So SOE wants me to try EQ2

[The Bitter Cynic]

After the MMO burnout thread, I get a post card from SOE saying come play for a couple weeks.

<sigh> I've never really played EQ2 (comp wasnt ballsy enough, is now), and really know nothing of it.

I've been SupCom'ing it, and the Quake Wars demo. I don't have an xbox 360 so no halo whatever.

Ok, enough of my old man blathering and straight to the point.

Is EQ2 different enough from WoW, LotRO, CoH ect ect ect to be fun? Or is it just more of the same, grind grind grind?

[Marcus]

Or is it just more of the same, grind grind grind?

Pretty much.

[IkeVandergraaf]

Well, it's more of the same grind, grind, grind. Personally, I loved it and prefer it to WoW. If you played EQ1 and loved it, it definitely has a Norrath-y feel. Every once in a while I'll get a wild hair and feel like playing an MMO again, and EQ2 is my go-to. But yeah, it's got an old-school grind design.

[malkav11]

It looked like it cleaned up a lot of the more player-unfriendly mechanics and moved to a more quest-centric design (somewhat similar to WoW). I've got the CDs sitting on my shelf waiting to actually try it one of these days. I didn't like EQ1 at all, but maybe this one...

[stusser]

It's more of the same. At this point it's pretty polished, particularly the new newbie experience, although obviously it can't hold a candle to WoW.

[The Bitter Cynic]

...although obviously it can't hold a candle to WoW.

Why is that?

[Marcus]

Why is that?

Well I can say that it doesnt have the Magic Fariy dust that wow has but I can say that the world really feels lifeless. I dont know exactly what it is but the world does not feel alive.

I also hate the graphic engine they use and I think its crap.

[StGabe]

I personally prefer the class mix, crafting and content of EQ2 and it kept me going a lot longer than WoW.

They suffered pretty harshly from post-EQ, post-SWG hate and from a rushed launch. Just a few months after launch they actually had a pretty polished game going and they have been adding content like crazy ever since. They're turn around time for patches and content is at least 5 times quicker than Blizzard which is nice.

All the same, as an MMO-burnout, it eventually did get old.

[Sneaky]

In EQ2's combat you often end up simply chaining one ability after the other, non stop. Many DPS classes have like 2+ bars full of hotkeys that get mashed as soon as the cooldown is up, no if's and buts, no decisions to make, in addition to several marginal combat buff, items to click, and a few very situational defensive abilities, etc.

I think the best description about EQ2's overabundance of combat-abilities I heared so far was that you basicly play "whack a mole" with 20 buttons.

I played a Defiler to 66 and healing isn't challenging at all, too. Either the fights are so easy you can basicly play eyes closed, once you got the chain of spells to cast down, or the fights are so hard that the only real option is to evac out, not much you can do to change the outcome. There's rarely a situation in between.

Tanking can be frantic, depending on which class you chose, but in the end it comes down to lots of button mashing, too, maybe with some target-switching thrown in (66 Bruiser). Not challenging or even interesting, tedious.

Other than the combat system the game is actually looking pretty good, imho, but sadly combat is the most important part - to me anyways.

[Skipper]

*Insert Admiral Ackbar "It's a Trap!" pic*

If you've already pulled yourself free from the MMO grind, trust me, at some point WoW, EQ2 and the rest of them boil down to that same grind, grind, grind.

If, however, you can round up some friends to do it with you who hang out each night and chat online about life and gaming, it becomes a pretty cool place indeed. I don't see where EQ2 would be any different than the others for that, if the graphics and class design suit you.

[Kunikos]

It's 3D doll chat. ;)

[stusser]

Try it, it's free. Just make sure you start off in one of the two new newbie zones.

[The Bitter Cynic]

If I've never played before, wouldn't all the newb zones be new to me?

[stusser]

Yes, but the old ones suck and the new ones are comparable to WoW. You want to start off in faydark or neriak.

[Marcin]

Why is that?

