbly if the Pats don't win it all. After all, the Dolphins COULDN"T have won 16 games that year during the regular season. The key is that was an undefeated full season (including post). I'm still damned impressed with the Pats, obviously.

Oh, and I still hate them!

[Bill Dungsroman]

Pretty much. Impressive as it is, undefeated regular season is just a footnote if you don't win the championship. Look at Seattle in the MLB in 2001 - most regular season wins, now just a minor trivia note because they didn't win the World Series.
Not the same as undefeated in the NFL, but point taken. They need the SB win to achieve true legendary status, unqualified.

[Bill Dungsroman]

New England at N.Y. Giants
Buffalo at Philadelphia
Carolina at Tampa Bay
Cincinnati at Miami
Dallas at Washington
Detroit at Green Bay
Jacksonville at Houston
New Orleans at Chicago
Pittsburgh at Baltimore
Seattle at Atlanta
San Francisco at Cleveland
Tennessee at Indianapolis
Minnesota at Denver
San Diego at Oakland
St. Louis at Arizona
Kansas City at N.Y. Jets

GOD DAMMIT VIKINGS.

COME ON TITANS WOOOOOOOOOOOO


EDIT: Aw yeah!

[Talisker]

Dang, nice final week, Bill.


====== preliminary week 17 computed results ======

1. Bill Dungsroman 14-1 TEN

2. Alan Dunkin 11-4 TEN
2. Charlatan 11-4 IND
2. contrarybear 11-4 IND
2. Cronox 11-4 TEN
2. Ryan A 11-4 TEN

7. caesarbear 10-5 IND
7. Greedo 10-5 TEN
7. Kid Socrates 10-5 IND
7. Mark Crump 10-5 IND
7. Robert Sharp 10-5 TEN
7. Sarkus 10-5 TEN
7. Slainte Mhath 10-5 IND
7. Squirrel Killer 10-5 IND

15. balut 9-6 IND
15. Juan Rayo 9-6 IND
15. Shmtur 9-6 TEN
15. sluggo 9-6 IND

19. BennyProfane 8-7 TEN
19. BlueJackalope 8-7 TEN
19. Contrai 8-7 IND
19. Jon_Danger 8-7 IND
19. Rimbo 8-7 IND
19. SolomonGrundy 8-7 IND

25. Crispus 7-8 TEN
25. Nick Walter 7-8 TEN
25. Troy S Goodfellow 7-8 IND
25. Uncle Larry 7-8 IND

29. Andrew Myers 6-9 IND
29. Matt Perkins 6-9 IND
29. Not One Of Us 6-9 IND

32. BaconTastesGood 0-0
32. Cosmic Hippo 0-0
32. delirium 0-0
32. Desslock 0-0
32. ElGuapo 0-0
32. jeffd 0-0
32. Lorini 0-0
32. NatCox 0-0
32. Ryan Markel 0-0
32. shadarr 0-0
32. Supersport 0-0
32. Taranis 0-0
32. theKevin 0-0
32. TheRock 0-0
32. yurislave 0-0


====== preliminary week 17 computed season totals ======

1. Rimbo 175-80 (69%) IND

2. Robert Sharp 174-81 (68%) TEN

3. Sarkus 173-82 (68%) TEN

4. Bill Dungsroman 170-85 (67%) TEN

5. contrarybear 169-86 (66%) IND
5. Slainte Mhath 169-86 (66%) IND

7. caesarbear 168-87 (66%) IND
7. Crispus 168-87 (66%) TEN

9. Andrew Myers 166-89 (65%) IND
9. Troy S Goodfellow 166-89 (65%) IND

11. Alan Dunkin 164-91 (64%) TEN

12. Kid Socrates 162-93 (64%) IND
12. Ryan A 162-93 (64%) TEN

14. Shmtur 160-95 (63%) TEN

15. Desslock 157-83 (65%)

16. Charlatan 156-99 (61%) IND

17. BlueJackalope 154-101 (60%) TEN

18. Matt Perkins 151-90 (63%) IND

19. sluggo 150-89 (63%) IND

20. Juan Rayo 149-106 (58%) IND
20. Nick Walter 149-106 (58%) TEN

22. shadarr 146-94 (61%)

