If I liked Betrayal at Krondor because...

[Creole Ned]

One of the few RPG's I've replayed from beginning to end is Betrayal at Krondor. If I had to make a list of bullet points to describe why I enjoyed it so much, I'd say:

• engaging turn-based combat system
• expansive 3D(ish) world
• although the world was large and granted a lot of freedom, the overall story, divided into chapters, was easy to follow
• despite some iffy art (Gorath's department store Santa beard comes to mind), the characters were memorable (I've never read any of Raymond Feist's books)
• the usual gathering of loot and improving your characters, even if most of the loot was swords, more swords and let's not forget...swords!

Of the items listed above, the turn-based combat is probably what I enjoyed the most. It seems most (PC) RPG's have abandoned turn-based systems - I'd have loved one for Morrowind. Are there any RPG's out now or coming out that feature turn-based combat? I only have a PC and Xbox but I'm interested in knowing what's out there, regardless of platform.

[Kevin Grey]

The closest you'll probably find to Krondor's grid and turn based combat are console strat RPGs, the majority of which are on Sony's systems with the GBA as a backup.

[Equis]

The closest you'll probably find to Krondor's grid and turn based combat are console strat RPGs, the majority of which are on Sony's systems with the GBA as a backup.

Not true.

Fallout 1/2/Tactics was hex-grid and turned based. It had its share of problems but overall, it worked very well for the series.

The Infinity engine* games also do some modular form of turn based. You can set it to pause at the end of every turn so you can issue new orders if you so wished. Personally, doing it that way made for clunky combat but i suppose you could treat it like turned based.

*Baldur's gate series/Icewind Dale series/the ever stellar Planescape Torment.

Wizardry 8, another fantastic RPG had turned based combat and something called a continuous system. Either one was based on your characters each taking their turn to do a specific action. (spell/attack/heal/etc). The difference was whether all the good guys did it before the bad guys or it is interspersed with each other. You'[ll see when you play the game.

So there you go. If you haven't tried any of these. Please, do so.

[olaf]

TToEE has tremendous TB combat. But yeah overall, its really hard to find an RPG with TB combat.

olaf

[Daly]

Anachronox might fit the bill if you haven't already partaken. Just looking through your bullet points any of them could describe it equally well... except for the swords bit.

It's one of the most enjoyable RPG's I've played in recent times, despite its flaws (buggy at times, dodgy graphics in places).

[Sebmolo]

If you do that (and you can pick up Anachronox super cheap, so I say go for it) be sure and get the Unofficial Patch (http://www.fileplanet.com/124622/120000/fileinfo/Anachronox-Unofficial-Patch). One of the original programmers hacked it together, the link tells you what it does.

[Daly]

If you do that (and you can pick up Anachronox super cheap, so I say go for it) be sure and get the Unofficial Patch (http://www.fileplanet.com/124622/120000/fileinfo/Anachronox-Unofficial-Patch). One of the original programmers hacked it together, the link tells you what it does.

Yeah, that's a must. It introduces a pile of improvements, one of which allows you to specify a place on your hard drive as the game CD - so you just copy the CD to your game directory and it cuts your loading times down to almost nothing. Nifty. They're all there on the site Sebmolo linked to but that one in particular really made a difference for me, especially in the areas where there's a lot of travelling to be done.

[graller]

I just finished ToEE with the 2 official patches and the Circle of Eight stuff. Much improved and very stable now. I can't recommend it highly enough

[Robert Sharp]

If you do that (and you can pick up Anachronox super cheap, so I say go for it) be sure and get the Unofficial Patch (http://www.fileplanet.com/124622/120000/fileinfo/Anachronox-Unofficial-Patch). One of the original programmers hacked it together, the link tells you what it does.

I don't have an account? Is that the only place I can get it?

[Kunikos]

I like how Anachronox makes good use of humor, and often.

[Warning]

While Anachronox has several of the qualities that you liked in Betrayal At Krondor, make no mistake - it's about as different from BAK as two games could be.

[Kunikos]

Yes, it's very "console-y"... while it doesn't suffer from as many cliche's from Japanese console RPGs, it does have the same tired combat engine from SNES era console RPGs.

[Creole Ned]

I may grab the Anachronox demo but I suspect it's not quite what I'm looking for. Most of the discussion about ToEE here has made me wary of the game but if the patches make it more playable, I can probably pick it up cheap and give it a go.

Thanks for the suggestions, everyone. I knew coming into this that the pickings would be slim. Maybe I'll just reload BaK one more time and grit my teeth at the visuals as I play through. Too bad it never got one of those homebrew makeovers.