WoW learned a lot from EQ2 regarding combat mechanics. The 20 ability whackamole has already been addressed above, but there's also the fact that all the combat abilities have HUGE animations that totally obscure the thing that you're fighting. While briefly neat (ooo shiny!), all too soon you realize that any group tactics are going to devolve into, well, grouped 20 button whackamole. Oh yes, it's out-of-sync with your actions, too - your own and your enemy's health just sort of goes up and down regardless of what you're doing. It's amazing how much the fact that your own WHACK makes the enemy's health decrease improves immersion in WoW.

If you're familiar with Elites in WoW, you'll dig Elite Elites, Elite Elite Elites and of course one mustn't forget Elite Elite Elite Elites ... which will utterly annihilate you at even -5 levels - and should you somehow prevail you'll get no XP since they're too low ... and they roam, too. Not just dungeons.

I actually dug the world and the hugeness of it, and shared dungeons were neat for getting impromptu dungeonhackish groups, and rather enjoyed the plentiful insta-travel and free griffons (that you can jump off of in midflight, no less!) but the combat experience felt very inferior.

Still, free.

Edit: Seconded with Faydark. Gliding is surprisingly entertaining.

Edit edit: my experience is up to 30, PvE only and WoW 40, PvE only. (Disclaimer)

[The Bitter Cynic]

Oh lord, I just thought of something.

I don't have to go through that "Island" do I?

That's my exposure to EQ2, that damn tutorial island, hated it.

[Marcin]

Oh lord, I just thought of something.

I don't have to go through that "Island" do I?

That's my exposure to EQ2, that damn tutorial island, hated it.

You can go straight to the boat captain and leave it. It's an easy 5-6 levels though.

[Athryn]

Sadly, I loved the newbie island the most out of EQ2 :p

[TheWombat]

No, the island is no more. You start at level 1 in your city of choice. I recommend Faydark or Neriak, though they've substantially revamped the Antonica/Commonlands lowbie experience for folks starting in Qeynos or Freeport.

My opinions of the game are heavily slanted because I only play on the PvP servers (Venekor, where I have a 70 Warlock among other Q-side characters, and Nagafen, where I'm currently leveling a Fury and a Necro among others; Vox is the Exchange-enable server with apparently a relatively low population). I played PvE on Antonia Bayle at launch and got to about 50 on a Conjuror before jumping ship to Venekor. Haven't played much on Venekor lately as the guild I was in sort of imploded, yada yada yada.

Anyhow, I've also done a lot of WoW, where I have a 70 Mage and a 48 or so Druid Horde side on a PvP server, among a bunch of other toons. I agree WoW is slicker, more colorful, and generally has a better UI and overal user-friendly design. I disagree heartily however with those who say WoW's combat system is substantially better than EQ2's. I think WoW has a more visceral system, and yeah, the link between your action and its effect is very nicely done. But EQ2 is a lot more than whack-a-mole I think. For some characters, main tanks in particular, the gameplay can be rather intricate, and for casters (my main interest) I find there's actually more to do and more interesting things to do than in WoW. Opinion, certainly, but I do think one should check it out for themselves if they get the chance.

Now, admittedly, I only play on PvP servers and for all of their issues I still think Venekor and Nagafen's PvP is lightyears better than anything I experienced in WoW since Battlegrounds came in long ago. I admit, I like ganking and having to watch out for being ganked. Leveling in EQ2 PvP can be tortuous, with all the twinks and gank squads camping each side's newbie areas. You're a target from level 10 on, anywhere outside of a city, though there are level range protections from four to maybe a dozen levels before it becomes unlimited. You drop a portion of your money, you can drop minor items/equipment if they're not bound to you, and you gain and lose fame/infamy as well as tokens at higher levels, all of which along with status from killing enemies translates ultimately into PvP gear and items. It's all world PvP, too, so at the high levels it means fighting your raid through the enemy raids to get to where you're, um, raiding.

At least, it can be that good, though often it doesn't live up to that level of fun. Group PvP is very fun, and really makes use of a wide variety of classes. The downside is many of the classes can't solo worth squat (clothies in particular; though some are very good PvE solo in PvP it's much tougher), and there's the usual plague of stealthers you often find in these sorts of games. But EQ2 does give you equalizers (well, except for clothies, sniff sniff) in the form of items allowing you to see stealthers, etc.