23. balut 146-95 (61%) IND

24. Squirrel Killer 143-96 (60%) IND

25. Uncle Larry 140-94 (60%) IND

26. Cronox 139-54 (72%) TEN

27. SolomonGrundy 138-116 (54%) IND

28. Not One Of Us 137-118 (54%) IND

29. Greedo 135-88 (61%) TEN

30. BennyProfane 132-74 (64%) TEN

31. Mark Crump 120-73 (62%) IND

32. NatCox 120-90 (57%)

33. yurislave 114-110 (51%)

34. Contrai 110-129 (46%) IND

35. BaconTastesGood 91-69 (57%)

36. Lorini 90-56 (62%)

37. Taranis 86-60 (59%)

38. theKevin 55-39 (59%)

39. Ryan Markel 53-36 (60%)

40. delirium 43-30 (59%)
40. Supersport 43-30 (59%)

42. Jon_Danger 41-22 (65%) IND

43. TheRock 38-24 (61%)

44. ElGuapo 28-12 (70%)

45. jeffd 14-14 (50%)

46. Cosmic Hippo 11-19 (37%)

[Sarkus]

You are, of course, really picking against statistical probability here.


Statistical probability took the week off. :-)

Nice photo finish! Rimbo and Robert tied! Unbelievable picks by Bill - has anyone done that well all year?

[Robert Sharp]

A freakin TIE? How could that be!? Whatever. I am the best human. Bow down to me, or prepare to serve your circuitboard Overlord.

[caesarbear]

Individual
Broken
Most Passing Touchdowns, Season, 50, Tom Brady, New England Patriots
Most Pass Completions, Season, 440, Drew Brees, New Orleans Saints
Most Rushing Yards Gained, Game, 296, Adrian Peterson, Minnesota Vikings vs. San Diego Chargers
Most Receiving Touchdowns, Season, 23, Randy Moss, New England Patriots
Most Consecutive Wins, Regular Season, 19, New England Patriots
Longest Kickoff Return, 108, Ellis Hobbs, New England Patriots vs. New York Jets
Most Kick Return Touchdowns, Season, 6, Devin Hester, Chicago Bears
Most Field Goals Made, Game, 8, Rob Bironas, Tennessee Titans vs. Houston Texans
Most Extra Points Attempted, Season, 74, Stephen Gostkowski, New England Patriots
Most Extra Points Made, Season, 74, Stephen Gostkowski, New England Patriots
Longest Play, 109 yards, Antonio Cromartie, missed field goal return, San Diego Chargers vs. Minnesota Vikings

Tied
Most Interceptions Returned for Touchdowns in a Game, 2, Antrel Rolle, Arizona Cardinals at Cincinnati Bengals
Punt Returns, Most Touchdowns, Season, 4, Devin Hester, Chicago Bears
Kickoff Returns, Most Touchdowns, Game, 2, Andre Davis, Houston Texans vs. Jacksonville Jaguars

Brett Farve
Most Pass Attempts, Career, 8,758
Most Pass Completions, Career, 5,377
Most Passing Touchdowns, Career, 442
Most Passing Interceptions, Career, 288
Most Passing Yards, Career, 61,655
Most Games, 300 Yards or More Passing, Career, 63

Team
Broken
Most Points, Season, 564, New England Patriots
Most Touchdowns, Season, 71, New England Patriots
Most Points, Fourth Quarter, 34, Detroit Lions vs Chicago Bears
Most Points, Both Teams, Fourth Quarter, 48, Detroit Lions (34) vs Chicago Bears(14)
Most Field Goals, Game, 8, Tennessee Titans vs Houston Texans

Tied
Most Field Goals Attempted, Game, 8, Tennessee Titans vs Houston Texans
Most Sacks, Game, 12, New York Giants vs Philadelphia Eagles
Most Losses, Season, 15, Miami Dolphins

not sure I got them all

[Bill Dungsroman]

Now that the season is over, I'd like to state for the record that Rimbo using some other person's program for making his picks is stupid and completely against the spirit of what we were doing here, which is just a bunch of guys making their best guesses.

