My kingdom for a good PS2 strat title

[Tyjenks]

The first game I bought for the PS1 was X-Com:UFO Defense. I still believe that is my favorite game on that system of all time. Granted it was based on a classic PC title, but it transferred really well and I was not a PC owner at the time. Several strategy titles followed and a couple succeeded in capturing my attention. FFT for one.

Now that I am firmly planted in the PC world where strategy titles abound will I ever find a good console strategy title?

The PS2 has a woeful selection and I really do not see much if anything on the horizon. Maybe Legion: Legend of Excalibur, but the number of times it has been delayed has finally surpassed my age: 32.

Are there any decent Ps2 strat. titles I have somehow missed and does anybody know of anything on it's way?

[Brad Grenz]

Well, there's Ring of Red, Kessen and Kessen II.

[Dave Long]

It's not PS2, but if you haven't played Front Mission 3 for PSOne, you're missing out on one of the best console strategy/RPGs money can buy. By the same token, if you enjoyed Final Fantasy Tactics, you should pick up Tactics Ogre, either for the PSOne (hard to find) or for Gameboy Advance. There's also Advance Wars on the GBA. If you can get a Sega Saturn cheap, pick up Iron Storm from Working Designs or even Dragon Force. Both games aren't inexpensive used these days, but both are excellent examples of great console strategy games.

It takes longer for the strategy titles to appear on newer consoles. It's a genre that usually only will get one or two really great games throughout a console's lifetime. There's plenty of strategy in a lot of RPGs though depending on the combat system. A lot of the folks that work on more traditional RPGs like Final Fantasy X have usually worked on Strat/RPG games as well. I haven't played it, but Dark Cloud has a town building segment that seems pretty strategic.

Coming within a year or so on PS2 will be the two Growlanser Strat/RPGs, Growlanser II and III from Working Designs. Those are definitely two to look forward to. Dark Cloud 2 may be another one. Brad's choices are good ones too.

--Dave

[Anonymous]

Don't forget Heroes of Might and Magic: Quest for the Dragon Bone Staff..

Okay, nevermind.. you can.

[Tyjenks]

Brad,

I found Kessen pretty dull and also I am not big on cut scenes which it had in spades.
Ring of Red I have not tried, but am looking for a bargain copy tomorrow.


Dave,

Front Mission 3 is fun, but the horrible dialog did me in before I finished.
I had Ogre Battle back on the SNES I think it was and did enjoy that. I have not been able to find a copy of Tactics.

I am beginning to think I should trade my PS2 for a GBA after all the wonderful titles it has out and coming out.

I own Dark Cloud. The city building is pretty cool, but not overly deep. The leveling system is fun also, but the random dungeons (which is the majority of the game) begin to look exactly the same with precious little variability in the monsters throughout each level. Maybe the 2nd edition will improve on this.

I do realize it is a long wait for a decent strategy game on a new system. The technology is new to developers and they are simply harder to program I imagine. Witness my above example of Legion; it was slated to be on the shelf when the PS2 came out. How many fighting and racing games can we take? Obviously, the answer from the buying public is plenty!!!

I had heard of those you mentioned, but were not sure if they were going to actually make it to U.S. shores.


Thanks for the replies!!!


Guest,

I had just forgotten the pain of Dragon Bone and then you picked the scab. Thanks a lot!!!!!!

[Mark Asher]

Most strategy games use a lot of text and text just sucks on TV displays.

[Tyjenks]

Agreed. It sucks exponentially worse when it is poorly translated and mind-numbling dull.

Front Mission just seemed to have way too much of it, the majority of which did not seem all that necessary in furthering the story.

Maybe I will fire it back up and give it another go.

[Jason Lutes]

I'd wait on trading in your PS2 for a GBA for a bit -- I got a GBA solely to try out Advance Wars, and it's been a long, dry wait for an decent strategy title since then. Although there may be more coming, the only other interesting game on the system right now (for me) is Tactics Ogre (which I still haven't laid my hands on because all of the local EBs are out).

There's also another strat title I know of coming up for the PS2 besides those mentioned above -- A "Tactics" version of the Romance of the Three Kingdoms game. Can't remember the name of it right now, but I'm looking forward to that one.

[TomChick]

Front Mission 3 was a *great* tactical system, but it was wasted on a strictly linear string of missions separated by lots of awkward exposition. That was a game that would have had nearly unlimited replay value if only there had been some moderately random elements in the way the campaign unfolded.

I keep hearing about the Ogre Tactics thing on the Gameboy Advance. I wasn't into Advance Wars (been there, done that, it was called Panzer General), but it sounds like these Ogre Tactics style games could be pretty nifty.

-Tom

[Tyjenks]

I'd wait on trading in your PS2 for a GBA for a bit -- I got a GBA solely to try out Advance Wars, and it's been a long, dry wait for an decent strategy title since then.


Maybe I will just snatch a GBA from one of these kids at EB while he is distracted and bitching because his friend has an X-box, Gamecube, and PS2 and he still does not have an X-box.

[Jason Lutes]

*That* would be the best way to acquire a GBA, for sure.

I tired of Advance Wars after around a dozen or so missions; it wasn't the Panzer General-ish aspect for me, though, it was the utterly generic feel of the whole thing. So my GBA has been accumulating dust for a while.