I ramble. But I do think folks who dismiss EQ2 out of hand are missing out on a reasonably good take on the standard MMO paradigm. PvE is quite decent, and I actually like the relative paucity of faction grinds in EQ2. Yeah, I'd agree that the leveling game is probably more fun in WoW if you're really into just PvE. But if you want PvP I'd heartily recommend EQ2's Venekor or Nagafen servers, just to give it a shot.

[Warning]

I tried both of the sides in EQ2 and hated both of the big cities (Freeport and Qeynos). I wandered around and around always feeling frustrated trying to find something. I did like the island a lot but after that it went quickly downhill for me.

[The Bitter Cynic]

Well, nice info from all, and I think I'll try it.

Free is free after all.

May love it, might hate it.

It's this whole patching BS, lol, gonna be awhile.

[McBain]

DON'T DO IT

[Marcin]

We'll want a full report.

[Ryan A]

No, the island is no more. You start at level 1 in your city of choice.

This isn't true. If you choose Qeynos as your starting city, you go to the Qeynos-aligned newbie island If you choose Freeport as your starting city, you go to the Freeport-aligned newbie island. You only get to start out on the same landmass as your starting city if you choose Feydark or Neriak as starting cities.

Also, in response to the OP, I played for about a month at the tail end of this past summer. I don't know if it was more that I didn't have time to play this month that led me to cancel or the realization that, despite the greater variety of classes and more mature player population (compared to WoW) this really is just the same old MMO treadmill that can't hold my attention. At least not as a solo player.

I really really enjoy MMO play when I'm playing with friends (or even "friends" as in folks from Qt3) but just can't get as interested when I'm playing with people I meet in-game.

[Euri]

At least patching in EQ2 is easier than WoW. Blizzard has the most retarded patching system of all time.

[The Bitter Cynic]

Well, all installed.

Made a character.

Yup, same old, same old.

Seen it, done it, still burned out on MMOs

Has a nice look though. Too bad it just the same grind, quest, grind, level-up!, stuff.

and yes, the patch actually went rather quickly in the end.

I'll probably play it some more, as it is a bit different (looks mostly) and who knows, maybe it'll grab me.

[Ryan A]

Has a nice look though. Too bad it just the same grind, quest, grind, level-up!, stuff.


In fairness, it's only grind if questing feels like grind to you. Traditional grinding is less efficient for levelling up compared to questing.

[The Bitter Cynic]

Questing feels like grinding lately.

Kill X to collect Y come back and receive Z.

I'm not saying it's awful, I'm just so tired of it.

That's why I'm playing SupCom DoW and some online casual games.

[LionelThompson]

Last time the game came up, I was a huge advocate of it, and although I haven't played in some time, I still feel strongly about it. The mix of races and classes which all are relatively unique (the good and evil of the same class are similar). The variety of terrain and mobs is wonderful, epsecially the giants of the land. The collectibles and crafting were a big plus for me too.

Of course as you see the grind will always be there, although questing helps a lot, and the art isn't for everyone, AND my biggest problem with the game was zoning, but if you can look past that and you are still into MMORPGs, EQ2 is tops along with LOTRO.

[Mordrak]

Questing feels like grinding lately.

Kill X to collect Y come back and receive Z.

I'm not saying it's awful, I'm just so tired of it.

That's why I'm playing SupCom DoW and some online casual games.
This is part of the reason I enjoy Guild Wars. Once I hit 20, I was playing for the story, or picking up skills or heroes. It's less compelling (as in I must level now!), but once I got used to the idea that I don't have to be playing all the time, my enjoyment increased a lot. Plus, xp, money, and items aren't everything.

MMOs need more alternate reward systems and mini-games to break up what is otherwise rather predictable and monotonous gameplay. That's what makes the BGs (even though i only pugged) and arena systems in wow are interesting. Even though I'm not too impressed with the aesthetics of Warhammer Online, a new take on PVP intrigues me. However, GW has moved away from easing players into PvP, realizing that they can't turn people into PvPers. I wonder is WAR will be anymore successful at that.