God forbid you play by the rules, as informal as they are. Also, you win nothing. Robert is the unqualified winner, since you're a qualified winner (in that you didn't even make your own picks).

[Robert Sharp]

Bill's allegiance is now clear. I decree him the Prince of Picks, for his exemplary display in the final week of the season and his unswerving loyalty to the true ruler of this contest.

[caesarbear]

It's not like he made a secret of it. It was the Rimbot not, Rimbo. I for one welcome the electronic competition. We should also have a randomized picker.

[Sarkus]

Relying on software has it's drawbacks, as this weeks 8-8 record for "Rimbot" shows.

Plus, if Shmtur is to be believed, the contest isn't over. According to his response in last weeks thread, playoff picks count as well.

[Talisker]

====== week 17 computed results ======

1. Bill Dungsroman 15-1

2. Alan Dunkin 12-4
2. Cronox 12-4
2. Ryan A 12-4

5. Charlatan 11-5
5. contrarybear 11-5
5. Greedo 11-5
5. Robert Sharp 11-5
5. Sarkus 11-5

10. caesarbear 10-6
10. Kid Socrates 10-6
10. Mark Crump 10-6
10. Shmtur 10-6
10. Slainte Mhath 10-6
10. Squirrel Killer 10-6

16. balut 9-7
16. BennyProfane 9-7
16. BlueJackalope 9-7
16. Juan Rayo 9-7
16. sluggo 9-7

21. Contrai 8-8
21. Crispus 8-8
21. Jon_Danger 8-8
21. Nick Walter 8-8
21. Rimbo 8-8
21. SolomonGrundy 8-8

27. Troy S Goodfellow 7-9
27. Uncle Larry 7-9

29. Andrew Myers 6-10
29. Matt Perkins 6-10
29. Not One Of Us 6-10

32. BaconTastesGood 0-0
32. Cosmic Hippo 0-0
32. delirium 0-0
32. Desslock 0-0
32. ElGuapo 0-0
32. jeffd 0-0
32. Lorini 0-0
32. NatCox 0-0
32. Ryan Markel 0-0
32. shadarr 0-0
32. Supersport 0-0
32. Taranis 0-0
32. theKevin 0-0
32. TheRock 0-0
32. yurislave 0-0

[Talisker]

====== week 17 computed season totals ======

1. Rimbo 175-81 (68%)
1. Robert Sharp 175-81 (68%)

3. Sarkus 174-82 (68%)

4. Bill Dungsroman 171-85 (67%)

5. contrarybear 169-87 (66%)
5. Crispus 169-87 (66%)
5. Slainte Mhath 169-87 (66%)

8. caesarbear 168-88 (66%)

9. Andrew Myers 166-90 (65%)
9. Troy S Goodfellow 166-90 (65%)

11. Alan Dunkin 165-91 (64%)

12. Ryan A 163-93 (64%)

13. Kid Socrates 162-94 (63%)

14. Shmtur 161-95 (63%)

15. Desslock 157-83 (65%)

16. Charlatan 156-100 (61%)

17. BlueJackalope 155-101 (61%)

18. Matt Perkins 151-91 (62%)

19. sluggo 150-90 (63%)

20. Nick Walter 150-106 (59%)

21. Juan Rayo 149-107 (58%)

22. shadarr 146-94 (61%)

23. balut 146-96 (60%)

24. Squirrel Killer 143-97 (60%)

25. Cronox 140-54 (72%)

26. Uncle Larry 140-95 (60%)

27. SolomonGrundy 138-117 (54%)

28. Not One Of Us 137-119 (54%)

29. Greedo 136-88 (61%)

30. BennyProfane 133-74 (64%)

31. Mark Crump 120-74 (62%)

32. NatCox 120-90 (57%)

33. yurislave 114-110 (51%)

