NWN

[Anonymous]

I've been playing the single-player in NWN, with a near-near-final build (like, three weeks old). It's pretty damn stable, so I have a good feeling about the final build. Anyhow, I just started Chapter 4 (the last one), so I can answer a bunch of stuff about SP, I guess.

I've only played multi at E3, but once I get final retail, I'll get some MP sessions done. If only so that I can be an asshole DM and drop Balors all over my players.

[Mark Asher]

How will the single-player work if we get a group together and play through it in co-op mode? Is that possible?

What's the pacing like compared to, say, Diablo?

What kind of character are you playing too? Are thieves viable? Are there non-combat paths where you can use stealth to get by something instead of killing it?

[Anonymous]

I'm pretty damn sure it's possible to play it co-op, because the campaign itself is made up of four huge modules.

You only personally control one person, so a party could work. I guess there will just be more critters to compensate. I'd get into the single-person gameplay structure more, but I don't want to cannibalize on an upcoming NWN piece we're doing in the mag.

The pacing is more like BG2. Chapter 1 is a lot like Chapter 2 from BGII. A big city, with one main quest, and a shitload of sidequests.

My mainmainmain game is a Chaotic Good Half-Elf Fighter, Scooterina Slasha. I also have some progress with Tree Hugger, my Chaotic Neutral Elf Druid. For kicks, I made Chaotic Neutral Dwarf Cleric Buddy Christ, and Lawful Evil Elf Monk Dolly Llama. I'll fiddle with wonkier class/race combos, as 3E will let me.

Thieves are viable. There's a shitload of traps and locked chests, and they can mess around with some pretty fancy traps. The new Feats system gives them more combat options, so they can hold their own in a fight, if need be.

Occasionally, you can resolve things without combat. Either stealing or talking your way past stuff. Though, the core is still old-school, traditional KILLKILLKILL.

[Anonymous]

"My mainmainmain game is a Chaotic Good Half-Elf Fighter, Scooterina Slasha. I also have some progress with Tree Hugger, my Chaotic Neutral Elf Druid. For kicks, I made Chaotic Neutral Dwarf Cleric Buddy Christ, and Lawful Evil Elf Monk Dolly Llama. I'll fiddle with wonkier class/race combos, as 3E will let me."

Surely this man is gay. No?

[Thierry Nguyen]

Manchild is a more accurate term.

[Anonymous]

Jesus! You know the last time two times I was this psyched about a game, the results were dismal. Those games were Anarchy Online and Black & White. The former was unplayable due to bugs/bandwidth, and the latter was so boring after one or two days that I thought about selling my computer. Allow me to emphasize my feelings with this: :cry:

So, I'm really happy to hear another good report from someone who has actually played. The beta seems to have been extremely well guarded. Hmmmm....its almost like even Qt3 was sabotaged during the beta. Here is some more emphasis: :x

Oh, one other thing. Where's this guy: :twisted: ?
Wumpus has to be around somewhere

[Troy S Goodfellow]

Thierry:

How is the combat difficulty? Does the game balance the tank vs. spell-dude well? How is the path-finding?

TSG

[Anonymous]

Here is another question: How does the combat stack up against Freedom Force? I'm really digging Freedom Force's physics, and the ability to beat anyone over the head with anything I pick up. I realize I'll be saying goodbye to this feature in NWN, but does the NWN combat hold up otherwise? I figure the spell casting will be as fun as the hero abilities in NWN, because that always seemed so central in Baldur's Gate II. Then again, in BGII and in FF you are controlling a party which gives a lot more choices.

Also, I should add, I really hope NWN combat and the game overall is more fun than Dungeon Siege. That game was mind numbingly boring. I know the common belief was that DS gameplay was somewhere between Diablo II and BGII, but I have to disagree. DS is completely in Diablo territory, but goes too far. Intead of the thrill that clicking monsters grants an illusion of actual ass-whupping, DS takes away even that part of the fun. Instead you generally click ahead of the party and they go into battle and you sort of just, well, watch. Ugh. I am so glad that FF came out at the same time as DS. Please tell me NWN is all that and a bag of chips (Salt & Vinegar).

[Murph]

Neverwinter Nights is all that, a bag of chips, AND a coke. No kidding.

Combat seems very silmilar to Baldur's Gate, to me, except that you just have yourself, and maybe a henchman/familiar/summoned creature, none of whom you directly control. (Well, you can possess your familiar, but that's it.) Still, it seems to be very engaging, to me. And, fortunately, combat seems to be less of a focus (though still a big focus) than previous RPGs.

[Ben Sones]

Here is another question: How does the combat stack up against Freedom Force?

