Fuck Blockbuster (my very first "Fuck _____" thread!)

[RobotPants]

So, despite being a member for as long as I've been able to drive and having spent thousands and thousands of dollars renting games and movies, I have to sever my relationship with them. I've always been a 'rent first' type of guy when it comes to games and I've done quite a bit of that, especially since the 360 came out.

Now, over a year after I rented the first 360 game from Blockbuster, they tell me they can't do it because I have no credit card. I've used my Visa check card, which for all intents and purposes is a credit card, since forever but it's suddenly against their policy. The clerk's reasoning was that since they preauthorize the card and charge you for the price of the game if it's kept 30 days past its due date, it would fall back on them if someone didn't have the money in their bank account and they went overdraft. But I just don't buy it.

I don't know how all banks work, but if a charge is made to my card and I don't have enough money in the account to cover it, the money still gets subtracted and goes to whomever is making the charge. My bank then just makes me pay a fee and obviously I have to get back into the positive in my account within a certain time frame to prevent further fees. But that's all pretty much on me, right? Why in the hell would it affect Blockbuster in the least?

When told that they've kept my Visa check card on file the entire time I've been renting 360 games, the clerk's response was "They shouldn't have done that." Um, so? Pull up my fucking account and you'll see that I've never kept a game long enough for it to be an issue. Check card or credit card, you dummies will get my money regardless if I decide not to bring something back, so what's the problem?

[Gaming-Module]

A lot of rental places are doing this. Sadly, with a sagging economy comes increased theft. Couple that with the unprecedented popularity of video games and, well, you get the idea.

My local video store has this one street walker looking guy come in, looking like he's fresh from the streets of Detroit, every weekend trying to make an account and rent things without even a driver's license. Thieves are stupid and persistent like that.

I'm sure if he did get a game it would be sold at an EBStop within the hour.

[RobotPants]

But they only do it on 360 and PS3 games. Not any of the others. Their reason for that was "These next-gen games are more expensive". Either way, they get the money regardless of whether or not it's in my bank account. It's no different than it's been since the beginning of video rental places. They'd rather lose my business than risk me keeping a $60 game? I was sort of put off when they first asked to keep my card on file when they started renting out 360 games, but I did it anyway. Now it's not even an option. I'll likely never have another credit card in my lifetime so I guess the only thing left to do is join Gamefly and wait a week or two between games.

[Enduro_Man]

I'm not familiar with Visa Check cards specifically, but for debit cards in general, whether an insufficient funds payment goes through depends on the terms of your checking account's overdraft facility. If you don't have one, the payment is bounced and you get dinged an NSF fee. Mind you, I haven't worked the retail side of banking in several years, so I don't know what the prevailing trends are (My wild guess: Fees are bigger!).

Just to play the devil's advocate, it's possible that the dum-dums at your Blockbuster couldn't tell the difference between a credit and debit card, saw the 'Visa' logo and logged it in. New manager probably came in, freaked out over this blatant violation of company policy, and told the employees to shape up. This is pure speculation, of course.

[nutsak]

It purely depends on the bank. The only difference between a Visa debit card and Visa credit card is the credit card is the banks money. If there's no money in either then you're going to be lucky for the bank to pay for you.
To see if your payment will be processed or not depends on how you use the account. If there's enough funds frequently going into the account that covers whatever you're going to take out the system will go "no worries" and charge you whatever fee applies to overdrawing. At the end of the day being debit or credit means fuck all to the store you're buying from. They either get the money or they don't. Go back and tell the clerk to tell his higher ups that the process is poorly thought out and needs to be reconsidered.

[stusser]

Yeah, cause that'll work.

Just get a creditcard. You need one to build your credit score anyway. Just pay the balance every month, nothing to be frightened of.

[nutsak]

You don't need one to build your credit score and I was being partially facetious. My point was that the guy at the store was wrong.

[JPR]

What the guy meant was that people who get items unexpectedly charged to their debit card come to Blockbuster complaining about overdraft fees, not that Blockbuster would be legally liable for them. My wife was, until pretty recently, a manager at Blockbuster. Shortly before she quit they were having a renewed push to get all the debit cards off the books. She regularly came home complaining about people's reactions to enforcement of the existing policy. She worked at a franchise store, though, not a corporate one.