34. Contrai 110-130 (46%)

35. BaconTastesGood 91-69 (57%)

36. Lorini 90-56 (62%)

37. Taranis 86-60 (59%)

38. theKevin 55-39 (59%)

39. Ryan Markel 53-36 (60%)

40. delirium 43-30 (59%)
40. Supersport 43-30 (59%)

42. Jon_Danger 41-23 (64%)

43. TheRock 38-24 (61%)

44. ElGuapo 28-12 (70%)

45. jeffd 14-14 (50%)

46. Cosmic Hippo 11-19 (37%)

[Talisker]

Bill managed to vault from 11th to 4th with his 15-1 week, damn.

I, on the other hand, after starting the season strong, showed solidarity with the Lions by finishing with a 6-10 week.

[Bill Dungsroman]

Woohoo! Just shows you how close things are, when one good week can do that.

[Rimbo]

Now that the season is over, I'd like to state for the record that Rimbo using some other person's program for making his picks is stupid and completely against the spirit of what we were doing here, which is just a bunch of guys making their best guesses.

It is not "some other person's program." It is a program that I and Andrew Myers wrote together, using standard statistical analysis techniques that my brother helpfully taught me how to do. I wrote the statistical analysis part, the code that picks the winners, the silly and bogus "PowerRank" stuff, and the code that generates the web page (http://rimbosity.com/scores.html); and Myers wrote the part that grabs the statistics from nfl.com.

What's more, I made all of the information the program created available online on my own server and on my own dime for anyone who wished to look at the data and results to use as they saw fit. So it's not like I was keeping some ultra-secret weapon hidden. Quite the contrary, my hope was that others would find it useful and make better picks because of it. I even offered to allow others to download the code.

Also, to be perfectly precise, I wasn't relying on it 100% until about the 7th week of the season; for the first 4 weeks, I had no program (and its picks would have been worthless anyhow), and for the next 3, I only used it as an assistant. And I didn't even have the algorithm correct until (I think?) the 9th week.

I personally was pulling for Robert Sharp or Sarkus to win it all -- and for Tennessee to win, even if it meant me losing here. Woohoo! Playoff-bound, baby!

In conclusion, Bill, if you want to talk about violating the spirit of this competition, you being a whiny loser bitch AND NOT EVEN GETTING THAT RIGHT fits the bill perfectly.

[Shmtur]

Plus, if Shmtur is to be believed, the contest isn't over. According to his response in last weeks thread, playoff picks count as well.

Yep. The regular season does stand on its own; the playoffs are basically one form of tiebreaker. Which is to say, congratulations to Rimbo and Robert, but it's not over yet!

We can keep track of how people do in just the playoffs as well, for those who are curious; it wouldn't be that difficult to do. And we'll do a final tiebreaker along with the Super Bowl just in case we still have a tie at the end of that.

We'll do it in the Price is Right style. Guess how many total points will be scored during the game without going over. Closest wins.

[Bill Dungsroman]

It is not "some other person's program." It is a program that I and Andrew Myers wrote together, using standard statistical analysis techniques that my brother helpfully taught me how to do. I wrote the statistical analysis part, and Myers wrote the part that grabs the statistics from nfl.com.
I see two other people there, Chauncey. And at least one computer. You helped, super. It's still stupid.



What's more, I made all of the information the program created available online on my own server and on my own dime for anyone who wished to look at the data and results to use as they saw fit. So it's not like I was keeping some ultra-secret weapon hidden. Quite the contrary, my hope was that others would find it useful and make better picks because of it. I even offered to allow others to download the code.
Why? Why can't you or anyone else just make your picks using your own brain? Hey, let's all use it next season. That'll be fun.



Also, to be perfectly precise, I wasn't relying on it 100% until about the 7th week of the season; for the first 4 weeks, I had no program (and its picks would have been worthless anyhow), and for the next 3, I only used it as an assistant. And I didn't even have the algorithm correct until (I think?) the 9th week.
This is better how?



I personally was pulling for Robert Sharp to win it all -- and for Tennessee to win, even if it meant me losing here. Woohoo! Playoff-bound, baby!