[Marcus]

ToEE here has made me wary of the game but if the patches make it more playable, I can probably pick it up cheap and give it a go.

I snagged it from CC for 5.99 :)

[Daly]

If you do that (and you can pick up Anachronox super cheap, so I say go for it) be sure and get the Unofficial Patch (http://www.fileplanet.com/124622/120000/fileinfo/Anachronox-Unofficial-Patch). One of the original programmers hacked it together, the link tells you what it does.

I don't have an account? Is that the only place I can get it?

Try here (http://dlh.net/cgi-bin/dlp.cgi?lang=eng&sys=pc&file=anarchron102.zip&ref=ps)

Edit: changed link

[Warning]

Maybe I'll just reload BaK one more time and grit my teeth at the visuals as I play through. Too bad it never got one of those homebrew makeovers.
I never played the sequel Return to Krondor. I know it was a 3rd person game but I'm not sure if the combat was turn-based or not.

Might be worth checking into?

[awdougherty]

Once the combat kicks in in ToEE, I'm ready to declare it one of the best CRPGs made in a long time. It's the rest of it that can be troublesome. Make sure you install the first two patches, then check out the Circle of Eight fan patch instead of going with the third "official" patch. There's also Livonya's mod that adds a bunch of stuff.

[Kunikos]

I thought I'd mention that Fallout 2 has patches still being made for it by a fan named Seraph:

http://seraph.samods.org/index.htm

[Kitsune]

Actually, it seems like Dragon Quest VIII, of all games, would most suit your list there, Creole. Let me explain.

-Completely turn-based combat system (no compromises, no options, turn-based that's it), that is indeed expansive. Unless you're a DQ maniac, it starts off slow, but soon you're inundated with tantalizing battle options. I assume what you're talking about here is that glorious feeling in an RPG when you feel you could tackle one problem in a multitude of ways and the combat always feels like it keeps you on your toes and you're thinking. That's DQ to a tee.

-Expansive 3D world, of which Dragon Quest VIII has in spades, its absolutely huge and filled with all sorts of stuff to explore. Much like Krondor, lots of huge overworld, very large dungeons and towns, all in glorious technicolor 3D.

-The story is easy to follow, and you get more freedom as you go on, but even from the beginning you have your options to explore, find loot, do some optional things and it gradually gets bigger and bigger until you're free to do whatever you want within the scope of the easily followed plot.

-Well, some people think Toriyama is the king of iffy art, but if you liken to his style, there's a lot of charm in his drawings and the characters are definitely charming and memorable, that's actually the best part of the story parts of the game. Especially if you take the time to talk to them (an optional thing, not usually conveyed through cutscenes, there are hundreds of optional dialogues to enjoy).

-DQVIII has way more than the usual gathering of loot and such, including some very unique ways to gather power, like deciding the in and outs of a certain rather complex powerful special attack which can takes hours and hours to prepare depending on how obsessed you get, or tons of treasure chests to find in the overworld, or the random things you can make/find, and the ways you can exploit the alchemy system through monster drops/various combinations to get super-powerful items earlier, the casinos where you can earn unique items, and on and on.

So yeah, its on the PS2, but it seems tailor made for what you want.

-Kitsune

[Ex-S Woo]

...and it's got 2 endings! :o

DQVIII is definitely the best 'old school' console RPG that I've played in a long time...heck, probably my fav RPG for the PS2 :)

[Bill Dungsroman]

If you do that (and you can pick up Anachronox super cheap, so I say go for it) be sure and get the Unofficial Patch (http://www.fileplanet.com/124622/120000/fileinfo/Anachronox-Unofficial-Patch). One of the original programmers hacked it together, the link tells you what it does.

I don't have an account? Is that the only place I can get it?

Try here (http://www.planetanachronox.com/anox1/files/gamepatches/)

Incidentally, that will just take you back to the same FilePlanet link.

[child of Thor]

the only other one i can think of that hasn't been mentioned is the Realms of Arkania series of rpgs. info here: http://www.mobygames.com/game/realms-of-arkania-blade-of-destiny

[skyride]

I will add my vote for ToEE as well.

Comparing what you liked about BoK:
Story/Items was better in BoK.
TB Combat is a LOT better in ToEE.

[Kitsune]

...and it's got 2 endings! :o

DQVIII is definitely the best 'old school' console RPG that I've played in a long time...heck, probably my fav RPG for the PS2 :)

Let's marry and have each other's babies. Sure, we're probably both boys, but that's no obstacle if we both love Dragon Quest. :P

No, seriously, with you and Galadriels on this board I feel a lot less alone in my tastes. DQVIII just happens to my favorite RPG this generation. What an amazing game! I think you might consider the 2 endings thing a spoiler though, considering the way its handled. :) All hail Dragon Quest!