[Funkula]

Here's my "Fuck Blockbuster" story.

I went in with a couple friends and decided I should get a card. The application took long enough to fill out that someone who already had a card went ahead and got the movies. So I ended up going home without even touching my card yet.

Couple weeks or a month later, I start getting harassing phone calls about the movies that I haven't returned. All I can figure is that some asshole employee decided to steal movies and pin it on me. I would have been less insulted if it hadn't been crap like Save the Last Dance. I eventually managed to talk it around with them such that I wouldn't have to pay the several hundred dollars replacing the tapes would have cost, but I would never be able to open an account there again.

So yeah. Netflix is cool.

[ryan]

I had/am having a problem with Blockbuster. I signed up at a location in Baton Rouge after having had a Blockbuster Online account for a while, so I could exchange online rentals for in-store rentals and use my coupons. After being billed twice two months in a row, I called customer service and found out that the employee who signed me up at the store took my information, made up a fake email address, and created an Online account for whomever.

The store, from what I could tell, took it seriously. I called customer service again to make sure I wasn't being billed, but the person I got this time told me that my problem wasn't serious enough to warrant a supervisor because "They're off, you know, taking care of important things ... things worth their time." I also found out that the first person I talked to actually made the note for the account saying it was my fault I had a billing problem because I didn't do some promotion right.

I'm now awaiting my credit card bill, prepared to continue slamming my head against the wall.

[XtienMurawski]

Maybe this isn't the point, but, what is your problem with credit cards? You have this weird, cryptic quote:

I'll likely never have another credit card in my lifetime...

But no explanation as to what that means. Are you too old for credit cards? Do you not believe in them? The word "another" implies that you already have one, or at one time had one...did you get burned?

I'm no friend of Blockbuster--I quit renting from them years ago thanks to Netflix...and Christianity--but if you like being a Blockbuster customer, and their policy is to use your credit card number, why not just give them your credit card number? And, if you don't believe in credit cards...why not? Won't you need one anyway if you want to sign up for Gamefly?

I'm just curious.

Oh...and Netflix rocks.

"Seriously...have you ever talked to a woman without having to give your credit card number?"

-Amanpour

[Bullhajj]

Good work on your first Fuck "_____" thread. Here's to many more in the future!

[Enduro_Man]

RobotPants: You're not alone. (http://www.planetfeedback.com/index.php?level2=blog_viewpost&topic_id=297428&reply_id=109539#anchor109539)

In these cases, whether the staff are wrong or the processes are ill-conceived is irrelevant. It's the company policy, and that will trump common sense and good customer service almost every time.

ryan: In my experience (not with Blockbuster, specifically), I've gotten better results by sending a letter -a real letter, on paper- to the customer service managers. Telephone calls can be shuffled endlessly, and emails can stay unread and forgotten, but there's something about a filed letter that spurs folks into action.

[extarbags]

They can't verify the level of overdraft protection on your checking account. You could very well be giving them a card that's tied to an account that's overdrawn and that won't go through if they try to bill it for the games you skipped town with.

[Enduro_Man]

They can't verify the level of overdraft protection on your checking account. You could very well be giving them a card that's tied to an account that's overdrawn and that won't go through if they try to bill it for the games you skipped town with.

"Suspect apprehended with the following items in his possession: Wig, mallet, diapers, Daisy air rifle, Crackdown, and Resistance: Fall of Man."

"...and I would've gotten away with it, too, if it weren't fer those meddlin' Blockbuster kids!"

[Matt Perkins]

I had/am having a problem with Blockbuster. I signed up at a location in Baton Rouge after having had a Blockbuster Online account for a while, so I could exchange online rentals for in-store rentals and use my coupons. After being billed twice two months in a row, I called customer service and found out that the employee who signed me up at the store took my information, made up a fake email address, and created an Online account for whomever.

The store, from what I could tell, took it seriously. I called customer service again to make sure I wasn't being billed, but the person I got this time told me that my problem wasn't serious enough to warrant a supervisor because "They're off, you know, taking care of important things ... things worth their time." I also found out that the first person I talked to actually made the note for the account saying it was my fault I had a billing problem because I didn't do some promotion right.

I'm now awaiting my credit card bill, prepared to continue slamming my head against the wall.
ryan

This is a load of shit on their part. You can block any charges they try to make and or challenge anything that you know isn't right. Visa will side with you.