In conclusion, Bill, if you want to talk about violating the spirit of this competition, you being a whiny loser bitch AND NOT EVEN GETTING THAT RIGHT fits the bill perfectly.
I placed fourth overall (third, really, disqualifying Rimbotics, Inc.) and smoked your Uni-Blab program this week, I'm not crying over anything. And I sure did get it right. But who cares, just don't bother saying "you" won. You, Myers, your brother and a computer tied with Sharp, who did it all on his own and deserves the props he gets.

[Not One Of Us]

====== week 17 computed results ======

29. Not One Of Us 6-10



====== week 17 computed season totals ======

28. Not One Of Us 137-119 (54%)

http://notoneofus.com/images/cardslose.jpg

[Bill Dungsroman]

Individual
Broken
Most Passing Touchdowns, Season, 50, Tom Brady, New England Patriots
Most Pass Completions, Season, 440, Drew Brees, New Orleans Saints
Most Rushing Yards Gained, Game, 296, Adrian Peterson, Minnesota Vikings vs. San Diego Chargers
Most Receiving Touchdowns, Season, 23, Randy Moss, New England Patriots
Most Consecutive Wins, Regular Season, 19, New England Patriots
Longest Kickoff Return, 108, Ellis Hobbs, New England Patriots vs. New York Jets
Most Kick Return Touchdowns, Season, 6, Devin Hester, Chicago Bears
Most Field Goals Made, Game, 8, Rob Bironas, Tennessee Titans vs. Houston Texans
Most Extra Points Attempted, Season, 74, Stephen Gostkowski, New England Patriots
Most Extra Points Made, Season, 74, Stephen Gostkowski, New England Patriots
Longest Play, 109 yards, Antonio Cromartie, missed field goal return, San Diego Chargers vs. Minnesota Vikings

Tied
Most Interceptions Returned for Touchdowns in a Game, 2, Antrel Rolle, Arizona Cardinals at Cincinnati Bengals
Punt Returns, Most Touchdowns, Season, 4, Devin Hester, Chicago Bears
Kickoff Returns, Most Touchdowns, Game, 2, Andre Davis, Houston Texans vs. Jacksonville Jaguars

Brett Farve
Most Pass Attempts, Career, 8,758
Most Pass Completions, Career, 5,377
Most Passing Touchdowns, Career, 442
Most Passing Interceptions, Career, 288
Most Passing Yards, Career, 61,655
Most Games, 300 Yards or More Passing, Career, 63

Team
Broken
Most Points, Season, 564, New England Patriots
Most Touchdowns, Season, 71, New England Patriots
Most Points, Fourth Quarter, 34, Detroit Lions vs Chicago Bears
Most Points, Both Teams, Fourth Quarter, 48, Detroit Lions (34) vs Chicago Bears(14)
Most Field Goals, Game, 8, Tennessee Titans vs Houston Texans

Tied
Most Field Goals Attempted, Game, 8, Tennessee Titans vs Houston Texans
Most Sacks, Game, 12, New York Giants vs Philadelphia Eagles
Most Losses, Season, 15, Miami Dolphins

not sure I got them all
Awesome stuff, caesarbear. Thanks.

I'll add:

Most players with 4,000+ passing yards in a single season: 7 (Brady, P. Manning, Romo, Palmer, Brees, Kitna, Favre). Hass needed 34 more yards.

[Rimbo]

You did fabulous this week, Bill, and no one can take that away from you. Good job.

Of course you beat the computer this week; most folks did. It's just basic statistical analysis. And unless you're picking through a fortune teller, a die roll or based on your favorite colors, you did the same thing to some extent every week, too, whether you used my input or not. I shared all of the results with the board in the hopes that everyone would be able to pick better because of it; I only used the statistics straight up for picks because it was clear to me that I could not pick better than their results. Clearly, few can; however, what e.g. Sarkus did this past week -- use the information as perfectly valid statistical input to his own picks -- is exactly the right idea.