It is almost nothing like Freedom Force, so if you are looking for a similar game, it may not be the game for you. The combat seems quite good--as a previous poster said, similar to Baldur's Gate, but with just one character to control (which personally, I prefer). The radial menu is a bit clunky to use in the heat of battle unless you pause a lot (particularly if you are a spellcaster), but once you get a bunch of actions set up on your quick bar, all is well.

The game is also not much like Dungeon Siege, which was really just a tactical combat game in a not-very-interesting fantasy wrapper. The controls are a bit more complex than Dungeon Siege's, but the game also does a lot more. NWN focuses more on story (at least the solo game does--if you make your own modules, they can focus on whatever you want).

I like it. A lot. What's more, I've been spending much time fiddling with the beta toolset, and I'm convinced that making and running modules is going to be a blast.

Token emoticon: :shock:

[Martinez]

I wonder if I can re-do Pool of Radiance: Ruins of Myth Drannor. I do have the P&P module for it. Hmmm. :wink:

[Alan Au]

That'd be funny. I daresay it'd be superior to the current incarnation. I'm contemplating doing a BG mod myself, or if I'm feeling really wacky, System Shock. :P

- Alan

[Murph]

I just wanna know how easy (or not) it's going to be to add a disguise skill...

[Anonymous]

And how dopplegangers work.

I'm really interested to see how the game works out as a whole. What I mean is, beyond the original campaign (which seems to be getting high marks), the game will largely consist of the 'amature' designer (DM), putting together modules of varying size and quality, without the trappings of playtesting that we're used to seeing in all the games we play. Without a small army of people spending months to see whether the game is balanced and paced just right, what will happen? I'm curious, as a player, what it will be like to fire up the game, go on the net, and then look through the list of possible modules to join. Half the adventure will be seeing how good/bad/indifferent/minimalist/intricate/humdrum/innovative all these modules will be.

Two sidenotes:
1. Of course, it all depends on the DM client. If it stinks, then all bets are off because DMs won't be able to have fun. And why else run a module?

2. The above scenario does not cover what many people plan on doing: playing with friends.

And here is a smiley face: :lol:

[Murph]

Well, I've certainly gotten the impression that you could download available modules, too. Not every game has to be run by a live DM, so if that's bothering you, I'm sure you'll be able to find downloadable modules that have gotten good ratings.

And based on all I've heard, the dev tools are completely idiot-proof, so I wouldn't worry about too many sucky user-created modules.

And, Bioware is currently planning on creating modules and running them, too. When you go to join a server, now (in the beta), there are choices for "Action," "Role-Playing," "Hack-and-Slash," and others. The other day, I even saw one for persistent worlds. It sounds like it'll be easy to find just the modules you're looking for.

[Tyjenks]

You'd think I had neveer posted to msg. boards before!

[Tyjenks]

I am excited about this game and for Father's day I may possibly get it from my one year old. However, she has also stated that Morrowind "doesn't look too damn bad either, daddy!"

I realize they are completely different RPG's, but if you only had to get one because of money or, more importantly, time constraints which would it be?

[Murph]

I'm curious to hear what those who have played both have to say, too.

I opted for Neverwinter Nights, as I basically had to choose, but my poor aging system wouldn't run Morrowind, I don't think. That might have tipped the scales.

I will say, based on the beta, that NWN may be as close to the perfect RPG that we've seen yet, and I'd recommend it to anyone based on the beta.

[Alan Au]

Between the NWN Aurora editor and the UT2003 editor, it's really looking like the technology has progressed to the point where people can start focusing on creating mod content instead of mod technology. Yay! Content is good!

Of course, idiot-proofing is pretty hard. I mean, there are some really idiotic people out there.

- Alan

[Ben Sones]

And based on all I've heard, the dev tools are completely idiot-proof, so I wouldn't worry about too many sucky user-created modules.

Well... it is really easy to use, at least at the basic level (if you want to create your own scripts or custom tilesets, it gets more complex). But it doesn't guarantee that what you make with it is going to be good. No fault of BioWare's, since I can't imagine how it could. As with any tabletop game, having a good module and a good DM are key.

I expect to see many sucky user-created modules. Also many good ones. Since I plan to create and run my own, it doesn't matter to me either way.

[Murph]

Fair enough...I guess the most fool-proof tools can't make up for a horribly bad design.

Ben, remind me to get the info to play your servers, 'cause I'll bet you come up with some really good stuff.