And to get it fixed, call back up and say you need to talk to a supervisor and after asking for their name. If they say no, explain that when you call back and get the next schmoe that doesn't have a problem transferring them to a supervisor, you'll have no problem telling them their name. And in most places, your local news channel LOVES to cover bullshit like this. Don't hesitate to escalate the situation at every single point they try to rebuff you.

If need be, go down to the store and raise a stink in person. In any large corporation, the whiny wheel gets the grease. Sometimes you just have to push/whine a bit more to get ot the right people that just want to make the situation go away.

[Ben Sones]

Our check card will put through any payment that goes over our balance, but only because we have a $500 overdraft account. Without that, overdrafts would just be bounced.

[Reldan]

My check card has a $5,000 overdraft account, but there's no way for a chain like Blockbuster to know that, and no way for them to know whether a charge made on my check card will bounce.

A check card looks like a credit card, but it simply is not. A check card is only good for pulling money from an account - a credit card pushes debt onto an account. Often this is transparent to a consumer because the mechanism for using these tools is the same. At the bottom line, however, it's a world of difference.

I can't fault Blockbuster on this one. If the payment bounces they're stuck eatting it - with a credit card they don't have to take that risk. A policy decision like this one - which they know could very well turn away some customers - isn't made lightly. They must be getting burned to the point that they're saying, "Enough is enough."

[RickH]

I'll likely never have another credit card in my lifetime so I guess the only thing left to do is join Gamefly and wait a week or two between games.

Good luck renting a car or reserving a hotel room, too. Doing business with cash is problematic if you're essentially asking businesses to trust you by loaning you stuff more valuable than the transaction cost.

If it's credit you're opposed to, have you considered getting an American Express card?

[Lunch of Kong]

Er, isn't that still credit?

[madkevin]

A check card looks like a credit card, but it simply is not. A check card is only good for pulling money from an account - a credit card pushes debt onto an account. Often this is transparent to a consumer because the mechanism for using these tools is the same. At the bottom line, however, it's a world of difference.

How is that different from a debit card? I'm not being facetious, I'm just wondering if there's some difference that I'm not understanding.

[malphigian]

How is that different from a debit card? I'm not being facetious, I'm just wondering if there's some difference that I'm not understanding.

My experience is mostly ecommerce related, but I think debit cards do not allow a merchant to "hold". A hold is when they reserve a set amount of your credit for a purchase without actually processing it.

For example, you buy a $100 dodad online. Before it's shipped, the store puts a hold on your account of $100. This is not a charge that will ever show up on your bill, but your credit limit is lowered by $100 while it's there. Once they ship the product, the hold is "captured", and it turns into an actual $100 charge. If the hold is never captured (I think there's a time limit, or it can be actively cancelled), your credit limit returns to where it was before.

I don't think the above is possible with a debit card, and it's useful for merchants for obvious reasons.

[Kool Moe Dee]

Er, isn't that still credit?

Nope. At least with the traditional Amex, you pay off the bill every month, so you aren't really carrying a balance.

[Enduro_Man]

A debit/check card draws funds directly from your checking account.

A credit card balance is effectively a short-term loan from the issuing bank to you, the cardholder. A credit card transaction leaves funds in your deposit accounts untouched, until you decide to pay the bill.

As for American Express, RickH is probably referring to their charge card, which, until recently, was what you meant by "an American Express card." (Amex offers both these days.) Charge cards must be paid in full at the end of the billing period. Credit cards only require a minimum monthly payment, while any remaining balance accrues massive interest. Alternatively, there's the Prepaid Charge Card, which is exactly as it sounds and, come to think of it, might really be what RickH was suggesting in the first place.

[DeepT]

Can't you just treat a check card as a credit card? For example, if I use my card at a gas pump, target, or anywhere else, it asks me if I want to use it as a debit card or credit card.

[stusser]

If you do that, I think it actually treats it like a cash advance, which can be very expensive. And no, it doesn't work the other way.

Just get a real creditcard and pay it off every month.

[Lokust]

I don't see how requirin ga credit card is any better, unless they are putting a hold on the account for the maximum conceivable non-return fee with every rental. No credit card that i've ever had will let any charge go through if the account at or above its credit limit - so isn't that effectively the same thing as having a debit card with no overdraft protection, as far as the retailer is concerned?