Also, Jessica is the RAWK!

Do you know Japanese or do you import games regardless?

-Kitsune

[Alan Dunkin]

Realms of Arkania? Do I really want to spend my time feeding my party and making sure their pants are still on?

--- Alan

[Ex-S Woo]

Your marriage proposal is touching but alas, I fear that it's not meant to be :)

...and yes, I did enjoy most of Jessica's 'skills' quite a bit :oops: I hear that many of them are being cut/edited in the upcoming US release though...ah well.

I'm more or less fluent in Japanese, although I am admittedly a bit weak in technical/business Japanese and writing kanji(although I hear that this is getting to be a wide spread problem in Japan, with the spread of IME programs and all). I've studied in Japan for about a year and took regular university courses with the other Japanese students while I was there. I even got my 1-kyu Japanese language certification while I was there...so I'm not totally talking out of my ass :)

I'm recently finding myself becoming more picky when it comes to console RPGs to preferring certain types of Japanese PC games though...esp action visual novels such as Fate Stay/Night and Tsukihime. You ever given those a try?

[Daly]

Incidentally, that will just take you back to the same FilePlanet link.

Gah. Cheers for pointing that out. I've edited my original post to link to the place I actually downloaded it. As opposed to where I thought I did.

[Creole Ned]

Maybe I'll just reload BaK one more time and grit my teeth at the visuals as I play through. Too bad it never got one of those homebrew makeovers.
I never played the sequel Return to Krondor. I know it was a 3rd person game but I'm not sure if the combat was turn-based or not.

Might be worth checking into?
I picked up Return to Krondor for $10 from EB a few years back. Different dev team, different engine and instead of a huge world, it was locked into an old-style adventure game POV where you moved from scene to scene. I dimly recall that it had turn-based combat, but it just left me cold. Even with its horrible voice acting and inferior graphics, I enjoyed Betrayal in Antara more.

But thanks for the suggestion, regardless. :)

Kitsune, apart from the art style, Dragonquest VIII does sound like a good fit. Being on the PS2 is a bit of a bummer, though. I'm basically looking for an excuse to pick up a DS but grabbing a PS2 to try to satisfy my particular RPG fix is a tougher sell.

[Kevin Grey]

I'm basically looking for an excuse to pick up a DS but grabbing a PS2 to try to satisfy my particular RPG fix is a tougher sell.

Heck they're pretty close in price these days and there is a nice selection of strategy RPGs you'd likely enjoy.

[Ex-S Woo]

...are there any portable games out there that fit your description though? I think the combination of :

-A 3D world and
-Turn based combat

knocks most possible contenders out of the running (unless you feel like picking up a new language and start importing :D)

I suppose you can pick up some GBA RPGs like Breath of Fire 2 and Golden Sun and play them on the DS though. DS's backlight will make the games so much cooler!

[child of Thor]

Realms of Arkania? Do I really want to spend my time feeding my party and making sure their pants are still on?

--- Alan

yeah there is that, but it is an RPG with TBS battles which was the requirement. And i didn't mind the feeding thing - it fitted into your parties group in the roleplay sense; your Hunter character could use their tracking skills to good effect to get more food when you camped your party out for the night. I really liked the detail - i didnt find it bogged the game down at all, but then i like pen+paper rpgs over fps games so it could be down to a matter of preference?
I enjoyed the game - never finished it as it was HUGE 8)

[olaf]

Wasnt that the game where you perma lost all your gear about 1/3rd of the way in? Man that pissed me off. I stopped playing after that.

olaf

[child of Thor]

Wasnt that the game where you perma lost all your gear about 1/3rd of the way in? Man that pissed me off. I stopped playing after that.

olaf

well as i said it was a huge game - i never had that happen to me? I was playing the first one on my Amiga1200, at the time it was the biggest rpg on the platform. The link i gave is for the trilogy edition of the pc version, so i'm not sure how the other games in the series played. I just remember a lot of interesting travelling around the huge world(only 3D in the cities/towns), great tactical tbs battles, probably the most detailed character creation in a CRPG(atleast on a par with daggerfall), and alot of ingame details - it didnt molly codle you; but i didnt find the detail dull or bogged the game down. I keep meaning to look out for this trilogy version on pc, i'm sure it would compete well with Daggerfall for my playing time.

Anyway i cant think of any other games that haven't already been mentioned,(edit) which is a shame as i would love to buy more of the genre.