[Anonymous]

Add me to the list of people really impressed with Neverwinter Nights so far. After having played what can only be described as "a whole lot" of Morrowind between the PC and Xbox versions, I was actually a bit worried that I'd be going out of the frying pan and into the fire with this one. To my surprise, the gameplay of Neverwinter Nights is just plain fun. (Not to say Morrowind isn't fun, but Morrowind did feel like work sometimes.) It's briskly paced, the combat is excellent (probably somewhere between BG2 and Freedom Force combat), the story seems good, and the interface is extremely well done. I've mostly just been trying different character classes in the single-player campaign so far (all seem very distinct and interesting), and am concentrating on getting through the campaign before delving too much into the toolset stuff (I don't want all the monsters and scenery spoiled for me). Anyway, the game's given me a great first impression based on the first 20 hours of play. I'm really impressed at how accessible this game is. Seems like something that could be recommended to anyone, without any of the caveats normally associated with RPGs.

[Anonymous]

Geesh Thierry, that is the shortest first impressions ever over on Gamers.com. Throw us a friggen bone dude!

[Anonymous]

Me too. I'm halfway through the second chapter now (I'm a completist about these things, so I do a LOT of side quests). So far, it's RPG of the year for me. That's a big "so far" because I'm only one solid weekend into it, maybe 15-20 hours.

It's less tedious than Morrowind and better written as well. Of course, without the complete open-endedness, that's probably easier to do. The storyline is good, particularly once you get near the end of Chapter 1. It's more briskly paced than the Baldur's Gate games, maybe because you only control one character.

The game is meant for you to take on a hireling to round out your capabilities. If you're a wizard, you'll want a tank hireling or maybe a thief if you're going to summon tanks with spells. The hireling AI is pretty good - you never control them at all, but they do what needs doing mostly when it needs it. And you can always talk to them to adjust their settings (how low your HP should go before they heal, whether they should try to open locks/traps or not, if they should use missile or melee weapons, etc.).

The interface is the best I've seen for a game of this complexity - there's a lot of stuff, but nothing the quickbar can't solve.

But the gameplay is just plain fun. There are fun places to visit, fun people to talk to, fun little things to do (I own a bar now because I won some tough arena fighting!). Despite being tile based I'm surprised that not every place just looks and feels the same.

[Murph]

I was happy to finally figure out how to get my hireling to quit breaking down all the locked doors at the inn and bars, just because I checked to see if they were locked. People don't like that, y'know?

[Tyjenks]

I have heard and read enough positives and decided to go ahead and pre-order at my local EB and wait 'til later for Morrowind. No doubt I would enjoy either, but only time enough for one and my current Heroes IV addiction.

If it less than stellar, however, I am holding each one of you personally responsible for giving out favorable early impressions. I am currently, and I would say rightfully, interpreting said statements as the equivalent of future 90 -100 % review scores. After all, those "first-look", "hands-on" early impressions given in all but the worst of today's gaming publications are allllllllllways (*cough*, *cough*) dead on are they not?

[GMicek]

I have heard and read enough positives and decided to go ahead and pre-order at my local EB and wait 'til later for Morrowind. No doubt I would enjoy either, but only time enough for one and my current Heroes IV addiction.

I think you've made a good choise. Morrowind is good and all but it can be a bit of a headache because of the power you need to really let it shine. There are parts in Morrowind that really start to crawl, even on great machines, and that can really hurt the overall experience. NWN might have the same issues (i havnt read anything about the game, and only saw it briefly at E3), but i kind of doubt it.

[TomChick]

NWN is *much* friendlier to older machines than Morrowind. And I think you're safe pre-ordering it. It's a no-brainer to predict NWN is going to be a darling of reviewers. But unlike Dungeon Siege and Black & White, I can't see many people taking issue with the critical praise.

-Tom, still mucking about in Chapter Two

[Murph]

Neverwinter Nights runs like a dream on my machine, and it's...aging. I'm just a couple of weeks (due to existing RAM issues...Like, I haven't gotten some that works, yet, so I'm ordering from Crucial next week) from running an Athlon XP 1800, but in the meantime, I'm on a K6-2 450 machine with a GeForce2 Ti card, and it's smooth as buttah.

My system specs are, in fact, the only reason I didn't get Morriwind back when it first came out, but I think I'd be abandoning it for NWN anyway.

[Anonymous]

Question:

I just preordered it at Ebx, and the guy gave me a disk with the toolset. Is this the real toolset? Or the Beta (which I already have)? Does this disk give you everything?

[Mark Asher]

It's the beta toolset. The real one is included in the game.

[Anonymous]

Anyone experienced any technical difficulties with the game? I experienced none for the first 15-20 hours, then it crashed once, and now it's crashing on me constantly, every 5-15 minutes. Really frustrating. Sometimes it just reboots my computer out of the blue. The crashes seem to occur when the CPU is working heavily, such as during loading times or hectic battles. Other times it happens just randomly.