I read recently that EQ2's card game is really popular, selling a bunch of boxes in game and touting that 30% of the players are buying packs and playing it. That's a pretty large number. They are even going so far as to introduce new areas in the game where players just play that.

[SlyFrog]

I like Everquest 2 much more than WoW at this point. The game feels like it has more depth; more differentiation between the characters, a crafting system where you can make something that people will actually use before you hit level 300 (or whatever the hell it is after Burning Crusade), and important for me, less of the feeling like I'm in cartoon world.

Yes, I know I'm sick, I prefer the art in EQ2 to WoW. I even think the character models look better on average. Well, to be fair, I think EQ2 tries to do more (and generally succeeds) with its character models than WoW does.

[Jackstar]

It's a trick. Get an axe.

[TheWombat]

This isn't true. If you choose Qeynos as your starting city, you go to the Qeynos-aligned newbie island If you choose Freeport as your starting city, you go to the Freeport-aligned newbie island. You only get to start out on the same landmass as your starting city if you choose Feydark or Neriak as starting cities.


Forgot about that, you're right. I haven't started a character outside of Kelethin or Neriak in ages.

But the island takes like, what, an hour at most?

[Mordrak]

Yes, I know I'm sick, I prefer the art in EQ2 to WoW. I even think the character models look better on average. Well, to be fair, I think EQ2 tries to do more (and generally succeeds) with its character models than WoW does.

This is one of the reasons I'm interested in Age of Conan. I like the gritty feel of the game. Actually, I like the idea of it, whether AoC pulls it off or not, I don't know.

[Jim Hoffman]

I like Everquest 2 much more than WoW at this point. The game feels like it has more depth; more differentiation between the characters, a crafting system where you can make something that people will actually use before you hit level 300 (or whatever the hell it is after Burning Crusade), and important for me, less of the feeling like I'm in cartoon world.

Yes, I know I'm sick, I prefer the art in EQ2 to WoW. I even think the character models look better on average. Well, to be fair, I think EQ2 tries to do more (and generally succeeds) with its character models than WoW does.

Do you use the alternate (made for Asian audience) character models, or the original?

[Jim Hoffman]

I think the purpose of this free trial is to introduce people to the new collectible card game w/in the EQ(2) games. (Also has a stand-alone client).
An interesting idea.. I wonder if it was successful enough, would they offer the EQ games for free?
I've signed back on for a free month w/ my old characters, hadn't played in about a year.
I'm feeling like there's plenty to do besides combat, what with all the different harvesting and crafting skills. And I never fully explored Faydark before, so I'm getting into that as well.
I like having my own apartment, and decking it out. I like improving harvesting skills so that I can sell good harvest stuff to finance my furniture buying.
I've been meaning to try out the card game, i think i got as far as tutorial part I. When I get bored of the main game, I'll look into the card game further.

[John Sansker]

You never learn do you?

SOE=teh evil!!!!!1!!!!!11!!

[SlyFrog]

Do you use the alternate (made for Asian audience) character models, or the original?

Alternate (I think, it has been a long time since I've played with the settings).

[Lee Johnson]

Echoes of Faydwer is arguably EQ2's best expansion to date. I had a lot of fun in the Fae zones last year. I haven't played much EQ2 this year because FFXI and WoW have soaked up most of my time, but I want to take a look at the card game before my trial time runs out.

There's also the Rise of Kunark expansion coming mid-November. My Fury was a bit peeved that Karana wasn't one of the pantheon that returned in EoF, but apparently Ol' Stormy is returning in RoK. I may have to start playing again. ;)

[Jim Hoffman]

I just discovered Neriak (when did THAT get in there?! ) and started an Ogre Beserker. I'm getting frustrated trying to find my way around Neriak when I've already learned Kelethin and Qeynos. And Freeport to a lesser degree.
But overall, a lot of fun.