The Tactics series of games have a lot of really interesting things going on. There's an extremely rich interaction of battlefield elements, from height to facing and even astrological sign (i.e., opposing signs do more damage to one another, sympathetic signs have a higher chance to heal one another, etc.), and the class/ability/item system allows for some truly individualized custom characters that need ot be honed well as a team (for instance, couple a Time Mage with Haste spell with a Ninja who can leap and watch the rear ranks of the opposition fall to pieces).

The tactical part plays out more like Shadow Watch than X-Com, if you multiplied SW's tactical variables by about 100. Really fun in the variety, but not balanced at all; in the final analysis these games get too hard for me about two thirds of the way through. If you haven't tried one, Tom, maybe you should rent Final Fantasy Tactics or Tactics Ogre for the PS1. Or heck, I think FFT has been issued as a "Classic" PS game for $20.

The thing that really interests me about TO for the GBA is the new wrinkle wherein characters open up class change options depending on what they do on a battlefield, so that a character who attacks from behind a lot can eventually become a Thief, etc. The most interesting example in a review I read was that a character who is Knight and struck down in battle can return as an Angel Knight. That kind of thing sounds neat to me, in that it combines gameplay with narrative in an interesting way.

[Dave Long]

That was a game (edit: Front Mission) that would have had nearly unlimited replay value if only there had been some moderately random elements in the way the campaign unfolded.

You know there are two totally separate stories in the game based on a fairly trivial choice near the beginning, right?

--Dave

[TomChick]

You know there are two totally separate stories in the game based on a fairly trivial choice near the beginning, right?

Yeah, and I even saved at the split to try both paths. But otherwise, the game just marches from battle to battle. I guess there's some randomization in terms of how you develop your mechs (err, I mean Wanzers), but it just wasn't enough for me. I kept thinking what I waste of a great system to shunt it from point to point like this.

-Tom

[Kevin Perry]

I loved FM3 when I first played it, but couldn't muster the enthusiasm to try it again. It wasn't the dialogue or 'story' that bothered me, but actually the extent (or lack thereof) of usable variety in the combat system.

It -looked- like there was a great deal of tactical variety, but I found in actual practice that there was too little to bring me back. Also, the party system annoyed me a bit. Since you are given an ever-greater pool of party members to choose between, but the rewards of experience are so great, the positive-feedback loop kept my team quite polarized.

Nits, though. I enjoyed it all the way through the first time, and how many games get that kind of enjoyment and play?

[Tyjenks]

I just read at AVault that Midway shipped Legion: Legend of Excalibur today. I could have sworn the realease date was pushed until October.

I have not heard much about this game lately which, of course, makes me nervous. Have any of you seen or heard anything?

<EDIT>
Gamespot just gave it a 3.8 and while I never really rely on their reviews, much less a single review, this cannot be good. That is lower than many scores they have given to terrible games.

[Tyjenks]

There's also another strat title I know of coming up for the PS2 besides those mentioned above -- A "Tactics" version of the Romance of the Three Kingdoms game. Can't remember the name of it right now, but I'm looking forward to that one.

Jason,
A preview was just posted at Gamespy on this game: Dynasty Tactics. The author said it compares favorably with FFT and Front Mission. The screenshots look promising, too. Release date Q4 2002, I think. :D

[Anonymous]

Here's the blurb from EBgames. I've also been following the discussion on 3Kingdoms.net for a while and, until we get ahold of Medieval Total War or Pax Romana for the PC, this is my idea of a great roleplaying-strategy game for the PS2. :)


"The Evolution of the Three Kingdoms series...

The story is known worldwide and also has given birth to other videogame titles such as Kessen 2 and the Dynasty Warriors series. Drawing on over 15 years of experience, RTK VII introduces a number of dramatic improvements to the series, such as the ability to play as any character in the game, as well as a variety of character roles/positions.

Previous games in the Three Kingdoms series thrust players in the role of one of the many ruling lords. However, RTK VII also allows for individual officer play. Not as ambitious as the power-hungry Cao Cao? Simply pick a lowly government official or general and live your life as you choose and perhaps one day, ascend to the throne yourself. This character system allows for a completely new degree of freedom and lets players live their own Three Kingdoms experience."

[Robert Sharp]

Unfortunately, Legion has gotten bad reviews everywhere. I was looking forward to this one too, but sadly it looks like it didn't work out. I may still try it some day when it is VERY cheap though.

I love the strategy/rpg style of gameplay. Apparently, Arc the Lad uses some strategy elements. Can anyone confirm that? I wasn't willing to pay $75 for the game, especially since 1 and 2 are apparently pretty short games, so you aren't really getting 3 large games with that price.

I still own Tactics Ogre for the PSX, but it isn't easy to find anymore. FFT is probably the best console game I have ever played. Just fantastic. I haven't gotten the GBA Tactics Ogre yet, but I plan to eventually.

I think for the future, Dynasty Tactics and Gladius look to be the most promising games. Gladius has A LOT going for it, but it might be too ambitious for its own good. I hope not.

[Anonymous]

Another vote for Front Mission 3! Pick this one up while you can. I had to find a used copy.