And while you're listing all the people who wrote that software, why don't you throw in the folks who made BeautifulSoup, who made the library Myers made that helps to scrape the data off of NFL (and our picks for collection as well). Don't forget to include the makers of the Python interpreter and the inventors of the web. Add in all of the mathematicians from Euclid on who came up with the theory that produced modern statistical analysis, and the textbook authors and professors who taught my brother. Throw in the millions worldwide behind the fine Fedora 8 OS running on my server, the folks in Cupertino and China who made the computers themselves, the SD electric co., and my contributions are rather slim indeed!

There's no mystery here, and I produced everything up front (including the source code) in the spirit of sharing information and helping everyone to make better picks. Even former medical students who live in Las Vegas.

And if anyone would like that source code, along with results for each week (starting from when I had the HTML code done), I'm more than happy to share it. (http://rimbosity.com/nfl.zip)

[Sarkus]

Now that the season is over, I'd like to state for the record that Rimbo using some other person's program for making his picks is stupid and completely against the spirit of what we were doing here, which is just a bunch of guys making their best guesses.

God forbid you play by the rules, as informal as they are. Also, you win nothing. Robert is the unqualified winner, since you're a qualified winner (in that you didn't even make your own picks).

Seriously, though, why did you wait until now to voice this concern? It's not like Rimbo ever hid what he was doing. If you felt it was an issue you should have brought it up way back, and then we could have all come to a consensus over whether we thought it was ok. I'm not sure how I would have come down on the issue, but waiting until the end of the season and then saying you aren't going to accept the results is bad sportsmanship.

Being that this was my first time participating in this deal, I can definately say I don't recall seeing any "rules."

Besides, it's all for fun.

[Robert Sharp]

For the record, I liked going up against Rimbot. It was interesting to see how I (and others) stacked up against it. Since Rimbo never really claimed to be IN the competition as such, I didn't see anything unfair. In fact, I don't recall Rimbo ever claiming any credit for the picks at all (i.e. he never said "I did well this week."). It was always credited to the program, which was an exercise in seeing how statistics played out when picking NFL games.

BTW, Rimbo, would it be possible to retroactively see how the computer would have done against the spread? Picking games straight up is obviously a lot easier, and I'm just curious how the program would do as a gambling program (I'm not advocating anything here...just curious).

[Bill Dungsroman]

Seriously, though, why did you wait until now to voice this concern? It's not like Rimbo ever hid what he was doing. If you felt it was an issue you should have brought it up way back, and then we could have all come to a consensus over whether we thought it was ok. I'm not sure how I would have come down on the issue, but waiting until the end of the season and then saying you aren't going to accept the results is bad sportsmanship.
I never said that I'm not accepting "the results," I'm just not accepting his, and I don't why anyone would. What, I can't bring this up and talk about it? I waited until after the regular season was over on purpose, to avoid being called a bad sport, but whatever, God forbid I point something out or something. I'm also not very happy with Rimbo attempting to argue that his tally is all him and nothing else. it's not, and I don't see how I'm a bad sport for pointing it out.

Beyond that, I'm just pointing out that the leaderboard reads "Rimbo" when it's not really Rimbo. It's Rimbo for about 9 weeks, then a program he helped write. So his tally doesn't count, because his program came in late and he stopped making his own picks. I'm merely pointing it out, and if I was too harsh with my words originally then I apologize. In retrospect, it's not stupid he decided to see how the program did, it's fine. I'd just like to see the real results, and at least make it make some sense.



Being that this was my first time participating in this deal, I can definately say I don't recall seeing any "rules."
Poll everyone involved, I'm sure they'll all say they assumed it was a friendly Pick Em based on your own guesswork. We shouldn't have to have to post rules, because we're all presumably adults.



Besides, it's all for fun.
The tally that says "Rimbo" isn't really him. I'm not accusing him of cheating, I am aware he was upfront about using the program, it's just that his results aren't accurate for the reasons I stated. I guess you don't get it, even for the purpose it was meant - comparison between a program's picks and a group of humans' - it's useless because lumping its totals for the latter half of the season in with Rimbo's earlier human guesses makes the results useless. Hell, I myself wouldn't mind knowing what the actual results for week 10-17 or whatever the true date ranges are.

