WoW: new QT3 guild?

[Gary Whitta]

I quit my guild recently because it was a high-end raiding guild and the game is a fucking life-sucking tumor at that level.

But I love the game too much to quit it entirely so I am considering starting a new guild to play more casually with. I'm a level 70 Alliance mage on the Kil'Jaeden server. Would anyone be interested in joining me?

[dannimal]

Why not just transfer to Moonrunner?

[Gary Whitta]

What's the dealio over there?

[ciparis]

Sheesh, Gary :)

The NEW Come Play on Moonrunner/Alliance Thread! (http://www.quartertothree.com/game-talk/showthread.php?t=33782&highlight=moonrunner)

[ciparis]

There's a horde guild, too btw, managed by JC on another server (I forget which, they were talking about it a lot recently though).

[Gordon Cameron]

Why not just transfer to Moonrunner?

Gary would probably gnaw his own arm off rather than play on a carebear server.

Hordies are on Arathor, also carebear.

The only ally/pvp toon I have at the moment is a level 45 gnome rogue on Balnazzar. I suppose I could bring him over at some point if that transfer were allowed, but I am already spread thin among Moonrunner/Arathor/Akama, so it's not too realistic a proposition for me. =/

[Gary Whitta]

Oh, it's PvE? Forget it.

[Stroker Ace]

Oh, it's PvE? Forget it.As much of a griefing asshole as I like to think I am, I spent most of my WoW time trying to level in peace so I could make it to the battlegrounds. Worst of all is the inability to gank the assholes on your own faction. Are you sure WoW PvP servers are worth the trouble?

[Athryn]

If I remember correctly, there was originally a QT3 PvP guild, but it led a very short life. I can't for the life of me remember where it was or what it was called, but most of the people in it originally were the founding people of the Moonrunner guild.

[Gordon Cameron]

Frostwolf, if memory serves. Never actually played there so I could be wrong though.

[LesJarvis]

I did! I didn't post on QT3 back then, but I was in the guild. "Half Past Five" was the name, I think. It was definitely on Frostwolf.

[Kunikos]

I played a mage from 1 to 56 on Blackrock (PVP), and transferred to Moonrunner and I have no regrets. STV questing on alts is certainly a lot less of a hassle these days.

Gary, whatever you decide, if you end up xferring to Moonrunner PVE then Drop Bears will certainly welcome you. They just recently downed Moroes and are working on the Maiden in Kharazan.

Also, the new domain is working: http://www.dropbearsguild.net

[Gary Whitta]

I hate to be a snob about it and I appreciate the invite but I will never play on a PvE server, ever.

[Stroker Ace]

I hate to be a snob about it and I appreciate the invite but I will never play on a PvE server, ever.
Answer the question! What's so great about WoW PvP servers? Compared to UO/DAoC style "red" FFA servers they're weaksauce. Instances allow people to avoid world PvP. The battlegrounds force interested PvPers into even more instances

[Gary Whitta]

I can't compare WoW PvP to other games as it's the only MMO I've ever spent any real time with, but I like to be able to kill people whenever I feel like it.

[ciparis]

My primary complaint about PvE servers with regard to transfers is that it's a one-way ticket; that char will never be on a PvP server again. With the way WoW's PvP system and BG pools work, I don't see why they don't just allow it. The restriction is a depressing thought to me, and kept me from ever trying it out.

[Rywill]

The original Qt3 guild was indeed "Half Past Five" on Frostwolf/Alliance. I took my first character (a rogue) to 60 with them. But eventually people stopped playing, some folks took a free transfer to Frostmane, and the whole thing went defunct.

[Kunikos]

I can't compare WoW PvP to other games as it's the only MMO I've ever spent any real time with, but I like to be able to kill people whenever I feel like it.

Well, if you're ever bored you can just start a new alt on Moonrunner. Good luck on finding a new guild.

[Gordon Cameron]

My primary complaint about PvE servers with regard to transfers is that it's a one-way ticket; that char will never be on a PvP server again. With the way WoW's PvP system and BG pools work, I don't see why they don't just allow it. The restriction is a depressing thought to me, and kept me from ever trying it out.

Yeah, I'm not happy about that either. It's why I hesitated so long before moving my 70 druid from Akama to Moonrunner. I am a carebear through and through, but I still like the thought that I could theoretically go to Redridge and pwn up the place in order to vent my aggression.