[TheWombat]

I just discovered Neriak (when did THAT get in there?! ) and started an Ogre Beserker. I'm getting frustrated trying to find my way around Neriak when I've already learned Kelethin and Qeynos. And Freeport to a lesser degree.
But overall, a lot of fun.

Soon as you finish the Dark Bargainer's quest in Neriak, you can use the teleporters; makes it a lot less annoying.

[John Reynolds]

Just got a 3x5 card in the mail saying my old account was reactivated until Nov 4th. Gonna have to reinstall the game and give it a whirl, see where I left my 70 gnome illusionist.

[VegasRobb]

The next expansion, Ruins of Kunark is about a month away. Playable Sarnaks.

I've played both and enjoy EQ2 much more. Raiding is really well done and varied. There's plenty of content for guilds to check out. There are contested mobs for guilds who enjoy racing or challenging other guilds for fun and entertainment. Soloing is really really well done now. You could choose to level 2 or 3 characters all the way to 70 solo without reusing the same zone(s) / content. There are tons of dungeons/instances for groups, soloers, and small parties. The amount of content in EQ2 is pretty awesome.

I sorta understand how the combat system can be seen as "whack-a-mole" but there's really a lot going on there. There's a nice ebb and flow to combat ... almost like a frantic dance of death.

[malkav11]

Wait...the next EQ2 expansion is going to be the first expansion from EQ1? ;)

[LionelThompson]

Having learned about the card game, I resubbed to EQ2 for the free starter pack that is included, as well as to try to get my 65 Conjuror to 70 before November 13th.

The game is still as fun as I remember from 9 months ago and the card game is very well done too. I dropped $30 into the card game for 10 packs, plus I looted a pack from a chest over the weekend. A nice feature is that it has single player skirmishes in it so that you can test your deck against a reasonably strong AI. In addition, they have 15 scenarios and when each is completed you receive a new promo card. The game can be played from the EQ2 client and you can challenge other players that are in sight while you play EQ2.

I know SOE is evil, especially be releasing the CCG, but I have to confess that the two mesh well except for the fact that there is never enough time for both of them.

[Merakon]

Hey Lionel (or should I call you TommyTutone from our Sanctum days :), glad you are enjoying the card game.

If anyone is not an EQ/EQII player and wants to check out the Legends of Norrath card game, you can play it as a standalone game (http://legendsofnorrath.station.sony.com/).

For the next few days, I can also give QT3 folks free starter decks and access to the single-player campaign. Just send me a pm with your SOE Station name and I'll set you up.

[LionelThompson]

Hey Lionel (or should I call you TommyTutone from our Sanctum days :), glad you are enjoying the card game.

If anyone is not an EQ/EQII player and wants to check out the Legends of Norrath card game, you can play it as a standalone game (http://legendsofnorrath.station.sony.com/).

For the next few days, I can also give QT3 folks free starter decks and access to the single-player campaign. Just send me a pm with your SOE Station name and I'll set you up.

Oh holy cow, I didn't know you were involved with this! I am very much impressed with the work done on the CCG. The mechanics are refreshing and I am really enjoying it. Three things that you probably already know:

1 - Scenario 14 is a killer. I got past it after reading other strategies, but yikes

2 - Quests are such a critical component of the game, but the players only need 1 of each. Making them uncommon is a good touch, but after buying 14 packs, plus looting 1 pack, I still don't have enough fighter/neutral quests to make a fighter deck. I'd love to see some way to be able to exchange quests on a 1 for 1 basis.

3 - Send me free stuff, I'm BobLoblaw in the CCG ;)

Congrats again on an amazing game.

[Caya]

Add one more voice to the choir that EQ2 is an amazingly fun game. My husband almost literally dragged me into it while I was uttering vile curses about the evil that is Sony, and yet I found it fun enough to play every now and again for more than a year now. It must have been a veritable PITA at the beginning, but they've really cleared up the act. You should at least make a fae of your alignment of choice and take him or her up to ten for a gliding spree. You're missing out if you don't :).

[MythicalMino]

my station name is MythicalMino for free starter decks if I can get them.

I have gotten back into the game also just recently (the postcard deal).


Chris