[JPR]

They put on a hold every time you rent a game that is canceled when it's returned.

[flyinj]

You can definitely put a 'hold' on money with a visa check card. I used one to purchase my 360 through Buy.com. They put a 'hold' on my money for about a week. It was marked as withdrawn from my account, and I couldn't access it.

Then they told me that they never really had 360's in the first place. And then it took another 3 days to 'unhold' the money from my account. This was right after launch. And boy was I pissed.

[ducker]

they are also doing the same with Wii titles.

On similar fuck blockbuster thread.... I'm bullshit at their online leg.
I've been waiting for OVER 6 months to watch the lastest Season of Smallville. It's been on the top of my queue Since November. I've called them up, bitched at them... and there is nothing they can do... I asked my netflix buddy to check it there.. sure enough NO wait.

I'm still waiting to watch Smallville... I've called a number of times to their customer support number to get no such luck in speeding in the process, and they can't simply say... go to a B&M store, and pick it up there, because for some stupid ass reason BB doesn't carry the Smallville series in store.

God, I hate them, They did lower my monthly fee, and for the meantime I'll stick with them and wait a little bit longer, but sooner or later I'm just gonna leave. The whole exchanging rented movies at the store and picking up another one just makes the value that much greater then Netflix. If it wasn't for their stupid online queue problems and a total lack of inventory.

Go out to Target and fuckin' buy a few more sets of the latest Smallville!

[RickH]

As for American Express, RickH is probably referring to their charge card, which, until recently, was what you meant by "an American Express card." (Amex offers both these days.) Charge cards must be paid in full at the end of the billing period. Credit cards only require a minimum monthly payment, while any remaining balance accrues massive interest. Alternatively, there's the Prepaid Charge Card, which is exactly as it sounds and, come to think of it, might really be what RickH was suggesting in the first place.

Thanks for clarifying, I did mean the standard green or gold charge card, payable in full every month. Somehow, the artificial discipline works.

[Reldan]

You can definitely put a 'hold' on money with a visa check card. I used one to purchase my 360 through Buy.com. They put a 'hold' on my money for about a week. It was marked as withdrawn from my account, and I couldn't access it.

Then they told me that they never really had 360's in the first place. And then it took another 3 days to 'unhold' the money from my account. This was right after launch. And boy was I pissed.

Are you sure that was a "hold" and not a "we charged you the money and then refunded it." It sounds a lot like they simply debitted your account at the time of purchase and then issued a refund later.

This totally wouldn't fly for rentals. Could you imagine that in order to rent a game they took $68 from your account and then gave you $60 back after you returned it? That totally would not fly.

madkevin: I think Enduro_Man summed up the difference between a check card and credit card very well.

Lokust: They do put a hold on your credit card at the time of rental equal to the value of the game if you decide to keep it. That way they are assured that they get their money. There's no equivalent protection with check cards.

If Blockbuster runs a credit card and you keep the game and try not the pay, they get their money and the burden is on the credit card company to collect from you. If they run a check card and you don't pay, the bank just doesn't pay them anything and the burden ends up on them to collect from you.

In layman's terms, with a check card you're giving them an IOU and telling them to go see Vinnie down the street if they want to get their money. They have to trust that Vinnie doesn't just tell them to F off when they come a callin'. With a credit card it's like having Vinnie standing right there handing them the money, and then threatening to break YOUR legs if you don't pay him back, with interest.

[RobotPants]

Wow, I didn't realize I'd get so many "what are you afraid of? get a credit card!" replies. Yeah, I'm not retarded, folks. I know all about credit and credit cards and the wonderful world they open up. But I don't have any because so far, my Visa check card has served me well enough and this is the first place of business that has outright refused to take it. I do know the differences between credit and debit cards. So you can stop with the "just get a credit card" replies, thanks. :) I've rented cars and hotel rooms just fine with what I've got. The main problem here is that I can apparently rent anything in the store without a credit card except for the "next-gen" games.

And yeah, Gamefly allows the use of my Visa check card. But oh noes, I could keep the game an drain my bank account!!!

[dannimal]

Clearly what you need to do is become a masked vigilante that hunt down clowns that try to cheat the system via debit cards.