Lastly, I'm not sure why Rimbo decided to stop making his own picks and just go with his robot. I guess that's his idea of fun, I just don't know why we all can't play the same way in a friendly competition. I guess it annoys me because it reminded me of The Thing game, and how whoever had to write some stupid program to pick test subjects. I dunno, I guess it doesn't matter, obviously nobody really gives a shit.

[Robert Sharp]

Hmmm...I hadn't thought about that way, Bill, but I see your point now. It actually reminds me of something Rimbo offered to do earlier. Rimbo, could you test how the computer would have done had it been making the picks the whole season? You seemed to think the early picks wouldn't have been as good. Did you ever test that theory?

[jeffd]

Chiming in late here - but I got to go to the Pats@Giants game. It was absolutely phenomenal to be there in person. Probably 25% of the crowd was pro Patriots.

Let's get a playoffs thread up soon!

[Shmtur]

Let's get a playoffs thread up soon!

http://www.quartertothree.com/game-talk/showthread.php?t=41126

[Mark Crump]

I dunno. I see Bill's point, but since Rimbo started using the bot, has he actually claimed the bot's winning as his own? Sure it's got his name next them, but has be gloated about it?

I think most of us put an asterisk next to his name and think Robert "won."

[Rimbo]

For the record, I liked going up against Rimbot. It was interesting to see how I (and others) stacked up against it. Since Rimbo never really claimed to be IN the competition as such, I didn't see anything unfair. In fact, I don't recall Rimbo ever claiming any credit for the picks at all (i.e. he never said "I did well this week."). It was always credited to the program, which was an exercise in seeing how statistics played out when picking NFL games.

Well, not always. I sometimes forgot and took credit anyway. :)


BTW, Rimbo, would it be possible to retroactively see how the computer would have done against the spread? Picking games straight up is obviously a lot easier, and I'm just curious how the program would do as a gambling program (I'm not advocating anything here...just curious).

You're way ahead of me. :) I actually started another project with some friends in my spare time so my time to hack away at this has become sorely limited. But it's something I want to do. Of course, since others can download the source (http://rimbosity.com/nfl.zip)... if someone else wants to dig in and figure that out, by all means do... just please share! (And, of course, since the code is licensed under the GPL, you're REQUIRED to share...;) )


You seemed to think the early picks wouldn't have been as good. Did you ever test that theory?

Oh, there's no question they wouldn't have been as good. Since it's a statistical calculation, the more data points you have, the more accurate things are likely to be. The first two weeks are the biggest problem; it requires at least two weeks' worth of information in order to make -a- prediction, much less an accurate one; you need at least one game to produce points scored per game and allowed per game, and a second one in order to produce some kind of variance in the average, although the calculations can proceed somewhat without that data (just give everybody 1.00 for the first week). But for the first week, some kind of rule of thumb has to be used (e.g., "use data from the preseason") that makes sense, and really, anything like that is going to effectively change the algorithm.

If the first week could be figured out (or even discarded -- call it 0-0), it wouldn't be too much effort to write some extra code to come up with Rimbot-only results.

It's important to remember that the predicted scores are merely the amount of points you'd statistically expect a team to score against its competition; this isn't some magic algorithm, and it's not even accurate to say my brother and I invented it; we invented it in the same way that Vanguard invented the S&P 500 index.

And that's actually what's going on here -- it's index fund investing vs. managed fund investing. While one individual would usually do better than the statistically expected result over time, and while one or two weeks most would do better than the statistically expected results, over a long period of time, few are able to pick better than the statistically expected result.

What I was hoping people would do, as the results proved to be decent, was to make use of the data being generated and apply their own brain power and guesswork on top of that to make their picks week-to-week. That's a luxury you have here that you don't usually have with mutual fund investing.

I just happened to become a straight-line index fund investor for the NFL pickings, just as I am with my IRA, because I realized in this case as in that one that I wasn't picking better than the baseline.