[Kunikos]

I just wish the Battlegrounds were split into smaller level groups. It seems like the people at the very top of the bracket have an unfair advantage over other people. If you're level 70 and have m4d 3p1x then your level 65 competitor is going to be under your bootheel in a few seconds; they don't even have all their class spells yet!

[Rywill]

Huh? The level 70 BGs are separate, I'm 99% sure.

[DeepT]

Oh, it's PvE? Forget it.


Come to Skullcrusher and start a guild there. There are rivers of blood to swim in and carpets of skeletons to walk upon.

I have a few level 70 alliance characters there.

We have a server wide PvP channel, several server radio stations, and at least one, if not more server wide vent servers.

[evanostrand]

i couldn't bring myself to transfer my mage onto a pve server since i could never get it back onto pvp. the finality of it sounds so depressing.


so i just started an alt...its a druid on skywall. i should be able to hit 70 in 10 days played (50 in 6 so far). they needed healers anyway so they could start ss. i dont play on it except for raiding with my spouse.

any other time i'm on my mage either world pvping or farming mats for flasks and pots to world pvp with. can't imagine not being able to world pvp - it sounds so terrible and boring.

[Coca Cola Zero]

I don't have any level 70 chars yet, though I'd assume you are right and they probably are separate, but I agree with Kunikos' general point. When you're levelling up there is really no point in playing BGs until you're at the 7th level or so of your current 10 level group. (17, 27, etc). Otherwise you just tend to get crushed. It would be better if the matchmaking used smaller increments (5 levels would be good) though I have no idea if the number of BG players would support that without having long waits.

Having played WoW both PvP (first) and PvE (later), I like PvE a ton better. Its so nice not to get ganked hourly but still have the option to kill people approximately your level in the battlegrounds. Best of both worlds, IMO.

[TheRock]

I personally love PVP servers....it just makes it more 'real', the feeling of being tense all the time in neutral zones. As far as ganking, if you could only fight, say, 6 levels above or below you, that would be a nicer system than what is in place, IMO. BUT, I transferred to Arathor and am happy but I really wish I could transfer back to a PVP server whenever the mood hit me.

[Kunikos]

Huh? The level 70 BGs are separate, I'm 99% sure.

Sure whatever, level 69 then. A level 69 player has probably stalled XPing but has an advantage of being able to resist spells from lower level casters and has enough cash to blow on enchants if they are a die hard PVPer. They still play in the same bracket as a level 60.

[Stroker Ace]

It's like they want you to keep on leveling to 70, and then spend a billion hours getting purples. Or something.

[Kunikos]

The Vision (tm).

[RightWrong]

I'd start an alliance character for a new guild, but I don't see how that would provide your level 70 mage any company.

[phanfasm]

Alliance. Meh.

[rossm]

I just wish the Battlegrounds were split into smaller level groups. It seems like the people at the very top of the bracket have an unfair advantage over other people. If you're level 70 and have m4d 3p1x then your level 65 competitor is going to be under your bootheel in a few seconds; they don't even have all their class spells yet!
It's already really difficult to find a game when you're not in the highest bracket. It would be even more difficult when split among fewer levels.

[DeepT]

Well gary, you gonna move to skullcrusher and make a guild?

[Kunikos]

It's already really difficult to find a game when you're not in the highest bracket. It would be even more difficult when split among fewer levels.

I thought that was the point of having "Battlegroups." Just make the battlegroups bigger and have more servers collaborating to fill the BGs. :)

[bigdruid]

I see what Gary is saying, though re: PvE vs PvP.

My lvl 60 char is on a PvE server, but I flagged myself for PvP the other day to do those early PvP quests in Outland.

I had a lvl 70 rogue decloak and nail me within 30 seconds of flagging. After rezzing, I had a lvl 70 hunter two shot me, then hover high above my body in his flying mount, waiting for me to rez again (it only took an additional two insta-kills before I figured out what he was doing).

A great time was had by all. I can see why you'd be loath to give that up.

[Rywill]

Yeah, we've had the discussion before, but: I brought two characters to 60 on PvP servers, before eventually moving them to PvE servers to be with the rest of the Qt3 people. I have never regretted it. World PvP in WoW is fairly broken, and although every now and again you get a great fight, 95% of the time it's either you ganking some helpless person, or someone ganking you while you're helpless. No fun to be on either side.