It's really weird... I'm more inclined to blame my system than the game for the moment. It's not a scripting bug, because the problem's followed me from chapter one into chapter two.

Maybe my machine's overheating... I moved it from my floor to inside my computer desk, and the problem cropped up at around that time. I'll move it back out tonight and see if that doesn't magically solve everything. Anyway, just wondering if it's crashed on any of ya'll who've been lucky enough to get a head start on playing.

[Murph]

I've had some strange crashes in the beta, which may be a system issue as much as game problems on my end, too...I just barely meet the minimum requirements, so it's hard to say. Most of the real "bugs" in the beta have been repeatable, and there's no consisitency as to when it may crash. (Usually, it's at the worst possible moment...like when I'm teleporting back to the Hall of Justice to take Aribeth the last ingredient needed to end the quest for the cure. :? )

All in all, though, the beta is more stable than a lot of games when they ship, so I'm not TOO worried. Sucks that it's crashing on you a lot, though.

When it does crash, though, it seems to freeze my machine, so that nothing short of cutting the power will do anything at all. That sucks.

[Anonymous]

Ugh. That summons images of my unhandled exception errors from Diablo II. I hope you can fix it Greg. My preordered invisible version of NWN seems to be working just fine at the moment. :)

[Anonymous]

I'm not really concerned that it's a problem with the game. The game's so good so far that I can't help but pin the blame on my system. It's like something out of Your Friends and Neighbors. "Is it me...? It's me, right?"

I just need to get this matter fixed so I can keep plowing through. And plowing through is a pretty good way of describing it, actually. This isn't slow going. One really nice aspect of the single-player game is that so far there's absolutely zero pointless wandering. You get the equivalent of an unlimited Town Portal scroll right at the beginning, so if you're so inclined, you can quickly teleport back to base, sell stuff, get healed, solve major quests, etc. There's enough to do in the game that none of the gameplay needs to be padded with travel times and so forth. The environments are done up interestingly enough that going out of your way to explore them is suitably fun.

[mtkafka]

Wow it sounds like NWN is more in tune with Diablo than the BG games... based on all the porting and selling and potions and stuff. Is it that far off to say that this game plays like a DnD version of Diablo?

Not that I really mind... Bioware has failed to dissapoint me. Though I'd rather they offered a first person view approach. DMing players in first person would be ... just great.

etc

[Murph]

I don't think so, mtkafka. It plays a lot like the Baldur's Gate games -- you wouldn't have to tell me that Bioware made it, 'cause there's no mistaking their work -- but there is that added feature of being able to teleport back to the temple at any time, and you can respawn almost anytime you die (there are a few exceptions, I understand) at the temple, but for a price.

Other than that, it's exactly like a prettier version of Baldur's Gate, 'cept you're by yourself and it's 3rd Ed. rules...So I guess it's not that much like Baldur's Gate, except in spirit.

[mtkafka]

You got the game already Murph? Bastard. It seems all you people have it already. Pretty unfair you know? You all should wait like the rest of us losers. Well I'll get it soon, like Wednesday most possibly. Then I'll feel equal.

etc

[Murph]

I was in on the beta. Haven't got the retail version yet, either, but I expect it any day now. :D

[Ben Sones]

Is it that far off to say that this game plays like a DnD version of Diablo?

Yeah, it's pretty far off. Aside from the fact that both are single-character RPGs, there is little similarity. The combat is much like the Baldur's Gate games--phased, turn-based combat in real-time. Like past BioWare games, it's less frantic and more tactical (you can still pause the game, although there is less need to do so with only a single character to control). The game also focuses less on combat than Diablo does, with a much larger emphasis on conversations, puzzle-solving and the like. Essentially, think Baldur's Gate with one character.

[Tom Ohle]

If only so that I can be an asshole DM and drop Balors all over my players.

I've never heard of anyone doing that. Or wait. Have I? :twisted:

[Anonymous]

By the way, those who were wondering about whether or not we'll see a lot of single-player module creation...

In the August issue of CGM, our good buddy Tom here (Ohle, not Chick) wrote a tutorial for building a little single-player module from scratch. Just an outdoor area in the rain with a ranger that talks to you linked to a dungeon area with a few encounters, doors, and a boss fight.

It's got an NPC conversation where she even addresses you differently if you're an Elf, a custom skeleton boss with a custom flaming sword, three monster encounters, a custom book at the end of the dungeon...

The whole tutorial assumes you don't know a thing about the game or toolset and are going to do everything from scratch. I just went through it with the final game. Clicked the icon and 50 minutes later I was playing the finished product.