Bring them all to justice, and Blockbuster will allow you your debit-y goodness once again!

[Kunikos]

Congrats on your first "Fuck putting the thread in the right forum" thread.

[Hanzii]

Here's my "fuck Blockbuster"-story.
We can only rent PS2 games. That's all.

[Wholly Schmidt]

Good luck renting a car or reserving a hotel room, too. Doing business with cash is problematic if you're essentially asking businesses to trust you by loaning you stuff more valuable than the transaction cost.
I got paranoid thinking about this thread; I've booked a hotel room through hotels.com for this weekend on my Visa check card. I'm not going to be screwed over when I arrive without a real credit card, am I? I'm hoping since the reservation went through ok, I'm in the clear, right?

[Damien Neil]

You're fine. So far as merchants are concerned, a Visa debit card may be treated identically to a Visa credit card.

Edit: And the fact that Blockbuster is smoking the crack pipe doesn't change this.

[Wholly Schmidt]

Thanks. I actually just got off the phone with hotels.com who told me I was fine as well, but I was worried because as I looked at other hotels they listed, some (like the one I booked) do say "Credit card required" and some say "Photo ID required." He assured me it would be ok, and apparently called the hotel and verified it. He said since my booking had already gone through (the money's been out of my account a few days already), that meant it was ok and I just need an ID when I get there.

[espressojim]

Thanks. I actually just got off the phone with hotels.com who told me I was fine as well, but I was worried because as I looked at other hotels they listed, some (like the one I booked) do say "Credit card required" and some say "Photo ID required." He assured me it would be ok, and apparently called the hotel and verified it. He said since my booking had already gone through (the money's been out of my account a few days already), that meant it was ok and I just need an ID when I get there.

The only problem you could have is if your card has a max dollar limit per day, and you try to charge more than that for the hotel. Like if you pay for an expensive place and try to do it all at one time. I think my card has something like a $300 limit/day. However, a call to your bank to tell them that you're traveling will take care of that for a window you specify as well.

[Dean]

I'm having a problem with my checkcard with, of all places, Netflix.

So I'm trying to restart my account because it's the summer months and TV is slow. Netflix uses the zip code of my billing address to confirm that it's me. So I put the correct zip in, and it comes back as the wrong zipcode.

I call my bank. Not only is my zipcode correct, but they've gotten a $1 confirmation charge from Netflix and approved it.

I call Netflix. Netflix says that my bank is correct, but Visa must have an incorrect zipcode, and I should call my bank and tell them to tell Visa to put in the correct zip.

I'm tired of spending hours on the phone, so I leave it for another day. So a couple of days later, I call my bank again. They tell me that Visa has the correct zip. I ask to be connected with a Visa rep. They do so. The Visa rep confirms that the only zip they have on record is what the bank has. They patch me back to my bank, and now I'm exasperated. We try Netflix again, and I put another request through with my bank on the phone. It is rejected on the website, but my bank representative watches it go through and watches the bank software approve it.

So she tells me that it's a problem with Netflix's security checking and I should call them back.

I don't. I'm tired of talking with customer service reps. I guess I don't get Netflix. Amazingly, the same thing happens when I rent a DVD from one of those Redbox kiosks at the supermarket. They also use zipcodes for security, and both my checkcards get rejected (I have two checking accounts).

I don't really want to use my real credit card for a recurring charge like Netflix. That's exactly what I have my debit card for. So this sucks.

Dare I say, "Netflix sucks?"

[RobotPants]

Wait, you said the same thing happens at another place that uses your zipcode? I'd say that sounds more like a bank/card/Visa problem with anything using zipcodes rather than a Netflix one.

[WarrenM]

Yeah, that doesn't sound like a NetFlix issue if the redbox thing is spitting out your card too. Unless NetFlix is running those things behind the scenes.

[Dean]

They aren't affiliated. The bank and Visa both deny anything is wrong. The bank said the only thing to do is cancel both cards and issue new ones, which seems drastic.

Methinks I'm not going back to Netflix.

[RobotPants]

I'm still not sure why you would think it's a Netflix-specific problem.

[Dean]

I don't think it's Netflix specific, but Netflix isn't important enough to cancel and reissue the cards over, and the bank and Visa both say that's the next step (with no assurance that will actually fix the problem).