[Stroker Ace]

Yeah, we've had the discussion before, but: I brought two characters to 60 on PvP servers, before eventually moving them to PvE servers to be with the rest of the Qt3 people. I have never regretted it. World PvP in WoW is fairly broken, and although every now and again you get a great fight, 95% of the time it's either you ganking some helpless person, or someone ganking you while you're helpless. No fun to be on either side.It's true. Some of the most fun I've had in WoW is surviving a gank attempt and killing my aggressor, but that was <5% of my world PvP, the rest was fighting greys. On top of that, BGs give just as much fun but more regularly.

[Athryn]

Yeah, we've had the discussion before, but: I brought two characters to 60 on PvP servers, before eventually moving them to PvE servers to be with the rest of the Qt3 people. I have never regretted it. World PvP in WoW is fairly broken, and although every now and again you get a great fight, 95% of the time it's either you ganking some helpless person, or someone ganking you while you're helpless. No fun to be on either side.


What he said.

[Ranulf]

If I remember correctly, there was originally a QT3 PvP guild, but it led a very short life. I can't for the life of me remember where it was or what it was called, but most of the people in it originally were the founding people of the Moonrunner guild.

There is one on Sargeras (PVP server) I think still. I have a couple of toons in there but I hardly ever log on and no one else did much either after a few weeks IIRC.

[JM]

Who the hell keeps their char at 69 for Battlegrounds when all the good rewards and funky shit are at 70?

[ciparis]

It makes more sense to me at 49. Lots of interesting talents available, and you don't have to deal with the catass PvE twits marching in with tier >>> u when they're bored late at night after their 4th 5 hour raid of the week (which has nothing to do with our wonderful QT3-flavored PvE people, of course :)).

[DeepT]

You had to spend time figuring out what was going on and were not prepared. On a PvP server you would know better then to get near a flag with a hunter hovering over it with a flying mount. You would also bring friends.

Do you also know you do not need to quest to get any tokens? All you need to do is kill someone near a flag and you get a token (Hellfire and Zang) or anywhere near hala in nagrand.

[bigdruid]

Well, that's true, DeepT. I hadn't played WoW since last summer and my PvP skills were pretty rusty, and I hadn't yet really experienced what it was like to go up against someone with a flying mount.

On the flip side of the coin, I logged in the next day to finish the quest during off hours when the griefers would be more likely to be in school. I flag for PvP, and again within 60 secs a lvl 70 rogue decloaks and whacks me (do these guys just sit around stealthed for hours waiting for some newb to walk by?). Long story short, I was able to kill him despite the huge level disparity - it was probably the most intensely fun gaming experience I'd had in months.

So I *do* understand the whole allure of the PvP server. If someone would figure out a solution for the "how to keep high-level players from ganking low-level players" problem, it'd be a more viable gaming environment for me.

But, yeah, it's not like this discussion hasn't been had 10,000,000 times already.

[Kunikos]

I had a lvl 70 rogue decloak and nail me within 30 seconds of flagging. After rezzing, I had a lvl 70 hunter two shot me, then hover high above my body in his flying mount, waiting for me to rez again (it only took an additional two insta-kills before I figured out what he was doing).

A great time was had by all. I can see why you'd be loath to give that up.

I LOL'd.

[jeffd]

If I remember correctly, there was originally a QT3 PvP guild, but it led a very short life. I can't for the life of me remember where it was or what it was called, but most of the people in it originally were the founding people of the Moonrunner guild.

Half Past Five on Frostwolf. It's gone now.

[metta]

If someone would figure out a solution for the "how to keep high-level players from ganking low-level players" problem, it'd be a more viable gaming environment for me.

Community. On The Venture Co. there is a loose alliance of guilds who police high gank areas, like Tarren Mill and Stranglethorn. Our bloodshirsty folks get to stomp some Alliance guts out and our saplings get to quest in peace.

The Alliance even takes a running jump at doing the same thing: there is a guild called Defenders of Stromgarde that patrols Stromgarde Keep in Arathi, and preserve it's use for Alliance players.

Maybe it's because V. Co. is an RP server though: I've never seen much community impulse on the other servers.

I can't imagine playing ona PvE server: when I get ganked by ?? I just pick up and move to another zone. And the buzz of walking into a contested zone more than makes up for any irritation I may feel.

[Kunikos]

Not everyone enjoys being forced to take a 20 minute ride/flight/boat-ride combo to go to a different zone when there is some ?? teabagging your corpse for 10 min straight. We don't all have the luxury to spend the time, because our *total* playtime per day may only be an hour or so.

I only miss the 5% of encounters where the level difference wasn't too big and it wasn't a gang-rape squad.