Granted, it's not terribly sophisticated, but it was damn easy. It would take 20 minutes if I knew my way around the toolset and wasn't trying to read the magazine pages at the same time. There are cool wizards for making creatures, items, conversation trees, etc. It's all really rather simple.

Based on that experience, I can safely say that we'll see a metric buttload of user-made modules that are fully playable all by your lonesome with no DM. Now, they might not all be GOOD, but apparently the NWN community site is going to have user voting on these things or something like that.

[Tyjenks]

I can safely say that we'll see a metric buttload of user-made modules


That sounds like a lot more than I assumed there would be. I was expecting more in the realm of a small shitload.

[Anonymous]

I'm sitting here at work, waiting till closing time. At the Babbages downtown, my preordered copy of Neverwinter is sitting in a box, packed in with all of it's friends. It's calling out to me, I can feel it.

"James," It whispers, "Where are you? It's so dark and crowded in here. Please... come get me. I need to be played! Must I sit here forever enduring this shrink-wrapped existence? You need to take me home, and thumb through my manual. Install me! Install me!"

So I sit here, with another four hours to go until closing-time, waiting. Four more hours, I hope I can make it.

- James :?

[Anonymous]

James, you nailed it. My copy is sitting 2 feet away in a drawer. I MUST GO INSTALL! 27 minutes to go...

[Anonymous]

Update:

During my lunch, I raced across town to pick up my copy of NWN, so I wouldn't have to stop on my way home. Now it's locked up tight in my car.

Unfortunately, the voice has gotten louder and more demanding... also it's now suggesting that I should quit my job.

[Sparky]

Did anyone else open up the box, grab the cloth map, yell "Oh, LOOK! It came with a HANKIE!" and pretend to blow their nose in it?

I guess not.

Speaking of said map/hankie/potential g-string, could they not think of something more clever to name the seedy tavern and haunted forest than "Seedy Tavern" and "Haunted Forest"?

[Sparky]

Oops, double post. If only I were a 5th level wizard, I could cast a Reversus Postus Multiplicando (1d4 points of Intelligence damage/level).

[Murph]

I have a preordered copy...somewhere. I expected it to be here today, but it wasn't. My best friend got his today, though...How unfair...

Tomorrow, maybe?

[mtkafka]

HAHA betaboy. :lol: I got mine, and its the fullversion! So far I'm still on the prelude. Not much else to say. oh, I did some of the toolset, very cool and easy.

etc

[Tyjenks]

Did anyone else open up the box, grab the cloth map, yell "Oh, LOOK! It came with a HANKIE!" and pretend to blow their nose in it?

I thought is was a pajmina(sp?) for my cat.

[Bub, Andrew]

Did anyone else open up the box, grab the cloth map, yell "Oh, LOOK! It came with a HANKIE!" and pretend to blow their nose in it?

That's a good one Sparky. Man, I've got cloth maps dating back to Ultima 4 for the Apple II and this is the most pathetic extra I've ever seen. Maybe if I fold it and then laminate it I can make a jewel case out of it?

[Tom Ohle]

No! No jewel cases allowed.

[Bub, Andrew]

No! No jewel cases allowed.

LOL. Pity, the BG series used such nice cases. Hey, it's how I store them and now it's going to look like my copy of NWN is pirated... or budget. Still, what's up with that map though man? My toilet paper is made of higher material quality than that thing!

[Jaysun]

I am excited about this game and for Father's day I may possibly get it from my one year old. However, she has also stated that Morrowind "doesn't look too damn bad either, daddy!"

I realize they are completely different RPG's, but if you only had to get one because of money or, more importantly, time constraints which would it be?

Hands down, I'll go with Morrowind.

I'm really disappointed with Neverwinter Nights.

[Tom Ohle]

Still, what's up with that map though man? My toilet paper is made of higher material quality than that thing!
Yeah well... .... well... phht.

heh. Nah, seriously... I'm not overly excited about the map, but there's only so much you can do when you switch publishers 5 months before release. I guess.

[Bub, Andrew]

[quote] but there's only so much you can do when you switch publishers 5 months before release. I guess.

Yeah, that's what I figured too. It doesn't matter anyway, the game is slick man, real well put together. The manual is decent too. I'm having that video/sound stutter problem but oddly I can replay them smoothly in the MOVIE option in the menu. Is that odd or what? I wonder what that could be....

Get on that for me Tom.

[Tyjenks]

Of course, not much more would fit in my tiny little environmentally-correct box.

I mean where is my flier for the new BGI and II plus expansions collector's, GOTY, Gold, super special guild membership edition.