[Rimbo]

I think most of us put an asterisk next to his name and think Robert "won."

Yes, including me.

I didn't "win" any more than I get to keep money I make by investing in an index fund. ;)

[Coca Cola Zero]

Yeah the thing about Rimbot is that it wasn't like it is some super smart alien computer. Rather than asterixing Rimbot's win, you should all be hanging your head in shame to have been beaten by it (only if you took the contest seriously at all, of course).

A truly objective human who just made solid picks with no emotional attachments likely would have beat the Rimbot easily if only because it is likely to have done much better in the early season. Just look at all the doofusheads making anti-Patriots picks, picking the likes of the Jets to win, etc. Of course these people are going to get beat by a stats-based AI.

[Rimbo]

Yeah the thing about Rimbot is that it wasn't like it is some super smart alien computer. Rather than asterixing Rimbot's win, you should all be hanging your head in shame to have been beaten by it (only if you took the contest seriously at all, of course).

A truly objective human who just made solid picks with no emotional attachments likely would have beat the Rimbot easily if only because it is likely to have done much better in the early season. Just look at all the doofusheads making anti-Patriots picks, picking the likes of the Jets to win, etc. Of course these people are going to get beat by a stats-based AI.

It's not even accurate to call it an AI -- not even trivially. It's just statistics. Which is even more insulting: No one did better than picking against the straight-line statistically expected result. Even with index investing, you expect at least 5% of the mutual funds to outperform it over a long enough period of time. And using a strategy of selective index fund investing, you'd hope that even more would do better.

[Jon Rowe]

Did you hear that?

That was the sound of a million cleveland browns fans crying out in anguish.

[Rimbo]

Did you hear that?

That was the sound of a million cleveland browns fans crying out in anguish.

:D :D :D

[Robert Sharp]

Why would anyone feel bad about not beating a stats analysis though? The computer picked as a person who had no emotions SHOULD pick, right? In other words, if everyone did the same thing, they would not have beaten the computer at all. We would have all tied it.

[Sarkus]

Did you hear that?

That was the sound of a million cleveland browns fans crying out in anguish.

I wish the Browns had made it, but they have no one but themselves to blame.

[Rimbo]

The computer picked as a person who had no emotions SHOULD pick, right?

Well, you're certainly correct that the computer is emotionless; however, this is not the way a person with no emotions should pick. The statistics calculated aren't any more "the way one should pick" than S&P 500 Index Fund Investing is "the way one should invest." Everyone has rules of thumb that they apply that others might not, and the these can't necessarily be expressed mathematically, but they are not based on emotions or "gut feelings" either and might be perfectly valid.

A great example is the Colts-Titans game last night; the computer had no way to adjust for the fact that the Colts weren't going to play their starters and the Titans needed to win, and when it comes right down to it, it'd take a whopping amount of research to determine the proper amount of points (if any) to assign to adjust each team's scores appropriately. I'm not terribly motivated to research it, either, because my gut feeling is that "needing to win" has no measurable point value, and "playing the second stringers" is almost always going to have too few points of data (partial games, preseason games, even partial plays) to be accurate for this kind of calculation.

So that's a perfect example of where one would pick the Titans. To be perfectly accurate, it is a case where an emotionless observer would not expect the scores of the game to agree with the statistically expected scores, primarily due to the lack of data for the Colts' second-team's performance.

The problem is, when we say "The Computer" or "The Rimbot," it is a shorthand for "calculating the statistically expected amount of points teams will score based on their past performances and the strength of their competition." It's not completely accurate or fair to say that these are the expected scores according to the Rimbot, because it's just a standard statistical analysis technique. The data isn't special or anything. But it's less of a mouthful than saying things properly.

[Alan Dunkin]

Eh, professional gamblers build and rely upon their own programs to determine outcomes for spread winners and game totals all the time, so competing against one is nothing new to me. Did I think I could beat Rimbot? Sure. Did I? Not really. Am I mad? Sure.

--- Alan