[jeffd]

I pretty much used to feel that way about PVP servers (the buzz is awesome!) until I played on a PvE server. I won't go back.

[Gordon Cameron]

I can't imagine playing ona PvE server:

I have played to 70 on both and haven't seen a huge difference. But on both server types I focus on quests and dungeons because frankly that is what interests me. Occasionally on a pvp server, business-as-usual is interrupted by a cool fight or a really fucking annoying ganking/corpse-camping.

I can see the situation being different for people who really seek out pvp all the time and for whom that is a major part of the game. But that's just not what turns me on about WoW so it's not a big issue to me one way or another. I'd happily play on either type of server depending on the people I was playing with.

[Stroker Ace]

I had a blast leveling to 70 on my druid, especially when I was specced feral. It's not too hard to escape a gank attempt, run off a bit to heal, and then return for the beatdown.

That said, it's annoying as hell the rest of the time.

[bigdruid]

Community.

Yeah, that's always the solution I read - the tried-and-true UO solution, which is basically "social engineering". The problem is, it relies on two things:

1) There are as many police as there are griefers (actually, you need more, because they pretty much have to be everywhere to be effective).
2) That the addition of "police" doesn't just make it more alluring for the griefers, as it adds an element of challenge to the gank fest.

I'm still wondering how any police force can stop a lvl 70 rogue who decides to stealth up, two-shot newbs, then restealth before the police arrive. I mean, they could stand around at the crime scene and make sure someone's corpse doesn't get camped, but it seems tough to actually stop a determined ganker.

[Gordon Cameron]

The implementation of in-game wanted lists (and prices on heads perhaps) for each faction might make this more interesting, but this would probably lend itself to its own possible exploits and griefing.

Sigh, it must be hard to design an MMO. You have assume with every new feature that people will immediately try to find the best possible way to use it to be an asshole.

[DeepT]

Everyone who wants a PvP guild should come to skullcrusher. I got all my characters there and a bunch of RL friends who are on there. I can't move to a new server.

Skullcrusher is the oldest PvP server (it was the one in beta) not that it matters much. It has a huge PvP community outside of the game. It has a few radio stations, vent servers, alliance / horde PvP chat, IRC channels, and the whole nine yards.

The horde faction on our server is considered to be some of the very best PvP around (I have heard this claim many times, I am not sure how it can be substantiated though). The Alliance, not so much. They are very good, but not nearly as good as the horde side. When AV was server only, the alliance almost never won, once it became multi-server, the horde almost never won.

I do know that in our battle group, as Alliance for WSG and AB, there were only a few experienced teams that would not immediately /afk out when they saw us. Mostly when we got a match, it was a bunch of noobs who didn't know better. It came down to how quickly could we get a 5 cap in AB. I didn't even know it was possible to 5 cap AB without the other side getting at least 1 tick, but frequently we did.

In AV, with my normal battle group using stinky-que we could get a good number into the same match. If we got around 7 or 8 people, we could finish the match in less then 15 minutes. Of course the horde would have to be especially dumb to let us do that, but quite frequently we pulled it off. I thought it was cool when some AV matches in the past had been done is merely 22 minutes. My battle group scoffed at that.

BTW by battle group, I do not mean the thing blizzard uses to delineate server blocks. I mean an informal guild of PvP players who worked together.

Anyway, if people are going to migrate to new servers to form a QT3 Alliance guild on a PvP server, you should make it Skullcrusher.

[Stroker Ace]

DeepT, you just described the BG experience for every guild group in purples ever.

[DeepT]

Except our group was hardcore PvP and didn't have purples except the ones they earned via the PvP reward system. Before the new BC system, the vast majority was in 'mostly blues'. The balance was a fair mix of greens and purples.

So no, this was not some kind of T2.5 epic PvP team. For a long time, my pally's PvP weapon was the IBS, which isn't all that good.

[Stroker Ace]

Ok, so through hard work and discipline you managed to have the same play experience of every BWL+ guild ever. Just saying - teaming up vs. a random mob is passé.

[DeepT]

It is the luck of the draw, it is not like you can choose who you fight in a BG.

[Stroker Ace]

Fine, I respect your honor-farming ways.

[Gordon Cameron]

For a long time, my pally's PvP weapon was the IBS, which isn't all that good.

Don't be badmouthing the Noobspear, now. :P

[Stroker Ace]

I used the IBS from whatever the minimum level is (51?) right up until I got Lok'Delar. I loved that thing.